# Father and son pitbull wont stop fighting, please help :(



## bLaZiNJaTT (Aug 30, 2009)

Hey, i have a father who is 7 years old and a son pitbull who is about 16 months old. For about 11-12 months both of these dogs were perfect together no matter if i left them alone or not etc. Both dogs are uneuntered and honestly not planning to have either neutered. Now basically the little one gives this distinct look which causes them instantly to fight for dominance. They go on walks perfectly fine but has soon as they enter the household , even the yard , the little pup starts growling and instantly both attack each other. I myself can handle the situation but i am never around 24/7 and the rest of the household find it incredibly tuff to pull them apart when they fight. I tried all week tli fix this but the puppy always starts the fight by growling and they latch onto each other in seconds. This is very stressful on the family and no one wants to give the puppy up or rehome it. First they would only fight once a day. Now as soon as the puppy sees the father he growls and the fight starts. I am very scared of them hurting each other deeply, my next thoughts are muzzling and a shock collar for the puppy to help them get along. At the moment i have to separate them in different rooms which is very hard on the family . Please help i am desperate for answers


----------



## BCdogs (May 30, 2014)

You have two intact bull breeds of the same sex, one coming into maturity. This is perfectly normal behaviour. Pit Bulls and other bull breeds can be dog aggressive, many will show varying degrees of dog intolerance. All you can do is manage it by keeping them separated.


----------



## Goemon (Jun 27, 2012)

Welcome to the world of owning ApBT's. 
Contrary to what Ceasar says, dog aggression cannot be trained out of them. 
True pit dogs are NEVER trained to fight...it is natural, and to punish them for it is a form of cruelty. 

You have two choices: 1) get rid of one, or 2) keep them separate and crate and rotate. 
You have no other options. 

Don't try and play Ceasar and set you and your dogs up for failure.


----------



## Goemon (Jun 27, 2012)

Oh, and fixing them won't change a thing. Other breeds, maybe, but not pit dogs. 

Rumor has it, but has never been proven, that fixing them can take away gameness.


----------



## dogma (Aug 3, 2015)

Agree with the rest, separate them and keep them separated. FYI: using a shock collar on the pup will likely increase his aggression, not stop it.


----------



## bLaZiNJaTT (Aug 30, 2009)

? i understand everyone is saying to crate and rotate , but the father has never even had to have a collar on since he was such a good dog. So basically they will never ever get along again? Since he is still a puppy, wont this change over time? Should i not try the muzzle ? Thanks for the replies and help


----------



## Goemon (Jun 27, 2012)

bLaZiNJaTT said:


> ? i understand everyone is saying to crate and rotate , but the father has never even had to have a collar on since he was such a good dog. So basically they will never ever get along again? Since he is still a puppy, wont this change over time? Should i not try the muzzle ? Thanks for the replies and help


No, they will never be safe around one another. 
Muzzling can actually hurt a dog determined to get another. They will still want to fight.

Neither dog is being "bad" here, either. It is bullldog nature101 to want to get another dog. 
The ApBT's mentality is, after all, "there can be only one."


----------



## DickyT (Jan 29, 2014)

bLaZiNJaTT said:


> ? i understand everyone is saying to crate and rotate , but the father has never even had to have a collar on since he was such a good dog. So basically they will never ever get along again? Since he is still a puppy, wont this change over time? Should i not try the muzzle ? Thanks for the replies and help


This is genetics at play, not something that is trainable. Not all ABPT these days will be dog aggressive, with the exception of tight circles the breed has become watered down from where it used to be.

But if you have one that is dog aggressive, the best you can do is manage the situation. Pit bulls are not pack dogs, they do not need other dogs as friends. Their human companions are enough 'friends' for them.


----------



## Odie (Jan 21, 2016)

I know that it sounds cliche but crate and rotate. My dogs are fixed, lived together for awhile and they still get into it.


----------



## Goemon (Jun 27, 2012)

DickyT said:


> This is genetics at play, not something that is trainable. Not all ABPT these days will be dog aggressive, with the exception of tight circles the breed has become watered down from where it used to be.
> 
> But if you have one that is dog aggressive, the best you can do is manage the situation. Pit bulls are not pack dogs, they do not need other dogs as friends. Their human companions are enough 'friends' for them.


There is a saying, "great minds think alike." Your second paragraph is a point blank look at the truth.

You also pointed out another fact: most of the "nice" pitbulls portrayed in the media are actually nothing like the real ApBT. 
There are more watered down dogs today than the traditional type. The same cold dogs culled in former times, as being cold is a fault in the breed. 
(Sure, some pit dogs did get along with other dogs, outside of the [], but that is the exception, not the rule. Yet, if another dog attacked them, they'd want to kill the attacker!) 
One old timer who has been out of the dogs for years told me he wished the breed had gone extinct than to become what they have today, and to fall into the hands of (I'll sugarcoat his words here) modern softies who know nothing of true pit dogs. 
In his mind, he thinks these dogs need to be saved from the hands of those who "think" they are reaching these dogs from a miserable life. 
Contrary to what the modern generation thinks, true pit dogs loved fighting and thought they were winning, even if the rest of the world thought they were losing. 
I did have to remind him that, as a matter of fact, there are human scum who think they are dogmen, who really do use the media description of how they "train their dogs to fight." 
Fact is, if you have to train a dog to fight, you already know you have a cur dog, as gameness, the true core of the ApBT, is born, not made, through genetics. 
But gameness has nothing to do with aggression: aggression is the ticket to the dance; gameness is the final song of that dance. They have to make it to the last song for it to be seen.

As for the OP, it seems they assume it can be fixed. It cannot. It is NOT a fault, not a bad thing, for this breed to be dominant. 
ApBT's are like solo gunslingers.....they do not ride in gangs. First hint of false pit dogs is when you read of a pack attacking. 
Even dogs I have had that did get along, if one showed any aggression, at animals or humans, it was showtime.....

Idk if the OP is like this, but some modern owners think it is a fault, and that it can be corrected, when a dog shows aggression. 
I have stated many times, to punish a dog for its natural tendencies is abuse. To get rid of a dog for this is a betrayal of the dog. Aggression may be offensive to humans, but never to ApBT's!!

DickyT is correct here, though: human companionship is all an ApBT needs. Having a doggy friend for their pet is an insane line of reasoning. 
Also, just because dogs are related, it doesn't mean a thing. 
Some litters need to be separated as early as six weeks of age, to prevent them from killing each other. 
I still have photos of pups fighting each other the day they opened their eyes.

People who cannot accept this need to either learn to live with it, or choose another breed of dog.


----------



## Blossom01 (Nov 8, 2014)

bLaZiNJaTT said:


> ? i understand everyone is saying to crate and rotate , but the father has never even had to have a collar on since he was such a good dog. So basically they will never ever get along again? Since he is still a puppy, wont this change over time? Should i not try the muzzle ? Thanks for the replies and help


The one dog hasn't ever even had a collar on?

You want to try a muzzle?

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'm really unsure of your ability to manage two dogs of any breed. Two males will often try to fight, I don't care what the breed is.

No, I don't think you'll ever be able to run them together. This can be managed, but it is not for everyone. If you can't do it correctly, you are dooming yourselves but especially the dogs to a pretty miserable life.

You should really try to re-home one and stick to one dog. Period.


----------



## Goemon (Jun 27, 2012)

Blossom01 said:


> You should really try to re-home one and stick to one dog. Period.


If the OP understands the facts, there is no need to re-home.

Remember, most of America today is misinformed about the breed, and 99% of modern authors don't have a clue of what they speak of.

To get rid of one of them, for this reason, is forsaking one of the dogs, betraying it. 
Neither dog is at fault here. The owner may just have been misguided about the breed.

However, your advice would be great in the ears of any who now only have one. 
The "pretend-a-bulls" being mislabeled as pit dogs today are the cause of much of the problem.

If you are familiar with me, to most I come across as cold and too direct. 
However, the OP is seeking answers, honestly, and is listening, so shouldn;t be rebuked for this issue they are having.

What they mean by no collar is that the dog, previously, never had an issue, when it was alone.

You are mistaken in one aspect, though: for true ApBT's, sex doesn't matter!
I have a bitch that wants to kill any and all dogs, of any sex, even if in heat! 
I know a littermate to one of my males, who, even if a bitch is in heat, still wants to kill her. He may never be able to be bred (naturally, at least) , since he is so fight-crazy.

The OP can either separate them, or, as you say, get rid of one. You are correct there, though: many cannot handle seeing a true dog fight. They are weak souls. 
Their minds cannot be changed, just as the breed, at its heart, cannot be changed!


----------

