# HELP - pregnant abpt???



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

Ill try not to ramble....

I've moved into a house with a Johnson's bull dog male and an abpt that is female. The female was overweight when I moved in, Jbd is a healthy weight.

About 2 wks after I moved in, abpt went on heat and about a week later I witnessed them mating but it only lasted about a minute and they didn't lock. These dogs are left unsupervised for 8hrs a day and overnight though. I also witnessed her being unwilling for the Jbd to mount her. This all occurred on 14 March.

A week ago they got into a fight over food and both dogs sustained cuts to the neck. JBD initiated the fight as he tried to eat hers after finishing his, we now feed them seperately. The abpt owner refused to take her to the vet as the vet is on holiday and knows this abpt he fears that a new random vet may force him to have her pups aborted, due to the fact shes wounded and pregnant (laws here dont permit breeding of abpt but this particular vet said hed allow her to have one litter before speyinh. Luckily all their wounds have mostly healed and there is no sign of infection. Abpt sleeps inside on a mattress in my room now and is kept seperate from abpt apart from the above mentioned 8hrs per day where we must work and can't keep the APBT inside. They have gotten along fine since. Owner says he'll build a fence to seperate the yards but he's a great procrastinator

How do I know if she's pregnant? She is being more affectionate and is cleaning herself a lot, I'm feeding her extra dry food which she snacks on during the day and sometimes she gets mince at night. She also gets vitamins and i ensured she gets a low dose (5mg) due to the levels of calcium required for a pregnant dog as it says on the label. I noticed her tits were swelling about a week ago but they seem to have gone down now. She is also farting a LOT more than normal?!?! Around her vulva looks swollen similar to when she was on heat. The vet gets back in 10 days but I want answers now so I can ensure she gets the best possible care in the meantime. I'm prepared to take time off work when she is ready to be due and have witnessed and helped rear kelpie x staffy pups before - but I moved into that house the week before she gave birth so have no idea about prenatal care.

Finally, abpt doesn't get exercise and is overweight so it's hard to tell if anything is forming. I can commit to exercising her for an hour 4 x a week. The owners excuse for not walking her is that traffic freaks her out but I could easily walk her around side streets. JBD gets walked regularly hence he's in good shape. 

Any help/advice would be appreciated, please try not to be too judgemental about the owner as the main focus should be on the health of the dog as I'm prepared to do whatever I can to ensure she receives the best care.


----------



## Princesspaola21 (Oct 30, 2012)

Wow. So just out of curiosity since you say the male is yours but the female isn't why didn't you step up and at the very least be responsible for your own dog. These dogs should never be left alone unattended with other dogs. Why didnt you kennel yours why you were gone? What would you have done if that APBT would've killed your dog? Because yea that can happen. Not to mention now she's gonna have to go through having a litter of mutt puppies. The best thing to have done would've been taking her to the vet and having her aborted and spayed. Pups are A LOT of work. I know because I have 3 and it takes up a good portion of my day. Who's gonna take care of this litter of pups for the 8 hours a day that nobody is home? Are you gonna seperate them now? Because you definitely can't leave a male, a female, and a litter of pups alone together in a house all day. That's way past irresponsible.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## aimee235 (Apr 29, 2007)

They said both dogs were a roommates. Not theirs.

Don't give her a bunch of food if she is already overweight. Don't do a bunch of exercise if she is not used to it. Just short walks or a little fetch in the yard and build up until she is more fit. 

She might be pregnant she might not. It would be best to have her spayed. If it is illegal to breed them where you are from what are the ramifications if you do? Does the dog get taken? Do the puppies get put down? Owners fined? Jail time?

The vet can do ex rays to tell if she is pregnant. I say treat her normally and convince your friend to get her altered.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

Yes just to confirm the JBD is not mine, he belongs to a different housemate. I have no pets.

I'm unsure of the legal ramifications re breeding, she is registered as a staffy though - not sure what that difference makes.


----------



## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

There are as many moral/ethical ramifications with casual, ill-informed breeding as there are legal, I'd imagine. There is no reason to breed these two dogs. None. And especially not to deny the female vet care during a potential pregnancy. I honestly hope that she is not pregnant and your roommate can see his way to getting her altered.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

I concur.

She will see the vet next week. I don't see my housemate permitting an abortion so it is up to me and my motherly instinct to do the best I can. Ill try to go to the bet with the owner to absorb advice - however I'm already in the bad books for 'interfering'

Finance isn't a problem and I can alter my work hours and work nights instead of days so that there's always someone home to monitor them 24/7.


----------



## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

I would try to find some research and see if they are receptive to you giving it to them. Traffic may freak the pup out but the only way yo get her used to is it to take her slowly and controlled near traffic so they know its OK.

I also agree with the spay. Whats the reason why she isn't already? Do you know what the roommate feels about it?


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

Owner and vet agreed that she would be spayed after her first litter. This was before laws came into place banning abpts from breeding.


----------



## surfer (Feb 20, 2013)

here we go again, now she has the litter of pups, what happens to the ones she cant keep??????????????????
1.over a bridge in a burlap sack
2.a 22 bullet to the back of the head[probly the fastest and most humane way]
3. drop off at humane society, where they're kept on a concrete slab 3-7 days alone and scared before they get the needle.

now please tell me something about being a responsible dog owner.
best thing is to never have let them been bred.

THATS THE COLD HARD FACTS ABOUT BREEDING DOGS.

unless, you have a purpose forthe breeding, and made sure of the placement of the litter BEFORE you even breed, then DONT breed


----------



## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

fifthflo said:


> Owner and vet agreed that she would be spayed after her first litter. This was before laws came into place banning abpts from breeding.


why do they want to have a litter of mutts? So weird, usually vets are not for breeding mutts.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

I think the original intention was to breed with another abpt

Luckily numerous people have expressed interest in the ' mutts ' so I don't think we'll have problems finding them good homes.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

surfer said:


> here we go again, now she has the litter of pups, what happens to the ones she cant keep??????????????????
> 1.over a bridge in a burlap sack
> 2.a 22 bullet to the back of the head[probly the fastest and most humane way]
> 3. drop off at humane society, where they're kept on a concrete slab 3-7 days alone and scared before they get the needle.
> ...


If you don't have something helpful to say then refrain.

I'm merely trying my best to make the best of a situation I don't have much control over.

Ftr, in australia cross breeds are common and well liked. I'd never kill a puppy, we don't carry guns nor do I believe that is more humane than a simple needle. These pups may not be pure breds but they will be loved, fed and medically attended to. My housemates and I am networked in amongst a huge array of people, the pups are half sold before they're born.

Thanks to those who bothered to read my OP and respond accordingly.


----------



## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

I think what surfer was getting at is we have tons of these dogs in the states getting killed. Maybe you sont have that problem where you are. I thought the pit bull was banned there though? Dogs bred accidentally and without a purpose are whats filling up shelters and being killed left and right. There is no need for quotes around mutts that's what they are. My dog is a mutt nothing wrong with mutts. It's breeding to produce mutts that's the problem. People say they wants homes now and then their landlord has another idea and the dog is shuffled around and end up being PTS. I don't take too well to people who have oops litters that could be avoided with responsible managing their bitch especially while in heat. Just want you to see the bigger picture.

Sent from Petguide.com App


----------



## surfer (Feb 20, 2013)

i agree with ames, there is already an over abundance of 'pit bull type' dogs around. 
if your telling me most of the litter is sold, over here they could have gone to any shelter and got what they wanted. you wouldnt have needed to breed your dogs and could have saved some that are doomed anyway.

dont know if you been around many rescues, but they are one apprecitive animal.
thats all i was sayin. 

over here go to just about any shelter and the 'pit bull type' are the most in there.


----------



## welder (Jan 25, 2013)

somthins fishy smellin.a few statements aint jiving to me.banned breeding #1 was gonna breed w/another apbt #2. you can take care of pups that aint yours #3. BUT you couldnt stop an oops breedin #4.You dont no fer sure it's pregnant#5. you hav an answer for evr piece of advice these folks hav given u.mayb i aint readin yall rite,my 2 cents dont matter but i think yall F'd up and want your ego stroked a bit.good god amighty you r an adult aint u? use your head and do the rite thing your common sence should hav kicked in by now.surfer's jus being honest with you and fairly diplomatic(10 dollar word) i mite add.you can say it 25 different ways but at the end of the day it's the same.so when you ask for advise NUT UP and take the good with the bad.


----------



## Princesspaola21 (Oct 30, 2012)

welder said:


> somthins fishy smellin.a few statements aint jiving to me.banned breeding #1 was gonna breed w/another apbt #2. you can take care of pups that aint yours #3. BUT you couldnt stop an oops breedin #4.You dont no fer sure it's pregnant#5. you hav an answer for evr piece of advice these folks hav given u.mayb i aint readin yall rite,my 2 cents dont matter but i think yall F'd up and want your ego stroked a bit.good god amighty you r an adult aint u? use your head and do the rite thing your common sence should hav kicked in by now.surfer's jus being honest with you and fairly diplomatic(10 dollar word) i mite add.you can say it 25 different ways but at the end of the day it's the same.so when you ask for advise NUT UP and take the good with the bad.


Is it wrong to say good post?? Because it feels right!

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## welder (Jan 25, 2013)

aw c'mon u gittin on my lingo again?lol


----------



## Princesspaola21 (Oct 30, 2012)

welder said:


> aw c'mon u gittin on my lingo again?lol


No lol I was saying I agreed with everything you said but I'm not sure if I should've.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

I'm not going to waste my time - I CAN see things from your points of view but you seem to forget the specifics of my OP.....they aren't my dogs, abpt owner is waiting for his vet to return from vacation to determine pregnancy, I'm just trying to do the best that I can given the situation I unknowingly walked into. To be perfectly clear I think the abpt owner is highly irresponsible.

Regarding abpt bans and associated laws in Victoria, Australia I'm afraid I merely know what I learned on wiki. I suspect given the rapport developed between vet and owner that the vet may have permitted one litter. Dogs here are registered when they're pups and council reps can't tell the difference between breeds, abpt in question is registered as a staffy.

I have been to an animal shelter once and there were no pitbull type dogs. Perhaps they are far more common in the USA - I'd have to do some research to ascertain.

In hindsight perhaps I should have approached a general dog lover forum instead. As here it seems no matter how honest I am, people are content attacking the problem which gains nothing, instead of offering insight and support where it's needed. With the exception of a couple of members.


----------



## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

fifthflo said:


> I'm not going to waste my time - I CAN see things from your points of view but you seem to forget the specifics of my OP.....they aren't my dogs, abpt owner is waiting for his vet to return from vacation to determine pregnancy, I'm just trying to do the best that I can given the situation I unknowingly walked into. To be perfectly clear I think the abpt owner is highly irresponsible.
> 
> Regarding abpt bans and associated laws in Victoria, Australia I'm afraid I merely know what I learned on wiki. I suspect given the rapport developed between vet and owner that the vet may have permitted one litter. Dogs here are registered when they're pups and council reps can't tell the difference between breeds, abpt in question is registered as a staffy.
> 
> ...


 good for you for trying to do right by the mama and potential pups. And you're right telling you how to fix the problem without giving actual advice you can do is pointless and more for anyone else who might stumble upon the thread. Very interesting about pit bull dogs and them being PTS vs over there. I would be interested in the actual numbers but like you said your friends pup is registered as a staffy so they would be lies

Sorry I don't have any other advice I don't breed so I have no clue.

Sent from Petguide.com App


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

PTS vs over there? What does that mean? 

Ill find some recent stats for you regarding banned breeds and those destroyed in shelters.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

I've learned a lot and now question whether abpt is purebred, Ill be interested to see if my housemate has the required papers to legally register her as a staffy. If so either the documentation is forged or she's part staffy. Going to thoroughly examine her against the criteria the following link refers to.

Department of Primary Industries - Mobile Site

It seems in some states/territories (NT, ACT) owning and breeding APBTs is not illegal - given close proximity from act in particular to other states - it would be easy enough to travel to ACT buy an abpt register it there and drive back to Vic!

I haven't found a stat on the amount of APBTs here - as you've said results won't be accurate anyway due to those keeping them registered as other dogs, those who live in the outback that wouldn't register them at all etc. However I barely see them at parks, beaches or just being walked in general. Same as in New Zealand. American staffys however are VERY popular.


----------



## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

fifthflo said:


> PTS vs over there? What does that mean?
> 
> Ill find some recent stats for you regarding banned breeds and those destroyed in shelters.


Put to sleep versus over there you said you don't have them killed or PTS at the same rate. That's what I meant.

And the American Staffordshire Terrier is becoming more popular is interesting. Has the American Bully craze hit you guys yet?

Sent from Petguide.com App


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

Staffys have always been popular - well in my lifetime anyway. Yet to get reliable stats on euthanasia rates etc, will find something there's a lot of crap to sift through, will do tomorrow.

Bulldogs are rare here, I believe back home in NZ they're the mascot of a predominant gang 'mongrel mob' - and consequently they're tarnished with the same brush as abpts largely appealing to the wrong kind of people.

This is all very educational, I'm fast becoming the person the dogs (abpt mainly) look to for feeding, affection and exercise. Owner doesn't seem to give a rats ass yet he's at his 3yr olds beck and call. Oh I could keep ranting. I'm just frustrated as my options are so limited due to BSL. 10 years ago I just would've fleed state with her, I'm not so portable now!


----------



## angel3115 (Sep 9, 2012)

My boyfriend, who has bred dogs before, says to feel how firm her belly is to see if she's pregnant. If she is, it should be firm, and bigger than it was before. But, if her tits swelled up, then went back down, that could mean she was pregnant, then lost the pups. The swelling isn't supposed to go back down. He also gave his dog beer because he read something that said it was good for pregnant dogs. All I can really say about that is all 3 litters he bred were healthy.


----------



## Princesspaola21 (Oct 30, 2012)

angel3115 said:


> My boyfriend, who has bred dogs before, says to feel how firm her belly is to see if she's pregnant. If she is, it should be firm, and bigger than it was before. But, if her tits swelled up, then went back down, that could mean she was pregnant, then lost the pups. The swelling isn't supposed to go back down. He also gave his dog beer because he read something that said it was good for pregnant dogs. All I can really say about that is all 3 litters he bred were healthy.


Not necessarily. My dogs tits swell when she's in heat. She's had one silent heat where she showed no real symptoms except her tits and back end swelling up.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## angel3115 (Sep 9, 2012)

Princesspaola21 said:


> Not necessarily. My dogs tits swell when she's in heat. She's had one silent heat where she showed no real symptoms except her tits and back end swelling up.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I meant the swelling isn't supposed to go away like that when a dog is pregnant. I could always be wrong, but my boyfriend bred 3 litters, and when I was a kid my dad bred his dog once.


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

So at 5 weeks pregnant I should be able to feel her abdomen/belly as being firm? Ill check when I get home - as I said previously she's overweight so it's harder to tell...


----------



## fifthflo (Apr 15, 2013)

Phew it was a false pregnany, I'm sure avid breeders will be pleased to know there's one less litter of crossbreed pups in the world


----------



## Gonz2288 (Feb 16, 2013)

fifthflo said:


> Phew it was a false pregnany, I'm sure avid breeders will be pleased to know there's one less litter of crossbreed pups in the world


That happened to our first pit bull right after she was spayed.


----------



## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Spay - Abort.. The end.

EDIT: Saw the false pregnancy; Spay.. The end.


----------



## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

Whelping Puppies, Breeding Dogs

Dogs will give birth about 63 days after being bred, so her due date is 6/16/13 give or take a few days. Waiting till she has a litter of pups before being spayed is STUPID and I would find a new vet. I would agree on waiting till she was 2 before spaying her but only for SMART owners who can make sure their dog doesn't get bred. So what's done is done. Another bunch of idiots breeding dogs however I give you kudos for not wanting the female to suffer and have a safe delivery. So look at that link I posted and read about whelping and prenatal care. If you scroll to the bottom of the page there is a lot of pages that just about covers everything in breeding.


----------

