# Bully Haters



## MADBood (May 31, 2008)

Okay, I've been reading alot of threads on here and I see most of you are ADBA standard and biased to that conformation. I'm not trying to piss anyone off, I'm simply just making a valid point here. Alot of you say Bullies are overpriced,ugly and lack drive, that is fine too. You tell us Bully owners that we do not have the right to call our dogs pitbulls. This is where I have a problem. Didn't knowelegable dogmen of earlier times strive to improve thier dogs for bettering of thier purpose? Was the pitbull not a combination of bulldogs(not the present day bulldogs of course) and terriers? Is this not a mixing of two breeds of dog to create a desired strain? Today, that purpose has changed....at least for most of us. Pit Bulldogs were bred for fighting, that was thier purpose then....now the purpose for most of us,anyway, is creating beautiful dogs that make great companions that still have that loyalty and gameness. If UKC and ADBA started revoking papers on bully bred dogs and we were all forced to register them with ABKC.....that would be fine, we would have our own strain, the "AmBully". My dogs are registered as pitbulls through the UKC and ADBA, so I have the right to call them just that. I see where that petetion to revoke Dave Wilson's Razors Edge bred dogs from UKC fell through. So until that day, I will call my dogs pitbulls...I don't really care what nobody thinks. As far as the prices are concerned, think about this, who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


----------



## sw_df27 (Feb 16, 2007)

I personally like both Am bullies and APBT's and we only bash those that claim their clearly Am bully is a APBT. and if you don't care what people think why did you even start this thread? you stated yourself you infact want us to argue about it.............. this has been argued a million times on this forum and if you would like to read them there is a search icon somewhere here. I just think this is a pointless arguement that nobody will ever win. I think this thread should be locked on the grounds that I think you just want to start a arguement but then again that's just My Opinion and I have a right to it. right?:angeldevi


----------



## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

When you mix in other breeds and make a new breed you can not sit and call them a breed that already exist 

Also there was no need to change the APBT and make it something different. 

American Bullies are American Bullies not APBT.

You can call your dogs what you want but that doesn't make it so

There are actually a ton of bullies in rescues.

Also you don't have to be a bully hater to not want them called what they are not. 

I like bully and pits however they are two different breeds.


----------



## buzhunter (Sep 3, 2007)

You are obviously hard headed, unteachable, and looking for an argument, so what's the point? Find somewhere else to do this crap. It's getting pretty damn old. Opininons are like pit bulls. Everybody has one and few are worth a damn.:stick:


----------



## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

If bully owners are proud of thier dogs, they should call them what they are, American Bullies. Why go pay so much for a dog and call it another breed name? If it's really worth all that much money and it really is exactly what you wanted, why pass it off as a more recognizable breed name? 

They are not bred to the same form, and they do not have the same function, so they are not the same breed. 

I love a lot of the bullies out there. I don't hate them at all. I just don't understand why people are so compelled to call them something they are not.


----------



## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

MADBood said:


> Okay, I've been reading alot of threads on here and I see most of you are ADBA standard and biased to that conformation. I'm not trying to piss anyone off, I'm simply just making a valid point here. Alot of you say Bullies are overpriced,ugly and lack drive, that is fine too. You tell us Bully owners that we do not have the right to call our dogs pitbulls. This is where I have a problem. Didn't knowelegable dogmen of earlier times strive to improve thier dogs for bettering of thier purpose? Was the pitbull not a combination of bulldogs(not the present day bulldogs of course) and terriers? Is this not a mixing of two breeds of dog to create a desired strain? Today, that purpose has changed....at least for most of us. Pit Bulldogs were bred for fighting, that was thier purpose then....now the purpose for most of us,anyway, is creating beautiful dogs that make great companions that still have that loyalty and gameness. If UKC and ADBA started revoking papers on bully bred dogs and we were all forced to register them with ABKC.....that would be fine, we would have our own strain, the "AmBully". My dogs are registered as pitbulls through the UKC and ADBA, so I have the right to call them just that. I see where that petetion to revoke Dave Wilson's Razors Edge bred dogs from UKC fell through. So until that day, I will call my dogs pitbulls...I don't really care what nobody thinks. As far as the prices are concerned, think about this, who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


Geez,
your wrong on so many levels,just give it a rest,ignorance is bliss,so i figure your pretty happy...


----------



## MetalGirl30 (Apr 15, 2008)

MADBood said:


> Okay, I've been reading alot of threads on here and I see most of you are ADBA standard and biased to that conformation. I'm not trying to piss anyone off, I'm simply just making a valid point here. Alot of you say Bullies are overpriced,ugly and lack drive, that is fine too. You tell us Bully owners that we do not have the right to call our dogs pitbulls. This is where I have a problem. Didn't knowelegable dogmen of earlier times strive to improve thier dogs for bettering of thier purpose? Was the pitbull not a combination of bulldogs(not the present day bulldogs of course) and terriers? Is this not a mixing of two breeds of dog to create a desired strain? Today, that purpose has changed....at least for most of us. Pit Bulldogs were bred for fighting, that was thier purpose then....now the purpose for most of us,anyway, is creating beautiful dogs that make great companions that still have that loyalty and gameness. If UKC and ADBA started revoking papers on bully bred dogs and we were all forced to register them with ABKC.....that would be fine, we would have our own strain, the "AmBully". My dogs are registered as pitbulls through the UKC and ADBA, so I have the right to call them just that. I see where that petetion to revoke Dave Wilson's Razors Edge bred dogs from UKC fell through. So until that day, I will call my dogs pitbulls...I don't really care what nobody thinks. As far as the prices are concerned, think about this, who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


With the Razors Edge thing...the man would get mad at you for calling his dogs a APBT,, saying that they were not APBT but an Am Bully, but he hid behind the APBT to get his dogs registered. So he was a contradiction to his self. Bullies are not the standard of what an APBT is and suppose to be. They are a whole different dog. Would you call a Cane Corso an APBT, just cause it looks like one in body structure? No you would call it what it is a Cane Corso. I have nothing wrong with bullies...I own one myself. 
But call your dog what it is...a bullie... not an APBT. 
What is your whole point here? As far as I can see no one has been bashing bullies.


----------



## NesOne (Feb 7, 2008)

The only Bully's I hate are the ones from the **** sapien species. :cheers: :cheers:


----------



## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

MADBood said:


> who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


*People who fight their dogs will pay 2-3 grand for a pup from good proven stock. So how much you pay for a dog doesn't determan if it will be abused or not.
How many RE dogs are in fighting rings? None. Because they lack the drive and are not built for it.

The truth is with most of the modern day RE "pitbulls" is that they are nothing more than "looks". Their pedigrees are nothing more than names. I personally would like to see more than names if i'm going to pay that much for dog. I want it to do more than sit and look pretty.

Low market dogs do not equal abuse. I paid no more than $400 for any of my dogs and none of them have ever been abused.

I don't have anything against bullies. Some of them look really nice. *


----------



## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

cane76 said:


> Geez,
> your wrong on so many levels,just give it a rest,ignorance is bliss,so i figure your pretty happy...


*Man Cane, you really now how tokeep it short and sweet...lol *:angeldevi


----------



## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

MADBood said:


> As far as the prices are concerned, think about this, who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


Isnt it abuse enough to breed a dog that is damned to a life in pain with crippling defects that the breeder selected for?
As for the game dogs going for 400$ or less,lol.A ch game dog can go for 20,000$,i know of a dog out of the hammonds rufus strain that went for 3,000$ and was never even tested for gameness,so again your far off baSE..


----------



## Msmith1 (Dec 23, 2007)

i love bullies i own 3 of them and they are not pit bulls... so you are wrong they comefrom pit bulls but they are not. I get what you are saying by the whole bulldog thing but now people breed mastiffs and corsos in the dogs also its not just pit bulls and bulldogs. They are a newer breed mostly of pit....


----------



## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Wow that theory/crap was so full of holes this should be easy.



> I see most of you are ADBA standard and biased to that conformation


You got that right, thats why there is a standard, thats kind of the point of a standard. Its an absolute that all others are measured by. If they dont hold water they just dont hold water.......



> Alot of you say Bullies are overpriced,ugly and lack drive,


I dont care what YOU pay for a dog or what someone charges. If you can get $xxxxx good for you, I have never cared about that. Ugly??? Some but you cant lump them all into one big group. The breeding of "bullies is so diverse that there are so many different looking ones its hard to say. I have seen some decent looking bullies but IMO low, short, fat and base wide is no good. If you want to own that, thats your perogative, on the same hand it is mine to not like it.



> If UKC and ADBA started revoking papers on bully bred dogs and we were all forced to register them with ABKC.....that would be fine, we would have our own strain, the "AmBully".


Thats exactly what should be done but money is the root of all evil.



> My dogs are registered as pitbulls through the UKC and ADBA, so I have the right to call them just that


Not really, if I had a poodle and was able to register it as a lab it doesnt give me the right to call it a Lab. Call it what it is.



> I will call my dogs pitbulls...I don't really care what nobody thinks


Obviously not, you STARTED THIS THREAD!!:hammer:



> Low market dogs= abuse.


Again a desperate GENERALIZED statement with nothing to back it up.



> So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail


It just did.


----------



## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

that was good!!


----------



## reddoggy (Jan 31, 2008)

This thread really should be locked! How does this fall into bloodline discussion again??? Uh, you couldn't have contradicted yourself anymore in your original post! Like a few others said, yeah, there is a point to standard bias... DUH!!! As far as low end goes, low price and low end are two different things and niether of them are the cause of abuse, do you have any idea how much the most popular game dog goes for right now? I was gonna name names but I think it's better that I don't. You have no clue who or how much I'm talking about! Do you even know what being gameness means??? Cause you tend to abuse that word. We're not here to bash and if you were looking through old threads you should have taken the time to read ALL of the posts! Pick your arguments elsewhere and if you want people to call your dog something that it's not, go to a bully site... NOT an APBT site smarty!


----------



## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

MADBood said:


> So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


Hmmm everyone is saying the same thing.


----------



## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

That's for sure..


----------



## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

ericschevy said:


>


:thumbsup: So true, so true!


----------



## buzhunter (Sep 3, 2007)

Hey, what the hell are you doing to my horse???


----------



## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

:rofl: LMAO!!!


----------



## MADBood (May 31, 2008)

I was having a bad day when I posted this thread. I want to apoligize for not researching before I dove into this. This is what I now realize, Bully breeders are using UKC to sell thier dogs because alot of ppl don't know of AmBullies. It seems to be a marketing technique they use to prey on uneducated buyers, that is wrong. They truley are two seperate breeds. I should be proud of my bullies and register them ABKC. I should have done alittle research before I posted such a ridiculous thread. I just can't believe how many bully sites are calling thier dogs APBTs. Its sick. I guess I was one of those uneducated ppl when I purchased my RE dog,nonetheless, i still love my dogs and I will continue to support the AmBully community. I am here to learn....not preach. Let this thread be a lesson to newcomers, do your research before you dive into something that has been debated a million times.


----------



## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

just love your dog for what it is,people seem to like these bully's more than the regular apbt anyways,thats why so many folks own them,hopefully the ambully will take the focus off the real apbt..


----------



## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

buzhunter said:


> Hey, what the hell are you doing to my horse???


I'm beating the crap out of him and he wont die...


----------



## reddoggy (Jan 31, 2008)

MADBood said:


> I was having a bad day when I posted this thread. I want to apoligize for not researching before I dove into this. This is what I now realize, Bully breeders are using UKC to sell thier dogs because alot of ppl don't know of AmBullies. It seems to be a marketing technique they use to prey on uneducated buyers, that is wrong. They truley are two seperate breeds. I should be proud of my bullies and register them ABKC. I should have done alittle research before I posted such a ridiculous thread. I just can't believe how many bully sites are calling thier dogs APBTs. Its sick. I guess I was one of those uneducated ppl when I purchased my RE dog,nonetheless, i still love my dogs and I will continue to support the AmBully community. I am here to learn....not preach. Let this thread be a lesson to newcomers, do your research before you dive into something that has been debated a million times.


:thumbsup:

You know, I thought the thread was kinda strange... Atleast it didn't get heated up in here, you didn't personally attack anyone, no harm done. Thank you for being a big person, I still have respect for you! Lets just:flush: it


----------



## reddoggy (Jan 31, 2008)

OH! DUH!!! Beating a dead horse... Took me a minute!


----------



## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

cane76 said:


> hopefully the ambully will take the focus off the real apbt..


I have to disagree. I don't think the spot light should be switched to another breed just to save ours. BSL isn't just about pits. No matter what breed bad owners are still destroying breeds. I am very partial to dogs in general and hate to seen any breed taking a fall and they all have their share of BYBs and people ruing the breed for everyone else.


----------



## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Ya,
but unfortunatly it will take another type or breed to take the spot light off the apbt,although in reality,the spot light will never fully be off them..


----------



## buzhunter (Sep 3, 2007)

american_pit13 said:


> I have to disagree. I don't thing the spot light should be switched to another breed just to save ours. BSL isn't just about pits. No matter what breed bad owners are still destroying breeds. I am very partial to dogs in general and hate to seen any breed taking a fall and they all have their share of BYBs and people ruing the breed for everyone else.


I understand what you are saying about BSL in general but I don't think you'll sway JQP away from the BSL frenzy in time to save the APBT. I think taking the heat off of the APBT first and foremost would be the most efficient route in this battle. The confusion of having the true culprits exposed would help us in the courtroom. If the glove doesn't fit... LOL


----------



## MetalGirl30 (Apr 15, 2008)

MADBood said:


> I was having a bad day when I posted this thread. I want to apoligize for not researching before I dove into this. This is what I now realize, Bully breeders are using UKC to sell thier dogs because alot of ppl don't know of AmBullies. It seems to be a marketing technique they use to prey on uneducated buyers, that is wrong. They truley are two seperate breeds. I should be proud of my bullies and register them ABKC. I should have done alittle research before I posted such a ridiculous thread. I just can't believe how many bully sites are calling thier dogs APBTs. Its sick. I guess I was one of those uneducated ppl when I purchased my RE dog,nonetheless, i still love my dogs and I will continue to support the AmBully community. I am here to learn....not preach. Let this thread be a lesson to newcomers, do your research before you dive into something that has been debated a million times.


Takes a big man/woman to admit when they are wrong. No harm done. We are all just human, and learning from our mistakes is an everyday thing. Love your dogs regardless of what breed they are. Thats all they ask of you!!!


----------



## budwinstonblue (Jun 1, 2008)

i am very sorry for going off on you i posted my last response on the first topic and after i read the whole thing i found out that you said sorry and i hope you forgive me.


----------



## shadowgames (Jul 3, 2008)

MADBood said:


> Okay, I've been reading alot of threads on here and I see most of you are ADBA standard and biased to that conformation. I'm not trying to piss anyone off, I'm simply just making a valid point here. Alot of you say Bullies are overpriced,ugly and lack drive, that is fine too. You tell us Bully owners that we do not have the right to call our dogs pitbulls. This is where I have a problem. Didn't knowelegable dogmen of earlier times strive to improve thier dogs for bettering of thier purpose? Was the pitbull not a combination of bulldogs(not the present day bulldogs of course) and terriers? Is this not a mixing of two breeds of dog to create a desired strain? Today, that purpose has changed....at least for most of us. Pit Bulldogs were bred for fighting, that was thier purpose then....now the purpose for most of us,anyway, is creating beautiful dogs that make great companions that still have that loyalty and gameness. If UKC and ADBA started revoking papers on bully bred dogs and we were all forced to register them with ABKC.....that would be fine, we would have our own strain, the "AmBully". My dogs are registered as pitbulls through the UKC and ADBA, so I have the right to call them just that. I see where that petetion to revoke Dave Wilson's Razors Edge bred dogs from UKC fell through. So until that day, I will call my dogs pitbulls...I don't really care what nobody thinks. As far as the prices are concerned, think about this, who is ganna pay $1500 plus for a dog and mistreat it? How many R.E. dogs are in animal shelters or in fighting rings? Low market dogs= abuse. Are Bully breeders greedy?....maybe some are. The point is people want that look and they pay big for it. Gamebred dogs like Chinaman and Jeep go for $400 around here and most of those end up in animal shelters,or worse, dead. I'm not knocking gamebred dogs I'm just stating the facts. I have the right to my opinion just as you guys do. So argue this as I know you will but the truth will always prevail.


I have seen people spend well over $1500 for a dog and mistreat it! Money amount don't mean nothing and proves most RE breeders are in it for one thing. More than once I have seen people spend money, much more than $1500 spend on these dogs and ruin them dog butchers, just plain POS, misinformed first time owners, and the addition of every "wangster" who wants to look cool with a "PIT" at the end of his leash riding 24"S CUZ, lol a bunch of image centered pu$$ies who are not gangster. The reason these dogs don't deserve to be a "pit bull" is the working ability that makes the breed the breed! Yes, it is a mixture of two breeds bull and terrier but isn't ever dog breed that has been developed a mixture of different breeds? Of course, so blood that is tainted and papered by people don't deserve to be called a "pit bull". The reason dogs of Chinaman and Jeep blood go for $400 and some more or some less is because it is a working man's price and the chances of offspring being a perfect example of a APBT is low, you must go through these dogs to better the breed and your own personal stock. Next off, the reason you don't see RE dogs fighting is they can't! You have obviousily not done your home work on why we have a conformation standard in the ADBA or somewhat possible UKC (ukc does a horrible job in judging true conformation). The reason we have a conformation standard is by the dogs than won in the pit. It seems to me that the UKC would do a better job in conformation since their first breed registered was a gamebred bulldog and was erected to provide a registery to register the best pit champions but just like RE bred dogs, the UKC chose money versus being true to their heritage but this 2008 and dog fighting has no place in our society so in return I will and many others will continue to stay the conformation standard and tempermant of the breed. Did you know that the Police, yes the Police were some of the first referrees in pit matches, good old boy in blue! I do agree the RE bred dogs do deserve a registered name that is fitting to the stature and tempermant, American Bully Terrier and not the "American Pit Bull Terrier".

Not directed towards you MADbood-
No matter how it is bred game, bully or staff. Most of you don't deserve to own the breed or they variations of it and need to give yourselves a reality check in why you even own the breed, most people in the breed are posers. 1 good person that deserves the breed and understands the responsibilty of carrying a piece of American history for every 1000 APBT owners and that is the truth of it.


----------



## Sampsons Dad (Jul 4, 2008)

I have a problem with bully dogs when they are called pedigreed pure breds when they are infact F1 or F2 ban dogges. I have nothing against ban dogges but to call a mastiff mix a pit bull is a lie. I want to know what I am paying for and breeding to. A pit bull has a certain conformation because of it performance. It does not conform to a standard then preform.


----------



## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

Sampsons Dad said:


> I have a problem with bully dogs when they are called pedigreed pure breds when they are infact F1 or F2 ban dogges. I have nothing against ban dogges but to call a mastiff mix a pit bull is a lie. I want to know what I am paying for and breeding to. A pit bull has a certain conformation because of it performance. It does not conform to a standard then preform.


Oh no not the ban dogs thing again.

Calling them a ban dog is the same as calling them a pit. You are still calling them something they are not.

American Bully is what they are. A breed of there own.


----------



## shadowgames (Jul 3, 2008)

Sampsons Dad said:


> I have a problem with bully dogs when they are called pedigreed pure breds when they are infact F1 or F2 ban dogges. I have nothing against ban dogges but to call a mastiff mix a pit bull is a lie. I want to know what I am paying for and breeding to. A pit bull has a certain conformation because of it performance. It does not conform to a standard then preform.


I like your thinking SAMPSONS DAD, that F1 or F2 ban dogges. LOL, that is freaking great!


----------



## los44 (Jun 1, 2008)

how can you say re dogs cant fight if you havent put one to the test? you know its one thing for apbt owners to not want ab's called apbt's, i can agree with that but to say all re's cant fight or cant be working dogs is rediculous. ive seen re's/bullies with incredible drive each dog is different. 

i take offense to your 24's comment, "wangster" its WANKSTER but anyways i have 24's on my truck and i dont have a pit yet i'll be buying one within the next year or 2 depending on when i feel ready. a pit doesnt make me feel or look cool i happen to like that pits are misunderstood and if done right one can show that pitbulls are not a bad breed. ever since i was a kid ive found pits beautiful in every sense of the word, they protect are playful very loving and loyal one cannot ask for more in a companion.

yes sir im in my late 20's and yes sir im on here reading up and preparing myself for my upcomming family member.

the worst thing about the apbt is the ignorance of people.


----------



## Sampsons Dad (Jul 4, 2008)

american_pit13 said:


> Oh no not the ban dogs thing again.
> 
> Calling them a ban dog is the same as calling them a pit. You are still calling them something they are not.
> 
> American Bully is what they are. A breed of there own.


Point taken.
However many of the "land of the Giant " pits I have seen are AB/neo/pit or Neo/pit mix or EM/AB mix. I mean no disrespect to the american bully folks.

Lets not fool anyone though an American bully will never perform like a performance bred dog. I have not owned an American bully but I know a little about conditioning dogs in a keep and I doubt the barrel chested big head heavier dogs won't have the wind of a performance bred dog.

in my humble opinion of course.


----------



## reddoggy (Jan 31, 2008)

The original pint on this thread was that bullies deserve to be called pitbulls. That being said I in turn ask what work has a bully done in a pit? Hmmm, Pit Fighter+Bull Dog=PitBull. I saw that someone brought RE dogs into this, RE dogs can barely run and I think that is the opposite of what a pit bull is supposed to be. Just because it has a big head and some muscle doesn't mean it's a pit bull. If it does than I'm gonna start calling chihuahuas pit bulls cause their heads are big and they do have some muscle on them. And BanDogge, hardly. The BanDogge is a functional working dog, bullies have no purpose other than looking pretty and breeding for little more than CA$H!!!


----------



## Bleu Clair (Jun 14, 2008)

I do believe the OP admitted that they were wrong, hadn't done their research and apologized, so why is this topic being dredged back up again?


----------



## reddoggy (Jan 31, 2008)

Oh yeah! I forgot about that, this is an older thread. LOL


----------



## Bleu Clair (Jun 14, 2008)

reddoggy said:


> Oh yeah! I forgot about that, this is an older thread. LOL


Oh, I wasn't singling you out Reddoggy  . I just said that 'cause I thought maybe people didn't realize that it was an old thread...I've done that before myself  .


----------

