# why do some pitbull owners hate American Bullies?



## rzee003 (Feb 19, 2011)

awwww saw this on the net ..

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker
Yes everyone here needs to do their research including the poster with the American Bulldog....LOL

He/she is talking about an American Bully not Amercain Bulldog.
He is not talking about American Staffordshire Terriers.

American Bullys have their own kennel club now. Though they are not recognized by the AKC or UKC. Any dog that looks like an American Bully and the breeder claims has UKC papers can not be shown so do not be fooled. UKC changed their breed standards cause of these poorly bred dogs. Here is the American Bully site The American Bully Registry

The two main blooldines that started this all are Razors Edge (used to be a excellent AmStaff bloodline until Dave Wilson himself ruined it) and Gotti.
Watchdog and Greyline are two of the other ones.
There are now many bloodlines in the American Bully.

*These dogs are just high priced mutts.* I would stay away from them. To many breeds have went into getting these dogs. Not just AmStaffs, APBT's like they try to claim. Many others are in there also.

Many health issues come along with the breed also.
Source(s):
rescuer, trainer, owner of 4 APBT's. (An RE dog before the bloodlines were tainted)


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## circlemkennels (Aug 29, 2010)

I don't think its the dogs themselves that apbt owners don't like.. (IMO) I think its where less knowledgeable (sp) people call them apbts or XXL pitbulls and things of that sort.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Your "typical" American Bully owner listens to rap and is part of that culture.. Your "typical" American Pit Bull Terrier/Bulldog handler is a good ole boy from the country side..

Part of it is just that, typically life styles, choices, etc don't clash with those two.. Another factor is breeding and mislabeling like circlem has pointed out.

The biggest factor, i believe however is purpose.. If we are talking about APBT/Bulldog being in traditional sense.. People handling a high end Bulldog, catch dog, pit dog, etc is not going to support (again, typically) or really understand the need to feed a face valued dog with zero function other than a show ring.. Vise versa..


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## circlemkennels (Aug 29, 2010)

KMdogs said:


> Your "typical" American Bully owner listens to rap and is part of that culture.. Your "typical" American Pit Bull Terrier/Bulldog handler is a good ole boy from the country side..
> 
> Part of it is just that, typically life styles, choices, etc don't clash with those two.. Another factor is breeding and mislabeling like circlem has pointed out.
> 
> The biggest factor, i believe however is purpose.. If we are talking about APBT/Bulldog being in traditional sense.. People handling a high end Bulldog, catch dog, pit dog, etc is not going to support (again, typically) or really understand the need to feed a face valued dog with zero function other than a show ring.. Vise versa..


:goodpost:


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

KMdogs said:


> Your "typical" American Bully owner listens to rap and is part of that culture.. Your "typical" American Pit Bull Terrier/Bulldog handler is a good ole boy from the country side..
> 
> .


WOW KM stereo type much? I know some rap listening APBT owners and breeders LOL.

to the OP

Why people who like rottweilers dont like labs? it comes down to prefrence nothing more. People who feel the need to put down a completely different breed then what they have obviously have nothing better to do and funny most people who claim american bullys are poorly bred or what not dont have a clue on the breed to begin with. Most every breed out there started as a mutt so for him to even go there is retarded, they are recognized as there own breed.

Now as to why APBT people dont like Bully PEOPLE is because some feel the need to try and portray there dog to be something it isnt and call it an APBT. I would be mad too if lab people all of a sudden decided they want to call there dogs APBT or bullys so i can see there point.

OP from what that person has responded with I would say they know crap all about the breed and wouldn't take anything they say for much. When they show up with some facts other then Dave Wilson ruined the breed LMFAO Dave Wilson produced the breed.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

angelbaby said:


> WOW KM stereo type much? I know some rap listening APBT owners and breeders LOL.
> 
> to the OP
> 
> ...


Why do you think i said typical, i never said ALL.. Every magazine i've seen that has to do with Bullies is VERY hip - hop, rap culture oriented.. I'd say near 90% of the American Bully owners i've met or talked to, fit the bill as well.

I mean hell, look at your average American Bully forum, look at who posts and then go to game dog. The comparisons are all over the place, which again, if you re-read my OP i never said ALL..

Hell i would also go as far as saying of that 90% at least HALF of Bully owners are wanna be thugs, wanksters, what have you.. The American Bully population is HUGE and just because you associate yourself with people that are well knowledgeable and diverse, doesn't mean that the over all numbers are the same..

It isn't about "stero typing" it is about pointing out the obvious. A good ole boy from the Blue Ridge isn't going to be impressed with the countless covers, articles, etc that show these oversized Bullies next to 22'' chrome rims and some dude with a thick chain around his neck and a wife beater on..

There are GOOD people out there with those dogs, there are GOOD examples of American Bullies out there however its not what i would consider "typical", "average" or anything "majority".


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

angelbaby said:


> WOW KM stereo type much? I know some rap listening APBT owners and breeders LOL.
> 
> to the OP
> 
> ...


Dave Wilson also arguably ruined the breed by not keeping close watch on what was going on and what his name was and now being associated with. Just as i would say post 76' ruined the Bulldog in that look at all the curs, overwhelming "show APBTs", etc there are running around.. There are still GOOD people with the Bulldog/APBT as well however because of the availability since i'd say early 1980s, numbers have shot up and its not like all these dogs running around are fine examples either..

....And this is one of my biggest problems with Bully people, most are in denial of the issue facing their breed of choice..I don't mind the dogs or the idea of breeding show dogs as that was their designed purpose, hell i'm more fond of a well bred, representation of the Bully vs a show bred "APBT".


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## Odin`s_BlueDragon (Mar 11, 2012)

KMdogs said:


> Why do you think i said typical, i never said ALL.. Every magazine i've seen that has to do with Bullies is VERY hip - hop, rap culture oriented.. I'd say near 90% of the American Bully owners i've met or talked to, fit the bill as well.
> 
> I mean hell, look at your average American Bully forum, look at who posts and then go to game dog. The comparisons are all over the place, which again, if you re-read my OP i never said ALL..
> 
> ...


I agree. here in CA its terrible. seems like every "APBT breeder" i find is really selling XXL bullies/hippos. im not against AmBullies at all, infact my boy is more likely a bully rather than an APBT, but i like the classics. Angelbaby, i like ur Luna and Cali alot and Pink's Torque is RE i believe too. there are alot of bullies that are nice, but KMdogs is might be right in the fact that the "thugs" are the majority owners of the breed.


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## VaBeachTennis (Dec 17, 2011)

KMdogs said:


> Your "typical" American Bully owner listens to rap and is part of that culture.. Your "typical" American Pit Bull Terrier/Bulldog handler is a good ole boy from the country side..
> 
> Part of it is just that, typically life styles, choices, etc don't clash with those two.. Another factor is breeding and mislabeling like circlem has pointed out.
> 
> The biggest factor, i believe however is purpose.. If we are talking about APBT/Bulldog being in traditional sense..* People handling a high end Bulldog, catch dog, pit dog, etc is not going to support (again, typically) or really understand the need to feed a face valued dog with zero function other than a show ring..* Vise versa..


Excellent points. It's like that in the Shepherd world as well. You have your working line shepherds and your show line shepherds. The you have your Malinois/Dutch Shepherd/Working Mutt people vs the "pure" German Shepherd people. Take a look at the early German Shepherd and it almost parallels the Pit Bull vs "Bully" issue. Is this a German Shepherd or a Malinois?


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

I agree for the MOST part with KM, but I am not in any way, shape, or form a good 'ole boy from the country LOL ( I know you said "typical")!! City slickers rule


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

It is very true. And I own a bully and a amstaff apbt mix my good lil bulldog. And two apbt they are young dogs. My point being is though my bully is very athletic and has ton of drive when working her it is obvious that lil thought of function.was put into producing her. So their is my answer for you it is hard to have a while lot of respect for a culture that as a whole seems to only care about the look and profit they can gain from their dogs. 

A function or purposeless dog that has no job so to speek has little place in the heart of a working dog man. Not to mention the uneducated masses of bulky owners who go around giving all bull dogs a bad name.


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## Dusteeh (May 1, 2012)

Me and my mom breed American Bullies. And I will have to agree with KMdogs. Most of the Ambully world is oriented around Rap. I have not been to a show yet that didnt have loud rap music and a DJ in the ring. Most of the times the shows arent very organized or anything either and I often feel the judging is very unfair but I still love the dogs. I prefer the cleaner style dogs. And I cant stand the fact that every where I look I see dogs that have major flaws that make the dog miserable. In my opinion the breed is starting to fall apart. So many people have inbred so much deformed puppies are being born, flaws are getting out of hand, and dogs are being born with reproductive problems. It seems that most of the Ambully breeders are only interested in money and the few that arent interested in the money are being over ruled by the people that are. 

This is just my opinion. But I am active in the bully world so I have seen and heard a lot. I much prefer a working pitbull over a showing American Bully any day but I wouldnt trade my dogs for the world.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

It seems like in a way, with no offense to either side... Once the market/use/demand for [] hounds fell through the bully was made to respark some sort of interest.... All I see is $$$ when I look at bullies. BYB breeders who deal with bullies still get ridiculous amounts of cash. Yet your good APBT breeder can hardly seem to get any value put on his hounds because of the bully fad. In addition, other than weight pull, the APBT's sport are dwindling. I've already seen PETA type complaints on catch work.... What's next?? Back when I had Hanna's pups to find homes for everyone that asked about em wanted to know if I had any blues.. I was so sick of hearing that mess.


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

I twerk all damn day long with my bullies in my back yard.


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## aj_harness (Sep 22, 2011)

Main issue is calling a breed what it isn't and adding bad news on the media. Some people have a preference of dogs they like. Me on the other hand go for whatever dog has a good personality or needs my help.


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

SMiGGs said:


> I twerk all damn day long with my bullies in my back yard.


Made my day.
everyone has their own taste, when u start hating that's the first step to being jelly.


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## Kingsgurl (Dec 16, 2011)

The dogs aren't at fault, but I dislike the fact that they are advertised as, promoted as and hyped as APBT, except of course, when that is inconvenient. Like advertisements that claim they are 'pit bulls' only 'better' or 'nicer' or 'insert why they are better here.'
I dislike having encounters like I had today in which I have to explain that no, my pit bull is not 'small' (50 pounds, smack in the standard) nor is he 'skinny'
The Am Bully craze has changed public perception of what a pit bull looks like to an overdone (usually blue) dog. If people knew and understood the Am Bully to be an actual BREED, separate from the APBT, this wouldn't happen. But they aren't promoted (outside of our circles) as anything BUT APBT. Hell, most people that get a new pup have no clue what I am talking about when I ask if their 8 week old, 20 pound, blue pup is an Am Bully. They say, no, he's a pit bull.... what can I feed him so he ends up HUGE?
As in KM's post, this is a generalization and I do know Am Bully breeders who promote their dogs as such, but they are far overshadowed, in this area, by the other element. They also are reluctant to admit that any of THEIR dogs end up in shelters.... that's a Pit Bull problem, not a Bully problem. Yet our shelters are full of bullies and NOT pit bulls, go figure.


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

With their being 5 classes its so hard to say what an am bully is. IMO it isn't a pocket pug lard ass.
an am bully shouldnt have the deformation of a gamma ray accident but a well tapered dog.
To many variables come in with this breed and its hard to say what one even is.


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## rzee003 (Feb 19, 2011)

yeah No reason to Hate a Breed .. its good that American Bullies branched out and established its own name ..and i hope American Bully Breeders Will stop Saying "Our Dogs Are Pitbulls, But has Lesser Agression" << Makes Pitbulls Look Bad because of That (


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## Sucker For A Rednose (Sep 11, 2011)

phrlandy said:


> With their being 5 classes its so hard to say what an am bully is. IMO it isn't a *pocket pug lard ass*.
> an am bully shouldnt have the *deformation of a gamma ray accident *but a well tapered dog.
> To many variables come in with this breed and its hard to say what one even is.


I laughed so hard at this post, 
thank you to the OP!


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

Sucker For A Rednose said:


> I laughed so hard at this post,
> thank you to the OP!


Glad I can make someone laugh.
Most walk around with a stick up their ass on this site lol


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## Odin`s_BlueDragon (Mar 11, 2012)

phrlandy said:


> Glad I can make someone laugh.
> Most walk around with a stick up their ass on this site lol


:stick: arguing on the internet is like competing in the Special Olympics.... even if u win ur still retarded.

(please no one take offense, simply a joke)


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## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

I think if you look at what the AmBully's are supposed to look like, they are nice looking dogs, then there comes people who have no clue and try to do their own thing. I think the AmBully get signaled out because there are so many people vocal about what they are doing, even though its wrong to some and very painful for their dogs. 

I don't think it has to do with location either, lol. I hate stereotyping anything to be honest. People think I should not own the dog I have because I don't fit a stereotype, and have told me so (I know I don't have either of those breeds just meaning by example). I find more people like me that own these breeds. I know your saying APBT are "typically" country, but not up here is all I am trying to get across. Around me ONLY thugs own any of these dogs is what people act like and that could not be further from the truth. They are all lumped together up here, there is no difference in who owns what in real life or in the eyes of the media. Pretty even who owns what, but admittedly my "country" is not the same as your "country" I would think. lol


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Your talking about Bulldogs, APBTs earned the right to be called as such not through sport but through the [].. Bulldogs can do well in sport, such as Sch, agility, etc.. Though IMO, if the right mind, eyes, ability.. Wasted, better at more "combat" type work such as catch..

In regards of PETA, isn't actually anything new just something being revisited.. Claims of catch work = dog fighting, :stick: same old tricks that people buy into because it sells.. :stick:

It isn't that the [] fell through, it is that post 76' those that choose to continue (not talking about thugs that do some F up ) doing so, testing, proving, breeding.. Do it knowing they are risking it all, at least in this country. It hasn't "gone away", if you aren't in the right "circle" you won't hear about it... Simple as that.

Once left the hands of knowledge, fell down the ladder to those that fight curs, kill dogs for no reason, work to death, ruin good dogs and absolutely destroy mentally and physically just about anything they touch.. It ain't the way it should be.. After the early 80s of being made "clear" these dogs are aggressive and all should be wary, EVERY thug in the nation wanted the "big, bad pit bull".. THUS creating larger, useless, unstable dogs deemed under the name Pit Bull.. Bulldog slowly ruined.. Right or wrong, the American Bully is part of this era..

I don't know how many times i've heard "Bullies are the REAL Bulldog" and talking about how their dog barks thus a "real mans dog"... All bullshit and honestly i never saw a point in creating a new show Bulldog.. The AST exists for that reason, i understand the preference of larger mass, maybe a more companion type of mentality.. Why create a new dog where there is show stock of just about any breed out there that could of been selectively bred for physical wants.. Hell the AST alone could have fit the bill..

Whats done is done and at least those breeding Bullies FOR the dog are sticking true TO the dog..

My biggest problem with "Pit Bull" owners in the masses is there is no common sense that comes with the territory.. Everyone thinks their dog is a "Pit Bull" because its a fad to "Save the breed" and "don't punish the breed punish the deed".. I mean DAMN, majority of these people don't even know what they are feeding NOR do they know what the hell a "Pit Bull" is.. doginfo.org and BS like that.. Yep, thats where the REAL knowledge is..

People are too soft and in its entirely, the Bulldog ain't no more.. Just like the American Bully structure of "typical" owners, 90% of "Pit Bull" owners are caught up in the fad, caught up in wanting a pet, caught up in EVERY angle except the truth.. The function, whats that? Who needs that anymore? Poor dog, poor animal that just got killed by that working animal, poor dog using that horrible prong collar that digs in the necks.. :stick::stick:

So if someone thinks i just "pick on" the Bully, think again.. I'm not "down" with the masses for MANY reasons..


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## MamaTank (Jun 12, 2011)

Kingsgurl said:


> The dogs aren't at fault, but I dislike the fact that they are advertised as, promoted as and hyped as APBT, except of course, when that is inconvenient. *Like advertisements that claim they are 'pit bulls' only 'better' or 'nicer' or 'insert why they are better here.'*
> * I dislike having encounters like I had today in which I have to explain that no, my pit bull is not 'small' (50 pounds, smack in the standard) nor is he 'skinny'*
> The Am Bully craze has changed public perception of what a pit bull looks like to an overdone (usually blue) dog. If people knew and understood the Am Bully to be an actual BREED, separate from the APBT, this wouldn't happen. But they aren't promoted (outside of our circles) as anything BUT APBT. Hell, most people that get a new pup have no clue what I am talking about when I ask if their 8 week old, 20 pound, blue pup is an Am Bully. They say, no, he's a pit bull.... what can I feed him so he ends up HUGE?
> As in KM's post, this is a generalization and I do know Am Bully breeders who promote their dogs as such, but they are far overshadowed, in this area, by the other element. They also are reluctant to admit that any of THEIR dogs end up in shelters.... that's a Pit Bull problem, not a Bully problem. Yet our shelters are full of bullies and NOT pit bulls, go figure.


:goodpost:



KMdogs said:


> Your talking about Bulldogs, APBTs earned the right to be called as such not through sport but through the [].. Bulldogs can do well in sport, such as Sch, agility, etc.. Though IMO, if the right mind, eyes, ability.. Wasted, better at more "combat" type work such as catch..
> 
> In regards of PETA, isn't actually anything new just something being revisited.. Claims of catch work = dog fighting, :stick: same old tricks that people buy into because it sells.. :stick:
> 
> ...


As always, KM :clap:

As a PET owner, I have no hate for any dog breed. 
As a person that wants to learn, and HAS learned quite a bit (though nowhere near enough to satisfy me) I prefer a dog that can work. My own dog is no more than an un-pedigreed Pet Bull, but I am trying to work with her and see if I can't give her a purpose beyond "pet" and "companion".


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

i think it comes down to the apbt being bred to function and the bully bred for show.

dogs shows are just a farce now and thats why i dont care about show titles. the dog show has ruined dogs by having itself turn into a beauty pageant. the whole point of, and i dont care what registry, of the dog show was to get proof of your dogs worthiness of being bred from a judge with no emotional attachment. form and function out and pretty-cutesy-wootsy-useless in.

i hate the shows, the registries and even a lot of "advocates" now.doing nothing but hurting the species and thats dang anathema . i use to not care for bullies but a few here have changed my mind


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## rzee003 (Feb 19, 2011)

zohawn said:


> i think it comes down to the apbt being bred to function and the bully bred for show.
> 
> dogs shows are just a farce now and thats why i dont care about show titles. the dog show has ruined dogs by having itself turn into a beauty pageant. the whole point of, and i dont care what registry, of the dog show was to get proof of your dogs worthiness of being bred from a judge with no emotional attachment. form and function out and pretty-cutesy-wootsy-useless in.
> 
> i hate the shows, the registries and even a lot of "advocates" now.doing nothing but hurting the species and thats dang anathema . i use to not care for bullies but a few here have changed my mind


U have a point ..its because of dogshows ..breeders keep wanting more on their dogs..wanting this or that on their dogs ..to the extent they try other methods ,sometimes bad ones.. but i like dogshows..it has its own advantages for the dogs too


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

rzee003 said:


> U have a point ..its because of dogshows ..breeders keep wanting more on their dogs..wanting this or that on their dogs ..to the extent they try other methods ,sometimes bad ones.. but i like dogshows..it has its own advantages for the dogs too


its so much worse in the usa


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

Is it practical to drive a 4x4 jeep in New york city?
No.
Is it practical to have a Sheep dog if i dont have sheep?
No.
If i have a sheep dog, and all sheep are extinct is it practical to still have one?
No.
What if sheep dogs were still being bred, but all sheep are extinct and its general purpose was to herd sheep, how can i check if the dog indeed is a sheep dog?




You see where im getting with this.
No need to bash someones dog, Bullies branch off from the APBT family, so we are cousins not enemies.


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

SMiGGs said:


> Is it practical to drive a 4x4 jeep in New york city?
> No.
> Is it practical to have a Sheep dog if i dont have sheep?
> No.
> ...


Great post:cheers:
If u don't use an apbt for its intended use, why not have a bully?


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## Odin`s_BlueDragon (Mar 11, 2012)

SMiGGs said:


> Is it practical to drive a 4x4 jeep in New york city?
> No.
> Is it practical to have a Sheep dog if i dont have sheep?
> No.
> ...


I am very much a gearhead and i always find myself realting things to cars. i work for toyota (jeeper dont hate) and i always laugh at the people who complain about the ride or the blindspots on the FJ Cruiser. now for those that dont know, that vehicle was designed to look like an old FJ40 and perform a certain way off road. it was not designed to fit in ur garage and drive u comfortably to work and school and gracery shopping. all in all like the APBT, designed to perform not look pretty.

i kinda lost where i was going with this one.... lol oh well, im sure i made a poin there.:thumbsup:


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

phrlandy said:


> Great post:cheers:
> If u don't use an apbt for its intended use, why not have a bully?


Thats why i have a bully. The [] is illegal in the US.

True APBT breeders still breed 'emag' driven dogs, but to no one in the states.


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

Odin's_BlueDragon said:


> I am very much a gearhead and i always find myself realting things to cars. i work for toyota (jeeper dont hate) and i always laugh at the people who complain about the ride or the blindspots on the FJ Cruiser. now for those that dont know, that vehicle was designed to look like an old FJ40 and perform a certain way off road. it was not designed to fit in ur garage and drive u comfortably to work and school and gracery shopping. all in all like the APBT, designed to perform not look pretty.
> 
> i kinda lost where i was going with this one.... lol oh well, im sure i made a poin there.:thumbsup:


Ya im a gearhead as well lol.

If i was hunting hog, id want 'emag' driven dog. If im chillen watching netflix and just a busy week, i would be doing more harm to the dog by just having it in a kennel.

APBT require physical activity! As for bullies they have the drive of an APBT, but they're restricted by their body features.

Like i mentioned in another thread....

American Bully = Arnold Schwarzenneger/The dudes from the jersey shore/Sylvester Stallone

APBT = Floyd Mayweather/Manny Pacquiao/Mike tyson


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

phrlandy said:


> Great post:cheers:
> If u don't use an apbt for its intended use, why not have a bully?


Because Bullies are slowly becoming EBs in all sense of.. (yes, a FEW exceptions) The list of genetic health problems just continues to grow, blame it on what the individual breeders foundation stock consisted of if you will.. However, as an example, look at how over produced "Blue" (and all variations of the gene) is, careless at that.. Skin allergies are a high bi product.. I don't know how many AmBullies i've seen where the muzzles over just a few generations have gone to "normal" to EB.. Easty Westy i've NEVER seen higher in any other breed by the numbers, lack of solid temperament and structure? You got it..

There are MANY reasons for not owning a Bully, even if you do manage to get lucky enough to get a pup off a ethical breeder, excellent quality dam and sire.. Look at what you are associated with from the outside looking in,, sure it doesn't REALLY matter but i'd personally stay away from it.. And thats not getting into the fact i'd have no use for a dog bred for no use other than the show ring.

If its your cup of tea, great.. But really, if i DID want a Bulldog that lacked drive, function and maybe had some "performance" for sport, i'd look at a SBT or BT.. Then you have the AST as well..


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

Personally, I am for the ethical treatment of animals...the organization is a different situation entirely. Not a fan of hog hunting due to it proving nothing really, and it is fairly cruel. So an apple can take down an orange, or the opposite, big deal it's still apples against oranges...unfair comparison. APBTs are more willing and seem to enjoy the battle between eachother (at least to a point), while I'm sure a hog's enjoyment ceases to exist. Anyway that's IMO. Now, I do have a serious question. If there are virtually no real APBTs among us any longer, then what are the reputable dogmen selling? I'll go a step further, if you acquire a pup from "proven" stock (from said dogman) is this pup not considered an APBT until it has done time in the []? As for myself, I don't mind calling my pups "bulldogs" since many a dogman used the same name in their yards and I don't look at it as a slight, versus how it comes across on this site. Hell, call them what you want, just don't call them late for dinner


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Saint Francis said:


> Personally, I am for the ethical treatment of animals...the organization is a different situation entirely. Not a fan of hog hunting due to it proving nothing really, and it is fairly cruel. So an apple can take down an orange, or the opposite, big deal it's still apples against oranges...unfair comparison. APBTs are more willing and seem to enjoy the battle between eachother (at least to a point), while I'm sure a hog's enjoyment ceases to exist. Anyway that's IMO. Now, I do have a serious question. If there are virtually no real APBTs among us any longer, then what are the reputable dogmen selling? I'll go a step further, if you acquire a pup from "proven" stock (from said dogman) is this pup not considered an APBT until it has done time in the []? As for myself, I don't mind calling my pups "bulldogs" since many a dogman used the same name in their yards and I don't look at it as a slight, versus how it comes across on this site. Hell, call them what you want, just don't call them late for dinner


All Bulldogs or Bandogs until otherwise proven, thus in order to be called an APBT one must prove itself worthy.. A pup off proven stock is a Bulldog until..

"Real" dog men are selling two hounds: Bulldogs that are extremely versatile, immense drive and all but proven in the [].. Old blood, proven blood.. AND APBTs.. Nothing sub par, few curs.. Show stock? Leave it to the show goers.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Saint Frances, KM... :clap: 


I can tell you this, only a few strains can provide my family with the type of dog we need and want, the world wasn't meant to be covered in cement and silicone and it's animals obey the laws of nature as does genetics, not government or paper or politics. Dogs are like Horses, a tool... the companionship is a plus. No use in having a dog that is of no use. Work that dog!


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

KMdogs said:


> All Bulldogs or Bandogs until otherwise proven, thus in order to be called an APBT one must prove itself worthy.. A pup off proven stock is a Bulldog until..
> 
> "Real" dog men are selling two hounds: Bulldogs that are extremely versatile, immense drive and all but proven in the [].. Old blood, proven blood.. AND APBTs.. Nothing sub par, few curs.. Show stock? Leave it to the show goers.


Well, I'm not going to debate the name for name's sake...it'd be like a dog chasing it's own tail LOL! We may differ in our opinion of what is an APBT, but I do understand that with opening the door a wee bit to interpretation it allows the so called APBT imposters to get their foot inside... where we are at today. I can not deny that I have "hounds" number 1 by your definition, due to being unproven, but I know that the APBT exists behind those amber eyes :snap:


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Mustangs, Arabians, Thouroughbreds, all running horses... Is a thoroughbred worth anything if it can't win a 2min race? How about Arabians which thoroughbreds come down from, they dont call thorughbreds arabians which are desert horses build for speed for what 2000yrs ??? now those two horses as great as they are couldn't survive in mustang country just as the mustang isnt in a 2min race and other than Frank Barnes of the old west don't win arabian races. .. Work and Region.. names the working animal Its all really practical only thing that affects it is ego and the willingness to accept truth or unwillingness to accept it and those argue with a full face of denial. 

Can a thorough bred still be a thoroughbred without the race? how about the arabian? I know from rodeo and horse culture that the mustang is in the appaloosa and other good rodeo and cutting horses however mustang is wild horse once bred captive the name changes.. "mountain pony".. They dont call Appaloosas mustangs and i've heard many say about Mountain Ponys yeah theres some mustang in ya.. Its all really practical and common sense. Same senerio with working dogs.. AKC siberian huskies are junk compared to traditional sled dogs and Alaskan huskies, just as bully and AST and show bred APBT is to the traditional APBT.. Simple as that.


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## Indie (Sep 29, 2010)

Seeing so many of these Bully breeders, and their breeding standards is what pisses me off about the breed. There are, of course a couple good ones.. but the vast majority just throw the biggest and baddest dogs together w/ no consideration to health, temperament, or what these odd mutations are doing to the poor dogs. Bowed legs, high rears, non-existent muzzles, turned out feet... it HURTS to be an AmBully any more! YES there are a few nice specimens, but to even CALL the AmBully a BREED is what pisses me off. With a breed, regardless of its origins, you get CLEAR AND CONSISTENT type in each litter. There is NO clear and consistent type to the AmBully.. they are ALL OVER THE PLACE. Litters can produce standards, XL's and shortys... in one litter!! No real breed has so many different types, especially out of the same litters. Then they wanna add in frenchies and call them shorty-bulls. Ummmm.. NO. Do you think we are blind? Do you think we can't tell that they're freaking french bulldog mutts with cropped ears?

Had these AmBully breeders stuck to what Dave Wilson had planned.. crossing Amstaffs and APBTs to get bigger dogs, then there would NOT be such a randomness in these dogs' traits. 
THIS DOES NOT APPLY to some AmBullies, of course. 

I really got it hit home a few years ago as an ACO, when this guy with an AmBully got him from a breeder for thousands, and bred the dog (a male) to some pit bull mixes and sold the pups to make ends meet (From his own mouth). The dog was under a year old, w/ 3 litters on the ground w/ 3 different pit mixes, and the owner said the breeder would trade the male in a few years for a younger one, or something like that. Just disgusting. 
AGAIN... not a representative of ALL ambully breeders/owners, but... it's just the atmosphere around the breed.. all about the look. /end rant


Oh, if it didn't come across in the post, I HATE THE BREEDERS... NOT THE BREED.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> Ya im a gearhead as well lol.
> 
> If i was hunting hog, id want 'emag' driven dog. If im chillen watching netflix and just a busy week, i would be doing more harm to the dog by just having it in a kennel.
> 
> ...


You serious?? :rofl: What drive? A few may have *some* toy drive, *some* prey drive, etc but ain't in NO way, shape or form even remotely similar.


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

Indie said:


> Seeing so many of these Bully breeders, and their breeding standards is what pisses me off about the breed. There are, of course a couple good ones.. but the vast majority just throw the biggest and baddest dogs together w/ no consideration to health, temperament, or what these odd mutations are doing to the poor dogs. Bowed legs, high rears, non-existent muzzles, turned out feet... it HURTS to be an AmBully any more! YES there are a few nice specimens, but to even CALL the AmBully a BREED is what pisses me off. With a breed, regardless of its origins, you get CLEAR AND CONSISTENT type in each litter. There is NO clear and consistent type to the AmBully.. they are ALL OVER THE PLACE. Litters can produce standards, XL's and shortys... in one litter!! No real breed has so many different types, especially out of the same litters. Then they wanna add in frenchies and call them shorty-bulls. Ummmm.. NO. Do you think we are blind? Do you think we can't tell that they're freaking french bulldog mutts with cropped ears?
> 
> Had these AmBully breeders stuck to what Dave Wilson had planned.. crossing Amstaffs and APBTs to get bigger dogs, then there would NOT be such a randomness in these dogs' traits.
> THIS DOES NOT APPLY to some AmBullies, of course.
> ...


Different bloodlines have/do different things in the AM Bully world just as APBT world.

Do you call a colby dog a carver dog?

In the bully world its based off looks. In the APBT world... well....u know...


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

KMdogs said:


> You serious?? :rofl: What drive? A few may have *some* toy drive, *some* prey drive, etc but ain't in NO way, shape or form even remotely similar.


How would you know if you havent owned a bully yourself?

Im guessing youre basing your opinion on the fat dogs youve seen on youtube and magazines?


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> How would you know if you havent owned a bully yourself?
> 
> Im guessing youre basing your opinion on the fat dogs youve seen on youtube and magazines?


Hey smiggs wait until he posts a long page essay, about how bullies suck.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> How would you know if you havent owned a bully yourself?
> 
> Im guessing youre basing your opinion on the fat dogs youve seen on youtube and magazines?


I'm basing this on genetics.. You breed for companionship and the show ring, you lose function and ability.. You breed for mass in replace of lean structure, you lose agility.. A few generations, the original stock is now morphed into the "new" dog.. You don't magically keep instilled what you aren't breeding for.

That is about as basic as i possibly can get..

Occasionally you have a "throw back" where original stock genetics re appear, this is where you get the occasional "performance" Bully.

Theres a reason why you dont see or hear about American Bullies in matches, hog hunting, etc..


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

I cannot post the rest of the pictures due to graphic reasons....


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> Mustangs, Arabians, Thouroughbreds, all running horses... Is a thoroughbred worth anything if it can't win a 2min race? How about Arabians which thoroughbreds come down from, they dont call thorughbreds arabians which are desert horses build for speed for what 2000yrs ??? now those two horses as great as they are couldn't survive in mustang country just as the mustang isnt in a 2min race and other than Frank Barnes of the old west don't win arabian races. .. Work and Region.. names the working animal Its all really practical only thing that affects it is ego and the willingness to accept truth or unwillingness to accept it and those argue with a full face of denial.
> 
> Can a thorough bred still be a thoroughbred without the race? how about the arabian? I know from rodeo and horse culture that the mustang is in the appaloosa and other good rodeo and cutting horses however mustang is wild horse once bred captive the name changes.. "mountain pony".. They dont call Appaloosas mustangs and i've heard many say about Mountain Ponys yeah theres some mustang in ya.. Its all really practical and common sense. Same senerio with working dogs.. AKC siberian huskies are junk compared to traditional sled dogs and Alaskan huskies, just as bully and AST and show bred APBT is to the traditional APBT.. Simple as that.


Answers lead to more questions LOL! First, my original question was what do "real dogmen" sell these days. I say real dogmen to eliminate the whole bully, imposter, etc. category. This is about legit dogmen and their business. Now, I've heard from KM that the pup is a "bulldog" (derogatory) and not an APBT, unless proven. How do you prove a puppy? I just look at it differently I suppose. This pup is, especially being from proven stock, an APBT until proven otherwise rather than a "bulldog" until proven...that's all. I'm sure when two dogs were being scheduled to match eachother, it wasn't announced as "Here we have a real APBT versus a "bulldog" because he hasn't been proven yet"...even if it was his first match. They were APBTs and what was decided upon was the gameness. I think it's great to limit what constitutes an APBT, but you can go to far. A pup out of two dynamos in the pit isn't considered an APBT? Come on. Here's an example to further explain my position. If a current Native American Indian doesn't live in a tee pee(sp), doesn't battle cowboys over land issues or scalp enemies, etc. does this make that Native American Indian any less of a Native American Indian? No sir. Like I said, this name designation has gotten a little out of hand, perhaps due to the current state of affairs of the breed, but let's keep it in check. "Bulldog" is fine with me because I don't view it as something less than desired...quite the contrary, it is a name that I grew up with and heard frequently. It's all good, everyone has an opinion and I respect that.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> I cannot post the rest of the pictures due to graphic reasons....


Anndd?? You got a ped with that dog from a reliable source, or just found some random google picture? Any "Bully" i've EVER heard of has either been Whopper scattered, or a cross of "Classic" AmBully and Bulldog.. Which i wont go into how i feel about that one.. LOL

Breeding an American Bully to do anything but conform or be a companion wouldn't be accepted by anyone.. Wouldn't be accepted through the Bully world as thats not what the breed is supposed to represent, it wouldn't be accepted in the Bulldog world as it wouldn't out perform a high end Bulldog..

I needed a good laugh though, lmao


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

SMiGGs said:


> I cannot post the rest of the pictures due to graphic reasons....


A cruel activity that serves no purpose.


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

KMdogs said:


> Anndd?? You got a ped with that dog from a reliable source, or just found some random google picture? Any "Bully" i've EVER heard of has either been Whopper scattered, or a cross of "Classic" AmBully and Bulldog.. Which i wont go into how i feel about that one.. L
> 
> Breeding an American Bully to do anything but conform or be a companion wouldn't be accepted by anyone.. Wouldn't be accepted through the Bully world as thats not what the breed is supposed to represent, it wouldn't be accepted in the Bulldog world as it wouldn't out perform a high end Bulldog..
> 
> I needed a good laugh though, lmao


After looking at all your posts all you do is pick fights with people? Maybe u are human aggressive? Lol
anyway. ....


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Saint Francis said:


> Answers lead to more questions LOL! First, my original question was what do "real dogmen" sell these days. I say real dogmen to eliminate the whole bully, imposter, etc. category. This is about legit dogmen and their business. Now, I've heard from KM that the pup is a "bulldog" (derogatory) and not an APBT, unless proven. How do you prove a puppy? I just look at it differently I suppose. This pup is, especially being from proven stock, an APBT until proven otherwise rather than a "bulldog" until proven...that's all. I'm sure when two dogs were being scheduled to match eachother, it wasn't announced as "Here we have a real APBT versus a "bulldog" because he hasn't been proven yet"...even if it was his first match. They were APBTs and what was decided upon was the gameness. I think it's great to limit what constitutes an APBT, but you can go to far. A pup out of two dynamos in the pit isn't considered an APBT? Come on. Here's an example to further explain my position. If a current Native American Indian doesn't live in a tee pee(sp), doesn't battle cowboys over land issues or scalp enemies, etc. does this make that Native American Indian any less of a Native American Indian? No sir. Like I said, this name designation has gotten a little out of hand, perhaps due to the current state of affairs of the breed, but let's keep it in check. "Bulldog" is fine with me because I don't view it as something less than desired...quite the contrary, it is a name that I grew up with and heard frequently. It's all good, everyone has an opinion and I respect that.


When did i ever say Bulldog was derogatory? A Bulldog has not rolled, not matched.. A Bulldog has not proven itself to be a PIT Dog.. I never said anything about quality.. A Bulldog is STILL a world class working hound, the difference is whether its proved game in combat..

I agree with you, a Bulldog is not "less than"..


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

KMdogs said:


> Anndd?? You got a ped with that dog from a reliable source, or just found some random google picture? Any "Bully" i've EVER heard of has either been Whopper scattered, or a cross of *"Classic"* AmBully and Bulldog.. Which i wont go into how i feel about that one.. LOL
> 
> Breeding an American Bully to do anything but conform or be a companion wouldn't be accepted by anyone.. Wouldn't be accepted through the Bully world as thats not what the breed is supposed to represent, it wouldn't be accepted in the Bulldog world as it wouldn't out perform a high end Bulldog..
> 
> I needed a good laugh though, lmao


If i wanted a dog to perform well in hog hunting i wouldnt even bother with an APBT, id choose a different breed.

Lol oh wow KM please enlighted me on these classic bullys LMAO. ROFL you ABKC advocate. Please read what the standard to these classic bullies.

You are going to tell me all colby/carver w.e lines arent crossbred KM? KM this is basic genetic breeding you know very well at some point you need to outcross before you run into inbred Dogs.

An APBTs only purpose is the [], anything but that is out of the ordinary. A fighting dog a companion lol. Look what we have here im starting to sound like a BSL law maker. If there is no box why bother with an APBT in agility contest when i can get a much better fit breed.

At the end of the day an American Bully will do whats its bred for, like you said, a companion.

On the other hand, you have a emag bred apbt, that will never fight. Unless you....ummmm......Match them? Otherwise why should i conform to what an internet guy is telling me, i read nonsense all day, but i have experience with bullies. Do you have experience with emag bred dogs KM? Im not talking hogs.


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## phrlandy (Apr 13, 2012)

SMiGGs said:


> If i wanted a dog to perform well in hog hunting i wouldnt even bother with an APBT, id choose a different breed.
> 
> Lol oh wow KM please enlighted me on these classic bullys LMAO. ROFL you ABKC advocate. Please read what the standard to these classic bullies.
> 
> ...


just opened up a can of worms! Good post!
Take that km u bully hating man lol just kidding srsly tho no need for an apbt if u sent fighting. Like u said there are other dogs that can out perform it that went dot aggressive.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> If i wanted a dog to perform well in hog hunting i wouldnt even bother with an APBT, id choose a different breed.
> 
> Lol oh wow KM please enlighted me on these classic bullys LMAO. ROFL you ABKC advocate. Please read what the standard to these classic bullies.
> 
> ...


Who said anything about APBT hog hunting? Have you read anything i've said, ever? ABKC advocate? I dislike almost ALL registries due to the lack of preservation.. All about money and being ran as a business and i sure as hell don't need to pay a registry or man money to tell me what i already know..

I have no idea what the "classic bully" reference is to, however when i mentioned it i was referring to people crossing the body type to the already fore mentioned as its the only structure sound enough to endure a stress load if bred properly in the Bully world.. Unless you think these morphed, "pockets", "xls", etc have the wind, leg, agility to perform out in the field.. LOL


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> If i wanted a dog to perform well in hog hunting i wouldnt even bother with an APBT, id choose a different breed.
> 
> Lol oh wow KM please enlighted me on these classic bullys LMAO. ROFL you ABKC advocate. Please read what the standard to these classic bullies.
> 
> ...


*yep*

as far as i know every agility event that allows the apbt has them in at least the top 3

here we go again with this "fighting dogs need to be killed" garbage. smiggs, you ever been around fighting dogs? that uneducated, asinine comment come from experience? that goes for everyone else here...where do you think YOUR dogs come from


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

Saint Francis said:


> Answers lead to more questions LOL! First, my original question was what do "real dogmen" sell these days. I say real dogmen to eliminate the whole bully, imposter, etc. category. This is about legit dogmen and their business. Now, I've heard from KM that the pup is a "bulldog" (derogatory) and not an APBT, unless proven. How do you prove a puppy? I just look at it differently I suppose. This pup is, especially being from proven stock, an APBT until proven otherwise rather than a "bulldog" until proven...that's all. I'm sure when two dogs were being scheduled to match eachother, it wasn't announced as "Here we have a real APBT versus a "bulldog" because he hasn't been proven yet"...even if it was his first match. They were APBTs and what was decided upon was the gameness. I think it's great to limit what constitutes an APBT, but you can go to far. A pup out of two dynamos in the pit isn't considered an APBT? Come on. Here's an example to further explain my position. If a current Native American Indian doesn't live in a tee pee(sp), doesn't battle cowboys over land issues or scalp enemies, etc.* does this make that Native American Indian any less of a Native American Indian? No sir.* Like I said, this name designation has gotten a little out of hand, perhaps due to the current state of affairs of the breed, but let's keep it in check. "Bulldog" is fine with me because I don't view it as something less than desired...quite the contrary, it is a name that I grew up with and heard frequently. It's all good, everyone has an opinion and I respect that.


native americans were never bred for a specific task. APBT is a title, not the name of a breed. so all native americans are native americans, regardless of what they do. now if 1 decided to become a dr, or a pit fighter his title would change but hes still a NA


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

zohawn said:


> *yep*
> 
> as far as i know every agility event that allows the apbt has them in at least the top 3
> 
> here we go again with this *"fighting dogs need to be killed"* garbage. smiggs, you ever been around fighting dogs? that uneducated, asinine comment come from experience? that goes for everyone else here...where do you think YOUR dogs come from


My dogs come from bulldogs and frenchies according to KM. If you feel offended by the truth simply dont post.

No one in here said fighting dogs need to be killed. Dont be such a "NICE GUY/GIRL", read the thread. Dont worry KM aint going to give you cool points, he can speak for himself, as he is very knowledgeable at what he does.

This is a discussion not an argument so please leave personal attacks out of it.


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

SMiGGs said:


> My dogs come from bulldogs and frenchies according to KM. If you feel offended by the truth simply dont post.
> 
> No one in here said fighting dogs need to be killed. Dont be such a "NICE GUY/GIRL", read the thread. *Dont worry KM aint going to give you cool points, he can speak for himself, as he is very knowledgeable at what he does*.
> 
> This is a discussion not an argument *so please leave personal attacks out of it.*


could care less what KM gives or does or how he perceives me.

im not personally attacking you, your comment is "uneducated and asinine". not you, your comment.

whats needed to be said has been said, thisll just turn into another troll post


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

zohawn said:


> could care less what KM gives or does or how he perceives me.
> 
> im not personally attacking you, your comment is "uneducated and asinine". not you, your comment.
> 
> whats needed to be said has been said, thisll just turn into another troll post


That comment was never made. ROFL
It would have been pointed out by KM as well. Who would say such a thing anyways?


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

SMiGGs said:


> I cannot post the rest of the pictures due to graphic reasons....


Hog testing is legal in many states.. if true working dogs are your venue there outlets within legal means. This issue comes up a lot. Unless you've ever seen a feral pig let alone a razorback or eurorusso razorback .. you don't know what they fight for. THEY ARE MEAN AND LOVE TO KILL PREDATORS! You wonder how a hog gets to hogzilla size? Cause after they hit 350lb (weight of most black bear which back down grizzlys) They are a unchallenged force and only good ol boys hunting these hogs has the biggest impact as they dispatch most of the feral hog problem before they get to a half ton. I was raised on a hog farm til I was 7 my gramps had some wild boar crosses along with the hampshires and the Old reds. A Hog will kill a dog and then eat it if hes hungry. Dont get it confused.

Thanks for sharing the pic.


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

zohawn said:


> native americans were never bred for a specific task. APBT is a title, not the name of a breed. so all native americans are native americans, regardless of what they do. now if 1 decided to become a dr, or a pit fighter his title would change but hes still a NA


Then someone needs to inform the ADBA, OFRNR, etc. that they are naming the breed wrong in their registry!! Also, the handful of legit dogmen who sell their pups (unproven obviously) under the name of APBT might be interested as well. I hear what you're saying, I just believe otherwise


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> Hog testing is legal in many states.. if true working dogs are your venue there outlets within legal means. This issue comes up a lot. Unless you've ever seen a feral pig let alone a razorback or eurorusso razorback .. you don't know what they fight for. THEY ARE MEAN AND LOVE TO KILL PREDATORS! You wonder how a hog gets to hogzilla size? Cause after they hit 350lb (weight of most black bear which back down grizzlys) They are a unchallenged force and only good ol boys hunting these hogs has the biggest impact as they dispatch most of the feral hog problem before they get to a half ton. I was raised on a hog farm til I was 7 my gramps had some wild boar crosses along with the hampshires and the Old reds. A Hog will kill a dog and then eat it if hes hungry. Dont get it confused.
> 
> Thanks for sharing the pic.


Then why risk the dog's life. Seems that there are other viable options of keeping the population down, and still excite the "good ole boys". Darn it Stan, you've conjured up images of Deliverance in my head just before I hit the sheets LOL!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Saint Francis said:


> Answers lead to more questions LOL! First, my original question was what do "real dogmen" sell these days. I say real dogmen to eliminate the whole bully, imposter, etc. category. This is about legit dogmen and their business. Now, I've heard from KM that the pup is a "bulldog" (derogatory) and not an APBT, unless proven. How do you prove a puppy? I just look at it differently I suppose. This pup is, especially being from proven stock, an APBT until proven otherwise rather than a "bulldog" until proven...that's all. I'm sure when two dogs were being scheduled to match eachother, it wasn't announced as "Here we have a real APBT versus a "bulldog" because he hasn't been proven yet"...even if it was his first match. They were APBTs and what was decided upon was the gameness. I think it's great to limit what constitutes an APBT, but you can go to far. A pup out of two dynamos in the pit isn't considered an APBT? Come on. Here's an example to further explain my position. If a current Native American Indian doesn't live in a tee pee(sp), doesn't battle cowboys over land issues or scalp enemies, etc. does this make that Native American Indian any less of a Native American Indian? No sir. Like I said, this name designation has gotten a little out of hand, perhaps due to the current state of affairs of the breed, but let's keep it in check. "Bulldog" is fine with me because I don't view it as something less than desired...quite the contrary, it is a name that I grew up with and heard frequently. It's all good, everyone has an opinion and I respect that.


 nor do I .. couldn't agree more.. I call them bulldogs because thats what they are.. Colby said that even with Pit Bullterrier advertising.

They are the father of all bulldog and terrier strains. The first dog registry registered a pair of terriers from inbreeding pit bulldogs and put them back in. The old term Bull and Terrier describes one breed as they are of each other. People are to full of limited knowledge and I wasn't asking you .. as much as I was asking the purpose of work and strain..

FYI Im 2/3 american indian.. Comanche (Tonkawa, Choctaw,Apache,Seminole,escaped slaves) usually only list 3 but its important to know the Comanches bred warriors and game tested even their women as they were imperialist and slave traders they were always improving their genetic code for the ability to endure and give back as much hell as they ever took. The Apache are cousins to the Comanche cause the comanche and apache traded family members. Comanche were those that practiced black magic and Apache well.. "Geronimo"s mother was comanche and he was medicine man in the apache, medicine man of War.. totally untouched until he was ready to be chained. ... native americans today have the blood, however native american philosophy and medicine men of today and yesterday say being Apache, Comanche, Cheyenne, Osage, Blackfoot, Kootenai, Nez Perce, etc.. depends what in your heart. In your heart you are white eye then your white eye..

A game dog knows hes a game dog and will go down showing it no matter the quarry because of whats in his heart. You dont know what you got unless you work the blood you got. How many american indians have the blood but lost their heart? .. Same thing essentially .. Comanches had the same philosophy as dogmen with their dogs, No curs allowed...

I was comparing to horses cause its easier but.. :rofl: history lesson..


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## SMiGGs (Jul 6, 2011)

Firehazard said:


> Hog testing is legal in many states.. if true working dogs are your venue there outlets within legal means. This issue comes up a lot. Unless you've ever seen a feral pig let alone a razorback or eurorusso razorback .. you don't know what they fight for. THEY ARE MEAN AND LOVE TO KILL PREDATORS! You wonder how a hog gets to hogzilla size? Cause after they hit 350lb (weight of most black bear which back down grizzlys) They are a unchallenged force and only good ol boys hunting these hogs has the biggest impact as they dispatch most of the feral hog problem before they get to a half ton. I was raised on a hog farm til I was 7 my gramps had some wild boar crosses along with the hampshires and the Old reds. A Hog will kill a dog and then eat it if hes hungry. Dont get it confused.
> 
> Thanks for sharing the pic.


Hats off to you bro. They are very mean creatures. I would be no where near one with out a weapon lol

Edit: Ya the hog might kill and eat the dog, but in todays world most dogs that are taken out on hog hunting wear vest to prevent being impailed by a horn

I also learned something new about Native American culture, i wouldnt want to be game tested, what if i only have dead game rofl that would suck


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Saint Francis said:


> Then why risk the dog's life. Seems that there are other viable options of keeping the population down, and still excite the "good ole boys". Darn it Stan, you've conjured up images of Deliverance in my head just before I hit the sheets LOL!


because the dog is the tool and we need him to tame and catch feral and wild game.. without the testing you don't have anything but a dead dog walkin. Not everyones idea of life is ipods, movie theaters, and pop rocks, I love the wilderness and need a dog that can handle its self and protect me and my family doing so as if it was second to none. Bulldogs of the game herritage are the only ones for me. I do call Canook, Hoagie, Alice, and Duchess APBTs as they're all but sired by proven dogs. What I produce off of them and test bear hunting and coyote hunting after an intense regiment; I call bulldogs. of course they'll be registered APBTs but more game than most the stuff out there posing game as some of you say cause the blood is there. Im taking that stuff and working it. I dont hog test, I do understand it and have seen it done and IMO its the best you can do when done properly to get the same kind of dog.. Wildsides CH Nino was hogtested and could kill a pig with a bite.

To make an humaniac out cry that APBTs dont need to be tested against their quarry .. you gotta know if your gonna have a catch dog a kill dog or a lemon.

Just two days ago a couple was walking their retrievers and coyotes attacked them in the light of morning.. I can't help but snicker.. Turk is 37lbs and can kill two or three in one setting; cause the rest run off.. Hes great with kids and people hell on predators and feral animals. Sired by Hoagie whos all but my favorite lil bulldog. Turk is because I use him and work him and know hes the most solid thing since a 17century anvil.

not hog testing is like not bear hunting... how do you really know what you got?


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## Dueces (May 4, 2012)

Apbt people hate bully people because bullys sell for triple what an apbt will sell for for no reason, Most are untitled, unhealthy, an really not even a breed yet they sell them as apbt for way more then you can get for an actual apbt. I feel thats the only reason $$$


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> because the dog is the tool and we need him to tame and catch feral and wild game.. without the testing you don't have anything but a dead dog walkin. Not everyones idea of life is ipods, movie theaters, and pop rocks, I love the wilderness and need a dog that can handle its self and protect me and my family doing so as if it was second to none. Bulldogs of the game herritage are the only ones for me. I do call Canook, Hoagie, Alice, and Duchess APBTs as they're all but sired by proven dogs. What I produce off of them and test bear hunting and coyote hunting after an intense regiment; I call bulldogs. of course they'll be registered APBTs but more game than most the stuff out there posing game as some of you say cause the blood is there. Im taking that stuff and working it. I dont hog test, I do understand it and have seen it done and IMO its the best you can do when done properly to get the same kind of dog.. Wildsides CH Nino was hogtested and could kill a pig with a bite.
> 
> To make an humaniac out cry that APBTs dont need to be tested against their quarry .. you gotta know if your gonna have a catch dog a kill dog or a lemon.
> 
> ...


I have always lived by the motto, "Live and let live" and am a true city dweller, so I view things differently than yourself. If it makes me a "tree hugger" so be it. Hell, it makes my day when working outside on my job I happen across brother fox or brother coyote, while others simply see them as descpicable creatures...I see nature in all its beauty, maybe even a hog LOL!!! Different geographical locations, different vantage points I suppose. I have no doubts that your stock is bullet hard, you know what your doing. Turk sounds amazing. As always, you present your opinions with respect and a history lesson ha ha, and that is why Stan is the Man! Catch you on the flipside my friend


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## Vilebeast (Feb 29, 2012)

For anyone that thinks hunting with dogs for hogs is wrong in anyway. I would like to leave you with a small fact from a farming family (my family farms over 10 acres, granted I only help when im off work or not hunting). 

Hogs in FL alone do over 10 million dollars of damage to farm lands.....and this means.....that you in your cities pay more for groceries. 

I hunt hogs, granted not doing with dogs..yet. If guys like me weren't doing what we are, you would not be eating whatever it is you eat. :thumbsup:

I know Firehazard mentioned "hogzilla" I nailed a 500 pound pig last year, it killed a 6 year old girl in suburbia. So don't think they effect you also.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Dueces said:


> Apbt people hate bully people because bullys sell for triple what an apbt will sell for for no reason, Most are untitled, unhealthy, an really not even a breed yet they sell them as apbt for way more then you can get for an actual apbt. I feel thats the only reason $$$


:flush: not hardly... I don't hate bully people or bullies.. I will call out that Bullies are NOT APBTs or any sort of high end bulldog. They are pets.. nothing more, nothing less.. for all the tenderfoot.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Vilebeast said:


> For anyone that thinks hunting with dogs for hogs is wrong in anyway. I would like to leave you with a small fact from a farming family (my family farms over 10 acres, granted I only help when im off work or not hunting).
> 
> Hogs in FL alone do over 10 million dollars of damage to farm lands.....and this means.....that you in your cities pay more for groceries.
> 
> ...


:goodpost: simple and to the point..

If more people had a good high end bulldog they wouldnt be in half the perdicuments they're in... the dog would save them. But NOPE, we all have to be victims. Im sorry but in 34yrs I've never seen or heard of anyone being saved by the :cop: from a 911 call, they always end up cleaning up the mess, eventually catching the criminal (we hope) or charging the person who was forced to defend themselves or shoot the dog who defended you. Happened when I was young a man broke in our german dobies went to work on him, the female angel stayed on him in the kitchen til the police got there and they charged my mom and the city put down the dog. WE are SUPPOSED To be VICTIMS.. ???? this was in 82. I rolled in the worst ghettos you can imagine in with hoods no one who had smarts or honored their life would ride with, why? Cause I had Hooch, my bullet proof catch machine, my .45 on command. Bulletproof? why would I say that? Ghetto thugs, bulletproof .. put it together... Now what about the cougar attacks, bear attacks, hog attacks, coyote attacks (on pets) ??? would that happen if you had a REAL bulldog of high end APBT strain? NAh.. in my experience the game dog is a demon to all them critters who can't do anything to get away. If you had a bulldog back there no coyote, or bobcat would carry off your lil doggy. I've even heard of golden eagles taking pets from area backyards ..

end rant. :flush:


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Saint Francis said:


> I have always lived by the motto, "Live and let live" and am a true city dweller, so I view things differently than yourself. If it makes me a "tree hugger" so be it. Hell, it makes my day when working outside on my job I happen across brother fox or brother coyote, while others simply see them as descpicable creatures...I see nature in all its beauty, maybe even a hog LOL!!! Different geographical locations, different vantage points I suppose. I have no doubts that your stock is bullet hard, you know what your doing. Turk sounds amazing. As always, you present your opinions with respect and a history lesson ha ha, and that is why Stan is the Man! Catch you on the flipside my friend


Thank ya! I must let you know however I too am tree hugger! I don't always kill or send the dogs on predators I too like to observe and live in nature; however times come when its time to hunt. I love to live as one with nature, which is I choose dogs. I like guns well enough but don't like sensless killing. They clear cut my bear hunting range  saddens me.. 








This is where I run my dogs and hunt.. about 400acres clear cut.. The best part about it I can see my dogs where ever they upruns: but damn.. I love wilderness......


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## Vilebeast (Feb 29, 2012)

Firehazard said:


> Thank ya! I must let you know however I too am tree hugger! I don't always kill or send the dogs on predators I too like to observe and live in nature; however times come when its time to hunt. I love to live as one with nature, which is I choose dogs. I like guns well enough but don't like sensless killing. They clear cut my bear hunting range  saddens me..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This saddens me greatly.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

:thumbsup: Stan thats the ONLY way of hunting.. Hell i still like most of my meat to still have a hint of game taste, or wild taste as they say..

Theres only ONE way to get hounds sturdy and rugged enough and it ain't coming from sub par fluff


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

If there was only a way to curb the most disrespectful, lustful, self- righteous, destructive virus of all...man. A great deal of the problems in this world have mankind as the common denominator. However, I'm afraid that the knot is too tight to unravel, and even with all of our infinite wisdom, deaf ears have befallen us. We have made the bed in which we lie. It makes you wonder who the real predator is and what nature discusses in the morning at the water cooler, er water hole. The blame is only a mirror away. OK, I'm climbing down from the clock tower now and putting my rifle away LOL...maybe I can catch the last half of Resident Evil ha ha!!!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Saint Francis said:


> If there was only a way to curb the most disrespectful, lustful, self- righteous, destructive virus of all...man. A great deal of the problems in this world have mankind as the common denominator. However, I'm afraid that the knot is too tight to unravel, and even with all of our infinite wisdom, deaf ears have befallen us. We have made the bed in which we lie. It makes you wonder who the real predator is and what nature discusses in the morning at the water cooler, er water hole. The blame is only a mirror away. OK, I'm climbing down from the clock tower now and putting my rifle away LOL...maybe I can catch the last half of Resident Evil ha ha!!!


:cheers::goodpost: ... epic truth


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## Kenaii (Dec 22, 2011)

I am a diehard Game Bred Bulldog fancier, but with that said I don't hate the Am Bully (In fact I like them if they're not overdone.) I only hate when I'm looking for APBT kennels and 90% of the results are People selling Bullies and passing them off as APBTs.


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

People feel it dishonors all of the dogs that have been "rolled" and may have died in the final part of creating the strongest, most athletic breed on dog per pound on Earth. They also feel it dishonors the life work of people like Crenshaw, Sorrells, Woods, etc. In 1976 laws made it harder to keep the best genes in the world pure. How would you feel if your life work was ruined by breeding your dogs over and over to dogs you would never approve of?

By crossing it, you END the hundreds, if not thousands of years of breeding the best to the best that created the APBT.

You are now breeding for looks. The APBT was bred for function. The looks of the most athletic dog on Earth was only happenstance. This breed was created for function, not form.


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

SMiGGs said:


> Is it practical to drive a 4x4 jeep in New york city?
> No.
> Is it practical to have a Sheep dog if i dont have sheep?
> No.
> ...


The APBT is a family dog that feels that he can "lick the world". This comes with a dog who does not shed to much, heals quick, does not bark to much and feels just like me! Yes, there is still a place for the game bred APBT who never sees a vets office!

And yes, we have to get along (the Bullies and the APBTs') because we are all in the crosshairs.


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

Saint Francis said:


> Personally, I am for the ethical treatment of animals...the organization is a different situation entirely. Not a fan of hog hunting due to it proving nothing really, and it is fairly cruel. So an apple can take down an orange, or the opposite, big deal it's still apples against oranges...unfair comparison. APBTs are more willing and seem to enjoy the battle between eachother (at least to a point), while I'm sure a hog's enjoyment ceases to exist. Anyway that's IMO. Now, I do have a serious question. If there are virtually no real APBTs among us any longer, then what are the reputable dogmen selling? I'll go a step further, if you acquire a pup from "proven" stock (from said dogman) is this pup not considered an APBT until it has done time in the []? As for myself, I don't mind calling my pups "bulldogs" since many a dogman used the same name in their yards and I don't look at it as a slight, versus how it comes across on this site. Hell, call them what you want, just don't call them late for dinner


Pups do not need to come from the box to be an APBT. If their ancestors were getting their balls groped in the 70's in a show ring instead of being tested the real way, in my opinion you do not have an APBT,


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## ames (Jun 6, 2010)

NorCalTim said:


> By crossing it, you END the hundreds, if not thousands of years of breeding the best to the best that created the APBT.


Just need to say the APBT breed is pretty new in comparison to some breeds and not hundreds or thousands of years spent creating them. Pretty much early 20th century is my understanding. Not to take away from anything you meant, but it was also created by crossing breeds, just like the AmStaff and the AmBully were created, just like all breeds are "created". And since its not legal to prove a dog anymore in my country, kinda doesn't matter about the game aspect anymore so it does blow my mind when people don't realize they are equal and not superior to another breed, its whatever breed of choice for each person.


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

The APBT was bred for function from what ever worked best.
This is just not done anymore.
Painting in the 1600s' show what looks to be the ancestors of the present day APBT. Most pedigrees were closely guarded. This gave us the Snooty, Chinaman, Pedro, etc. Plain and simple. Best to best.

One of the most interesting things about our breed is that it will FOREVER be mysterious and misunderstood. 

One thing is for sure. Pound for pound it is the strongest and most game breed dog in the world. Human friendliness, a scene of humor and increased intelligence came with it. In order to continue this with out open testing on other APBTs, our best hope to keep this game breed is to keep it pure!!!


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

They are equal to NO BREED!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

NorCalTim said:


> They are equal to NO BREED!


:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## Dutchy954 (Jan 19, 2012)

I do not like Bullies and would never own one. As long as someone takes care of their dog thats all that matter. I love ADBA shows, the people, the dogs. We went to one of those ABKC shows recently not a month ago and it was trash. It was ALL people with image issues. Huge spiked collars. Poorly behaved people. and gross dogs. The facilities were absoloutely disgusting by 10am. And when everyone left it looked like a landfill. We stayed for a APBT fun show after. They actually have an easty westy category in their shows. what a freaking joke.


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

Saint Francis said:


> Then why risk the dog's life. Seems that there are other viable options of keeping the population down, and still excite the "good ole boys". Darn it Stan, you've conjured up images of Deliverance in my head just before I hit the sheets LOL!


Hogs are taking over many ares. Kids would rather play a video game than kill their own food. The wild pig problem will help keep the APBT in a good light in the long run. People who want to go hunt wild pigs who are destroying the local environment will eventually be seen as hero's.


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## Saint Francis (Jun 2, 2010)

NorCalTim said:


> Pups do not need to come from the box to be an APBT. If their ancestors were getting their balls groped in the 70's in a show ring instead of being tested the real way, in my opinion you do not have an APBT,


The first sentence sums up how I feel...pups from good stock are APBTs the second they hit the ground. Testing their gameness is another thing, but they are still considered APBTs until proven otherwise.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

NorCalTim said:


> Pups do not need to come from the box to be an APBT. If their ancestors were getting their balls groped in the 70's in a show ring instead of being tested the real way, in my opinion you do not have an APBT,


So you think an unproven dog, cur dog, show dog.. Hell, lets back it up to the second a pup his the ground you would consider it a Pit dog? Thats what you are saying after all i would assume you know what the name American Pit Bull Terrier means and comes from.

Blood doesn't define the dog, ability and function defines the dog. If a "working dog breed" cannot work it is not true to said breed, if a Pit Dog is not proven to be game in said area than it is NOT a Pit Dog and in this case is, a Bulldog..

It doesn't take many generations of breeding away from purpose where you start to lose the qualities that formed the "original" stock of dog.. Look at over 100 years worth of English Bulldog.. Just about all "working breeds" have "two types", show stock and working stock.. Both have the SAME arguments we do in the Bulldog world..

The difference? It is already figured out, cut and dry, black and white... Show "APBT" is an AST regardless of "pre 76", that is over 30 years worth of breeding away from the [] if you are getting a pup off someone that hasn't risked it all or imported OR know someone.. An unproven, untested dog off of proven stock (American PIT Bull Terriers) are Bulldogs OR Bandogs..

We already know whats what, yet very few people accept it now in days for various reasons, Pride, misguided, wanting to "advance" the breed to a different direction, etc..


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## NorCalTim (Mar 26, 2007)

KMdogs said:


> So you think an unproven dog, cur dog, show dog.. Hell, lets back it up to the second a pup his the ground you would consider it a Pit dog? Thats what you are saying after all i would assume you know what the name American Pit Bull Terrier means and comes from.
> 
> Blood doesn't define the dog, ability and function defines the dog. If a "working dog breed" cannot work it is not true to said breed, if a Pit Dog is not proven to be game in said area than it is NOT a Pit Dog and in this case is, a Bulldog..
> 
> ...


They are Bull Dogs! Its not like the guys who used the box took a vote a named it a "Pit". Its a demeaning name. Old school guys are more likely to call their dog a Bull Dog than a Pit Bull.

This can go round and around. However if your mom was named "X" and your dad was named "Y", you are a cross of X and Y. If you come from game stock, that is it. Plain and simple. You come from game stock (even if you have not been tested). If you breed to a mutt and test it, who cares?

Keep it pure. Its the best thing a man like myself can do.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Whew, i finally reached the end of ths thread. *wipes forehead* Good info, good opinions, good brain picking. It makes you think. And that, is something the human race needs to do.


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## zohawn (Jun 8, 2011)

NorCalTim said:


> They are Bull Dogs! Its not like the guys who used the box took a vote a named it a "Pit". Its a demeaning name. Old school guys are more likely to call their dog a Bull Dog than a Pit Bull.
> 
> This can go round and around. However if your mom was named "X" and your dad was named "Y", you are a cross of X and Y. If you come from game stock, that is it. Plain and simple. You come from game stock (even if you have not been tested). *If you breed to a mutt and test it, who cares?*
> 
> Keep it pure. Its the best thing a man like myself can do.


*you* should! thats why the apbt has bloodlines. FUNCTION FIRST AND FOREMOST. where do you think dogs like chinaman and jeep come from? ever wonder why both chinaman and jeep look different? or an even better example would be alligator and jeep...they are BOTH APBT because they EARNED THE RIGHT to be called that! if jeep was never tested he would be a bulldog.


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## Elvisfink (Oct 13, 2008)

There's a reason why the ADBA used to advertise this way.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

I think because American Bullies look better and stronger then APBT... Its normal to all jealousy people LOL


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## MSK (Aug 13, 2008)

This post is two years old and because of comments like that is why people get offended 90% of all APBT owners are FAR from jealous of a Bully owner but you will find everyone on this board thats been here a while will tell you to each thier own. Just saying. And the strength look part is all a matter of opinion not a fact.


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## hashbrown (Mar 17, 2013)

gpbkool said:


> I think because American Bullies look better and stronger then APBT... Its normal to all jealousy people LOL


Son you don't know  from good apple butter, why don't you take your troll *** elsewhere before it's broken off in your vajayjay.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

What a loser lol................


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## BCdogs (May 30, 2014)

gpbkool said:


> What a loser lol................


Are you butthurt after we told you on another forum that your dog's morbidly obese? Is that what you consider "strong"? I'd take a healthy APBT over that ANY day. He's not going to make it past 2.


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## STiLL WILL (May 1, 2013)

gpbkool said:


> I think because American Bullies look better and stronger then APBT... Its normal to all jealousy people LOL












........yet you post this in a previous thread:



gpbkool said:


> Here is my *pitbull* puppy male Pkool at 10-13 weeks old.


Calling what CLEARLY is not a pit bull, a "pitbull." So tell me again, who's jealous of who/what now????


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

My baby bully @ 8 months


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## Dr.Duct_Mossburg (Jul 31, 2012)

I've never been a fan of bullies do to the overwhelming selfishness to produce something that is structurally improper and in all honesty, horrible imo. 

That being said, My girl Stella is far closer to a bully than the picture perfect APBT. We knew it when we met the guy to get her. She was short for her age but she was so sweet and spunky. We said heck with it and took her home with us. She is 19" and 55lbs at a yr old. She isnt overly big, but shes stocky. Shes also already started going to the orthopedic sports medicine place locally for hip dysplasia. 99% of people out there wouldn't pick up in what I did to take her there but i knew this was coming. With good habits and exercise practices she will be fine but she will never be what my male is.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

My American bully @ 10 months


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## pittieparty (Feb 25, 2015)

Wow, what an amazing thread. Thanks for costing me my morning!! (I kinda skipped two pages, and it still took forever.)

I was reading an informative site (conflicts in some of the historical details of another site kindly recommended to me by Ames here on gopitbull, but we'll probably never get it exactly right!). Scroll down the page and look at the random encounter of two pit bulls with a bull, in the anarchy of post Hurricane Katrina. Those bull dogs did not need to be taught what to do. These photographs are like replicas of paintings from 200 years ago.

My foster pup comes back from a deer chase all lathered and crazy-eyed. To his irate foster mother. He was backyard bred in Mississippi to bring down wild hogs. I've NO doubt he would very much like that job, would take to it instantly, and happily prove himself dead game. Unfortunately, based on his enthusiastic but somewhat unathletic showing with our new flirt pole, I fear he would prove himself dead game really quickly, if you catch my drift. However, in the two dog fights he's instigated, I'd fer shure have put my money on him. My point being, genetics are real. My sweet baby is a wannabe killer. I still have PTSD from unlatching him from that poor American bulldog's face.

Official Pit Bull Site of Diane Jessup

PS, If I wanted a dog, I would be much better off with a dog-friendly companion animal, rather than a high maintenance working dog, so I can understand breeding dogs for that purpose. (Though not as long as shelters are still overflowing.) But breeding AmBullies who are structurally unsound, it's a crime, a terrible crime. Producing and promoting unhealthy dogs--may those breeders meet their just desserts.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)




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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

I'm an APBT owner and I don't "hate" American Bullies per se. To break it down:

1. I am bothered that people think the bully is what the APBT is supposed to be. 

2. I think bully breeders need to embrace health testing as long as they're embracing high price tags. You can't breed for exaggerated looks and structure without the usual genetic fallout. (For the record, I health test my APBTs.)

3. Money attracts the wrong kinds of owners and breeders. This kind of mentality exists in all breeds, but I think its more prevalent the more pricey they get.

Overall, I don't mind the American Bully. But it needs to be its own thing. Don't ride on the coattails of the APBT, or call them "bully pits." They're not "pit" anything just because they were bred down from this breed. Our dogs got the name American PIT bull terrier because of their bloody combat history. Bullies are bred for looks, not scrapping. And for the love of little puppies, health-test them. Please.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

My baby American bully @ 11 months


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## hashbrown (Mar 17, 2013)

You really should take that thing for a walk once in awhile!


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## surfer (Feb 20, 2013)

Hate to say it, I wouldn't kick a dead hog in the a$$ for a charge that looks like that...
If he was to cross paths with a real apbt, it would not be pretty.....


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## hashbrown (Mar 17, 2013)

surfer said:


> Hate to say it, I wouldn't kick a dead hog in the a$$ for a charge that looks like that...
> If he was to cross paths with a real apbt, it would not be pretty.....


Hey pops! How are things?


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

One thing i found out after having my America Bully for 11 months. Most of APBT owners hate American bullies on all the websites i visited. But in the real time in person when i walked my dog in the park, on the beach, around my neighbors... they (APBT owners) were totally different LOL. They hugged my dog and kissed him and kept saying "he's so cute" They asked me alot of questions where i got my dog? What food did i fed him? Exercises methods... Blablabla... That gave me a big suprise. I wonder why APBT owners on net were so different than the one in real life? LOL. Thanks for honesty feedbacks.


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## BCdogs (May 30, 2014)

Because all we can see is pictures of a dog with structural issues and too much weight on it. I'm sure your dog has a lovely personality, but we don't get an idea of that when you just spam with the board with the same two pictures and never say another word.

And for the record, I don't hate American Bullies. I hate the POS breeders that make them like yours without any consideration for the dog's quality of life, and I hate people that blindly (or completely willingly) buy into that and support their profitable "breeding".


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## STiLL WILL (May 1, 2013)

gpbkool,

How about you try starting your own thread instead to post pics instead of spamming your dog all over random threads without any real explanation to your pictures. 

Are we supposed to be giving you feedback???.... or do you just want to "show off" the dog that supposedly "most APBT owners" you run into supposedly ask about this dog's feed, breeder, or exercise regimen.

Honestly, and I hope you genuinely acknowledge this, your dog being built the way it is could REALLY use a change in either diet or exercise or both. The dog needs to lose weight. THIS, you can control. Everything else you're at the mercy of the genetics. Unfortunately, I don't think the genetics of the equation has the best interests of your dog in mind. Lots of structural things I see that make me cringe....but, hey, that should not discourage the way you love it one bit. The quality of life for this dog will heavily rely on its health---again, something YOU can control.


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## hashbrown (Mar 17, 2013)

gpbkool said:


> One thing i found out after having my America Bully for 11 months. Most of APBT owners hate American bullies on all the websites i visited. But in the real time in person when i walked my dog in the park, on the beach, around my neighbors... they (APBT owners) were totally different LOL. They hugged my dog and kissed him and kept saying "he's so cute" They asked me alot of questions where i got my dog? What food did i fed him? Exercises methods... Blablabla... That gave me a big suprise. I wonder why APBT owners on net were so different than the one in real life? LOL. Thanks for honesty feedbacks.


Hmmmmm..... I wonder if if you ever once asked them if they were jealous of your over weight out of shape critter...... You come around and poke that in folks face that have honest to goodness working dogs you will be scoffed at! I would be willing to bet that critter would be sucking leaves off of the ground before it would take down a kitten ****. It's cool you are coming around, just do some reading before you let your mouth overload your ass. I honestly doubt your finding any APBT on the beach or at the park.


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

I'm no more jealous of AmBullies than I am of Rottweilers. They are different breeds. I think all breeds have their own appeal, and I would pet any friendly dog. Doesn't mean I'd take it home with me. Lol!


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## TeamCourter (Oct 22, 2013)

I some how missed this one, just like many others I'm sure...I don't hate American Bullies, hell I am getting one in July. I do however hate the "breeders" that produce crap like so many we see out there. I just feel bad for so many of those ugly dogs that have been produced by retards.


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## gpbkool (Aug 17, 2014)

Happy my American Bully his first birthday


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## scparrish (Jan 8, 2010)

There is no saving this one


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## DickyT (Jan 29, 2014)

This thread has run it's course. Nothing of value is being added, closing it.


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