# COMMING SOON! Blue Titanics Warrior Princess AKA "Xena""



## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Ok, so we are getting a female puppy from Gwen X Dillenger from Ironman Pits. These are the 2 female puppies that she had! Me and my mom LOVE female A The first puppy.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

they are both very cute , ilove the 2nd but i like markings and lots of white lol , they are both sweet , chunky girls those feet are huge.


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## Aireal (Jul 2, 2010)

i love them both but love the second i like the diffrence between the blue and white, can't wait to see pictures of the puppy you choose


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

I will put them up as soon as we get her! It should be the 2nd or 3rd week of december. Thats when she can fly. So I will post them then


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## Aireal (Jul 2, 2010)

awww I so jealous, your gonna give me puppy fever if you keep posting these cute freakin pup chica


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Do you have APBT's? Or American Bullys?


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## Aireal (Jul 2, 2010)

i go me some good old fashion mutts lol well there not papered anyway , i have been looking into both the bully and APBT for my next go however, i know i want a blue and i love the athletics and health, drive and general look of a good APBT but same time i like "healthy" bully's and there temperaments. I have yet to decide but i have time so I'll stress it closer to time to add to my pack lol


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## ashes (Jul 7, 2010)

They're both so cute but Ilove the second one's markings


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

My mom loved the second one at first too, But then she saw how female A was growing she changed her mind! We want dogs that will fit the build of our males Zeus and Rebel. So we picked her


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## Luvum (Nov 11, 2010)

I love it how the wrinkles in the first puppy's legs make it look like she's wearing a long sleeved shirt with the right "sleeve" pushed up a bit. LOL

Very cute puppies. I can almost smell the puppy breath through the computer.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE PUPPY BREATH!!!!!


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

BTPB said:


> My mom loved the second one at first too, But then she saw how female A was growing she changed her mind! We want dogs that will fit the build of our males Zeus and Rebel. So we picked her


Your not going to be able to tell at that age if they are going to fit the builds of your males.


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## Black Label Romo (Oct 15, 2009)

Just going off personal preference of looks...
I choooooseeee....
A
lol...awesome lil puppies...best of luck to your family


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Thanks Lonestar


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

> Your not going to be able to tell at that age if they are going to fit the builds of you males.


Theres only one way to find out!


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

They are both adorable!! Love the wrinkles on Pup A, and reallly like the flashy blaze on the face of the 2nd!!


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## shadowwolf (Dec 5, 2008)

Cute American Bullies.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

I'm still in love with female A...lol Its gotta be that naughty look she always has in her pictures! I just love it


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

I have seen the smallest out of the litter turn into the biggest in the end and vice versa so pick which one you like the looks of cause you will not be able to guess which one will be bigger/thicker ect  I love the face and stance of pup A but love pup B's markings , always hard to chose at this age cause they all so cute lol we picked cali out of 16 pups from 3 litters was almost impossible wanted them all lol


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

I know! Rebel came out of a litter of 14! They had some VERY PRETTY NICE LOOKING BABIES!!!!!  My sister wanted them alll!!!! lol


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## Aireal (Jul 2, 2010)

ok i say you take a, i take b and were both happy!!!


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

LMAO!!!! 3,000 dollars a puppy????


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

BTPB said:


> LMAO!!!! 3,000 dollars a puppy????


Yep, I looked it up on the site too. I wanted to say something but decided not too. Are you still getting one?


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Yea, this is what happend! We took our dog Mya out to california to be bred to Dillenger, and the first time we drove out there. The breeding didn't take. Then a year later we had them ship the semen, did a AI and went back to the specialist to see if we have babies. She ended up not being prego again. The vet found a cyst in her right ovarie. We're gonna take care of that when she comes into heat again. But my mom shelled out over 4,000 dollars for both times. The stud fee is 2,000, the lady was nice enough to transfer my mom stud fee over to a puppy. So we're getting one of his babies instead. Dillenger is Myas Grandpa.


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## Aireal (Jul 2, 2010)

BTPB said:


> LMAO!!!! 3,000 dollars a puppy????


haha eff that, nope i will prob be doomed to rescue and all there baggage forever!!! lol
edit not that there is a darn thing wrong with rescue best dogs ive ever had!!!!!!!


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

The pups are only that much, because of the bloodlines behind Dillenger and Gwen! They have both proven themselves!


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

But, Its well worth it!! 

Thats the link to Dillengers pedigree: .: Pitbull Pedigree :.

This is Gwens: .: Pitbull Pedigree :.


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## dixieland (Aug 14, 2009)

BTPB said:


> The pups are only that much, because of the bloodlines behind Dillenger and Gwen! They have both proven themselves!


How have they both proven themselves?It takes more then bloodlines to "prove" a dog.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

So far i like pup A... Could you get side and rear shots so we can get a good idea of the over all structure of the puppy? It helps to have a visual comparison of all angles until the dogs are of age to go home... I personally waited to make my official pick out of my last litter until they were 12 weeks old.. but then again i ended up with all of them when everything was all said and done around their 6 month marker. lol

It's necessary for all angles and videos of the puppies... how they move and interact with the litter. Don't pick a dog based off of looks especially with bully breeds. You need to know what personality will work within your home as well as the conformation of a pup. Don't settle for second best when you're looking at a life long commitment such as a dog. If you don't see what you NEED in this litter there will ALWAYS be another soon to follow... Especially within the bully community.

Please don't think i am trying to be a jerk... but the way you word this thread... you guys already have intensions of breeding this puppy before it is even fully weened. Which is a big no no when it comes to dogs.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

dixieland said:


> How have they both proven themselves?It takes more then bloodlines to "prove" a dog.


It's bully lingo that is used try to pull the wool over each others eyes as well as people trying to "get into the game" to justify breeding the fudge out of dogs and charging rediculous prices. Proven themselves often means they have been bred and throw dogs similar to the structure of the sire... nothing to do with actually proving themselves worthy as a dog period.

I am not ignorant, these bullies are expensive to buy, i am not the person you will hear telling you to look for a great deal because quite frankly there is not a great deal to be had for real quality american bullies. the price is the price, unless you're smart and get to know these people as friends before you ever even consider purchasing a pup or using their dog as a stud. IMO that is the most important step in buying a dog, forming a solid friendship with the breeder before ever talking business. A real friend will stand behind their word reguardless of the written contract which only legally binds you to each other... and often times they cut you amazing deals.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Well, since we live in MI and they live in CA We have no way of going there to see the personalitys of the 2 females! We're not going for looks, we're going for structure. We don't ever breed a dog until they are fully mature! I know I've been taught and my moms been with the bully breed for years. 

All I put is that we want a puppy that will grow to meet the structure of our males Zeus and Rebel.

And my mom loves gwen and dillenger and this is the last time that ironmanpits will be breeding Gwen.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTPB said:


> Well, since we live in MI and they live in CA We have no way of going there to see the personalitys of the 2 females! We're not going for looks, we're going for structure. We don't ever breed a dog until they are fully mature! I know I've been taught and my moms been with the bully breed for years.
> 
> All I put is that we want a puppy that will grow to meet the structure of our males Zeus and Rebel.
> 
> And my mom loves gwen and dillenger and this is the last time that ironmanpits will be breeding Gwen.


oh my hannah, you and your mom are going about this all the wrong ways... You don't need to be in person to make a friendship. You don't need to be in person to see the way the dogs interact with each other. A video camera, a camera for stills, the internet, a telephone is all that you need. Obviously the breeder has a point and shoot, a telephone and the internet and for charging 3,000 for a single puppy you would think he would have invested the money into a video camera for recreational uses if not only for the dogs if they are that much a part of his life. I wish things went like the olden days where responsible breeders chose the dog for the owner and not give the puppy purchasers the option to look at entire litters and get their hearts set on a dog that is not everything they wanted in the first place. Not downing you or your breeder, but i do not support going into purchasing dogs because they look pretty with a good pedigree. it's much more than that. Temperament (it's not just nice or mean, it's the entire demenor of the dogs in multiple situations) is equally important to structure.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

We have seen videos of all the puppies! Both the females have great personalitys!


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTPB said:


> We have seen videos of all the puppies! Both the females have great personalitys!


Ok, comparing the two puppies when they interact with each other on video... what do you notice about each one? Who is dominant, who is sumbissive, who has an outgoing personality, who is eager to please, who can have their paws played with fingers in mouth, flipped on their backs? Who comes first when called?


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Okay, this will be my last post in this thread... I think Bully The Kid said it best in one of his first talk radio shows...

If you're going to fork out thousands of dollars on a dog, you better fork out a couple of hundred to fly out to the breeder to get hands on with your product.

______________________________________________________________________________



You're not buying electronics, you're buying an animal. Heck, even people who buy drugs have enough sense to not give their money away without having the product in their hands :roll:


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

By the looks of it female A is calmer than female B- it just shows them all playing together! Female B likes to smack around Female A.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

I didn't post this thread to have an argument with someone! I posted it to show you guys the 2 females and to see what you guys thought of it! My mom knows what to look for when buying a bully!


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTPB said:


> I didn't post this thread to have an argument with someone! I posted it to show you guys the 2 females and to see what you guys thought of it! My mom knows what to look for when buying a bully!


I didn't mean to come off arguementative, my fingers just type as fast as my brain thinks. I forget to add stuff so i post again. I was just trying to help you guys. I'm glad your mom knows what to look for because 95% of the bully community doesn't know what to look for within itself....


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

These are our critters: Starting with Mya, Zeus, Storm, and Rebel  Mya, Zeus, and storm are in the show rings right now.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

If you want to spend 3k for a pup, more power to ya. I just think it's crazy!


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

It's crazy, Yes! But its better than spending 2k for a stud fee to the male and not getting a pregnancy and then going back and having semen shipped for another 1k and still not getting a pregnancy! We could keep taking Mya back to Cali and each time not getting a pregnancy. Its better than wasting your money for trying to get a pregnancy and that never happens. The breeder was nice enough to let us transfer the money over to a puppy with another 1k.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTPB said:


> It's crazy, Yes! But its better than spending 2k for a stud fee to the male and not getting a pregnancy and then going back and having semen shipped for another 1k and still not getting a pregnancy! We could keep taking Mya back to Cali and each time not getting a pregnancy. Its better than wasting your money for trying to get a pregnancy and that never happens. The breeder was nice enough to let us transfer the money over to a puppy with another 1k.


You're right, I've been in a similar situation before. i just hope you aren't limited to only this breeding to choose a dog out of. Look into my previous threads under Indigo Bully Connection to see the similarities of our situation. I just think it's like quality control being hands on with the dogs yanno? I like your guys's dogs from what i see, i just don't think it's smart to do dog business over the internet.


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## aimee235 (Apr 29, 2007)

They don't do free rebreedings if it doesn't take?


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTW, we had the semen shipped from Oregon to the east coast... it cost 500-600 for the shipping then the price of the surgery.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

aimee235 said:


> They don't do free rebreedings if it doesn't take?


thats what i was thinkin , alot of the breeders i know do a guarantee


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

They do, But Mya has a Cystic right ovary. We have to wait until her next heat. Have lab panels done on her, then she has to go on a medicine for a year. Then she has to go back in after a year, get another US done to see if its still there! But we have no way of knowing if its going to come back or not! And storm is no wheres near old enough to breed. 


Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? My dad drove Mya out there the first time and picked her back up. So he did meet the breeder.


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

When it is fault of the bitch and not the stud many will not offer a free re breeding. Its seems they did rebreed once anyhow.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

Ok, So first picked lastnight and we're getting female A


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## fishinrob (Apr 14, 2010)

Here's your puppies profile pics. Don't ask how I got them


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

LMAO!!!!!! How did you get them???


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Since ya'll are looking at this litter to get breeding stock out of it...it may be just the way she's sitting back on that rear leg, but i would look at those rear feet... ask for more pictures that way you can tell if it is a deformity (either genetic or environmental) or just a couple of bad shots. If you notice it in more pictures that the rear paw is really splayed like that I would ask the breeder which dogs in the pedigree carry this trait, that way you know where to go forward with breeding program down the road to avoid more dogs being produced with this. If it's environmental we can help you guys get those feet nice and tight since she is so young.


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## fishinrob (Apr 14, 2010)

This is what was written with those pics:

I don't pick the order of pups..The customers pick, obviously not everyone can get first pick, that's why that spot is the most expensive. I also make videos of the pups so they can get a better idea of the pups and help them out the best I can describing what the pup is like. What's great and this has happened many times is...Everyone gets their first pick they wanted. Not everyone has the same likes, so it's great when that happens.

This is something I would pick..I was really hoping first pick would back out because I am in love with this girl and my heart and stomach hurts at the thought of letting her go, but that's my fault for not holding that spot..She has the in between personality also, not shy but not crazy..And her body, head, everything is perfect (to me)..She even has the perfect little ears and tail.


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

> This is something I would pick..I was really hoping first pick would back out because I am in love with this girl and my heart and stomach hurts at the thought of letting her go, but that's my fault for not holding that spot..She has the in between personality also, not shy but not crazy..And her body, head, everything is perfect (to me)..She even has the perfect little ears and tail.


???? Huh, you have me a little confused!?!?! LOL


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## BTPB (Oct 27, 2010)

oh, My mom says you must have got the pics off of the bully forum that Diane (Ironmanpits) talks on?!?!?!


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## fishinrob (Apr 14, 2010)

I just checked it and saw the pics. I don't belong to any other forums and just happened across them.


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## BTPBMom (Nov 10, 2010)

RESPONSE to everyone involved in this thread -

OK - So this is the "Mom" again. Please don't misunderstand anything that my daughter posted. I am attempting to teach her the way she should and should not post information in these forums - so what she says is not misleading / judgmental.

So let me clarify everything again:

I have known and dealt with Diane at Ironmanpits for quite some time. Not only do I consider them good people and friends - but They do breed for the correct things. It is not about just slapping this dog together with that dog - as you will see with alot of breeders.

Diane and I have come to know each other quite well over the past several years. So I agree 100% with you don't have to meet a person face to face to become friends. My husband has been out to California and visited IronManPits personally. He has seen both Gwen and Dillinger - along with the other dogs they have. BOTH are structurally nice and temperaments are sound.

Ironmanpits DOES guarantee a litter when you stud to one of their males. Diane was nice enough, as a friend, to transfer the stud fee I paid to a female from a breeding. I did not have to take a female from the Gwen x Dillinger litter - but I chose to because all pups in the litter have huge potential in the ABKC show rings. The female I get will be shown, along with rebel, zeus, Storm and Mya. 

I DID NOT, nor would I ever - buy a puppy just for the intentions of breeding them. When I buy a puppy - I do so knowing that there is no guarantee they will turn out to stay 100% within breed standard and be suitable for breeding. As many of you should already know - this is a chance that many people take when they buy a pup. What I paid for this puppy is irrelevant and was NOT something my daughter even should have shared in this forum. I did not pay what I did because I think this puppy is guaranteed to be a breeder female. I paid what I did because : I wanted a puppy from a good line - with proven sound structures and proven sound temperaments - from a breeder that I have gotten to know -who has a good reputation. The price is not anyone's concern and I have mentioned that fact to my daughter already. If I choose to pay 500 or 3000 - that is my decision. 

FYI: I had 2nd pick from this litter and Female A is the one I ended up with. What makes it nice is that she is the one I wanted. NOT because I know she will grow to match my males structures - but because I believe she has the potential to do really well in the ABKC show rings. Even if she does well in the show rings - that does not mean her structure at full growth will be suitable for breeding to my male. HECK - I still don't know if Zeus will be suitable for breeding reasons - he has not fully matured yet.

SO please excuse my daughter for speaking too fast and not being totally clear with what she has said. I do not want anyone believing I pick a puppy out based on what they can breed for me. I pick out a puppy based on the potential I see regarding structure, temperament, ability to show well in the show rings, etc - if they can be bred in my program later, once matured - that is a "bonus" so to speak - But is not my 1st priority when I buy a dog.

If anyone has any further comments or concerns regarding the situation - please address them to me --- as I am the one suited to answer them accurately. THANKS in advance - LOL!


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Btpb mom: maybe you should be telling your daughter to just not speak on your dogs at all... You are absolutely right that you can do and buy whatever you like BUTthe way your daughter talks about your "program" doesn't make you seem all that legit... No offense but it sounds from her statements like you breed for money amongst other things... I'm just saying maybe if she hasn't learned the "right things to say" from you she shouldn't say anything about your "program" at all...


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

I have nothing against you getting the puppy I would like to say as it is cute. But is is talked about like it will be breeding stock and if you and the other kennel have been in this for the time you say I would think they would be breeding against dogs that have E/W and not putting 2 E/W dogs together and for you getting future stock I don't see why you would get it from a dog that both parents are E/W. 


I like you guys and I love your dogs but things like this make me highly question your breeding program.


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## BTPBMom (Nov 10, 2010)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Btpb mom: maybe you should be telling your daughter to just not speak on your dogs at all... You are absolutely right that you can do and buy whatever you like BUTthe way your daughter talks about your "program" doesn't make you seem all that legit... No offense but it sounds from her statements like you breed for money amongst other things... I'm just saying maybe if she hasn't learned the "right things to say" from you she shouldn't say anything about your "program" at all...


I am talking to my daughter about talking about my program - because I AGREE - she does not speak accurately and does not think of what things look like when she posts. However, she is a 18yr old that has "medical conditions" that leave her unable to completely process and then compose what she has heard or read in the appropriate manner - not that I think I need to explain that to you.

The bottom line is this: she is young and as we all know - we all start and learn some where - I will not make her feel like she is not allowed to speak at all about these breeds and what she is attempting to learn. She does the best she can with making statements about things she learns - to the best of her ability right now.


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## BTPBMom (Nov 10, 2010)

American_Pit13 said:


> I have nothing against you getting the puppy I would like to say as it is cute. But is is talked about like it will be breeding stock and if you and the other kennel have been in this for the time you say I would think they would be breeding against dogs that have E/W and not putting 2 E/W dogs together and for you getting future stock I don't see why you would get it from a dog that both parents are E/W.
> 
> I like you guys and I love your dogs but things like this make me highly question your breeding program.


As I said before - XENA was not bought to be considered breeding stock at this time. She is a 8 week old puppy - there is NO WAY to know what she will fully develop into at this time. Once she is matured and finished through the show rings - if she is breeding quality and health tests okay - I will decide at that time whether she will be bred.

Since you don't know me - You don't know what I care about as far as these breeds are concerned. You also don't know the parents in question to this puppy personally - you should know just as well as I do that pictures do NOT always show the most accurate structures of a dog or a puppy. I have seen video's, numerous pictures of both parents- I know people who have seen them in person - as well as my husband seeing them in person. I have seen several other dogs produced from the same 2 parents - all of whom have excellent structures. Neither parent in question is E/W - something that can can appear as present to some extent in a photograph based on whether the dog is stacked properly and the way the photo is taken.

In person ( which is the only true way to judge a structure ) - the parents to this puppy are structurally sound. I can take dogs that are not E/W in person and take a picture of them at various times and the possibility of E/W can come into play based on several different circumstances. Judge a dog by a photo if that is what you choose - the point is that I personally know the dogs are fine - and that is what matters.

If you read what I wrote - not my daughter - you would CLEARLY see that I have stated several times that I have no way of knowing if Xena will turn out structurally sound to be used in a breeding program - and if she does not turn out how she would need to for breeding - then I will still have a good dog - who will live out her days with our family.

SMH - I have learned from what I have seen many of you put my daughter through that this is not a place she needs to be in order to learn more. My original hope was that by being active on here it would help her learn better how to communicate with the "adults" she is getting ready to have to deal with on a routine basis - but instead many of you have made her feel like giving up. Not just in this thread - but in many threads.

I would think that GROWN ADULTS would not be SO fast to judge a 18 yr old who is trying to learn as much as she can because she loves these breeds as well. No -she is not really good at putting her feelings into words or really good at getting what she means out the way she means it - but there is a reason for that - she has a Frontal Lobe disorder. Shall I break that down for people who insist on being ignorant?? She is not able to process things like you or I can. Obviously that makes it harder for her to express things correctly.

You all would have gotten ALOT farther with her by being nurturing and nice - not by making her feel stupid. Nothing like making her feel like she will never be able to get people to understand what she means - without being jumped on.

I DO WANT TO SAY - THANK YOU to those of you who have been patient and understanding with my daughter and not so quick to judge her. Unfortunately the rest of you have made her feel 10X worse.


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

No one here has been to quick to judge as the same consistency of post have been repeated the entire time both of you have been here.

I would love to see some photos of those dogs with correct fronts. After 12 years of being involved in these dogs its not to hard to see improper bone structure regardless of improper stacking. I could be wrong and would gladly admit it if proven so.

Edit: Never mind enough posted here. Sure has ALOT of photos of bad fronts for not having bad fronts.
I also went and looked the produced which showed the same issues so no I am not going to believe the photos where bad. Gwens video alone shows the weakness in her feet when she walks.


BTPB said:


> Dillengers pedigree: .: Pitbull Pedigree :.
> 
> Gwens: .: Pitbull Pedigree :.


No one is trying to make her feel stupid, but if your going to allow her to represent your kennel here you are going to have to deal with responses.

Not once has it been a posting of these are our pets, but these are show dogs, and this is our kennel and breeding... These things get questioned here as many people new to these dogs read this forum and we want to promote responsible breeding.

As for ignorance I would check yourself before calling out others for we responded to you not her. No one has responded to her since the last time you posted... Learn to read...

As for my self other than simple statements the only time I have expressed my full opinion has been in response to you....So again check your own ignorance.


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## DueceAddicTed (Sep 28, 2009)

I agree with Holly here ...

I understand your daughter has a condition. In all honestly it doesn't show in her posts and people aren't mind readers so they have no way of knowing til you just told everyone.
Members were not being rude, they were asking the same questions they would ask of anyone making statements of a breeding program or kennels they represent.
I personally do not treat anyone with a disability different then that of one with out one, I'm a firm believer that they to have to learn that the world is not all warm and cuddly too. Though in this thread people were rather fair in their questions. I'm sorry you feel this is not the place for her but I beg to differ she can learn lots even how to take critism in a controled environment. The staff here is always on top of things and had anyone been out of line they would have been delt with accordingly for not abiding by the rules we already have in place. I hope you reconsider and perhaps leave the breeding and kennel talk to your postings.

Edit: I'm sorry but you were the one that just put her out on frontville, she was being treated as an EQUAL......


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## fishinrob (Apr 14, 2010)

Cat Fight!!! Woo Hoo!!!!!!


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## pitbullmamanatl (Jun 1, 2010)

Looking at Ironman's site and Dillenger's ped.... He's UKC/ADBA registered but not ABKC registered.... ???
Ironman also states he is a pit bull yet calls him an XL male. That right there is enough to turn me off of getting a dog from them. That's just me though.... I'm nit picky.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

BTPBMom said:


> As I said before - XENA was not bought to be considered breeding stock at this time. She is a 8 week old puppy - there is NO WAY to know what she will fully develop into at this time. Once she is matured and finished through the show rings - if she is breeding quality and health tests okay - I will decide at that time whether she will be bred.
> 
> Since you don't know me - You don't know what I care about as far as these breeds are concerned. You also don't know the parents in question to this puppy personally - you should know just as well as I do that pictures do NOT always show the most accurate structures of a dog or a puppy. I have seen video's, numerous pictures of both parents- I know people who have seen them in person - as well as my husband seeing them in person. I have seen several other dogs produced from the same 2 parents - all of whom have excellent structures. Neither parent in question is E/W - something that can can appear as present to some extent in a photograph based on whether the dog is stacked properly and the way the photo is taken.
> 
> ...


Jumped on? Feeling ten times worse for what? I'm not following... Did you read everything? We were not flaming her, just trying to point her and you in the right direction based off of the information that we were provided within this thread. I think there was a huge misunderstanding on every ones part here, but on the same hand no one flamed her nor your breeding practices. Just wanted to help ya'll out as much as we can. I'm glad to read that you guys do have all of your T's crossed and I's dotted


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

I forgot to add this... A dog with correct fronts will photograph with correct fronts whether it is stacked or not. The purpose of training your dog to stack is to show off the good and to hide the incorrect. There is stacked and then there is free stack where the dog is standing as it naturally does.


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Mum has to come fix up the mess everytime


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## aimee235 (Apr 29, 2007)

I think it's mean to blame everything on her "disorder". What I judged from her posts was that she is smart and very willing to learn.

The thing is puppies are very cute and you become attached very quickly so when people post things that are meant to be helpful even "normal" people become upset. Your already emotionally attached and no one is gonna be super happy when someone says something is wrong with their dog(or perspective dog). No matter how major or minor it is. It's gonna sting and you have to get over it.

We don't want to make people feel stupid.


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

I don't have a disorder, but I remember being a teenager and running my mouth on the internet. Believe it or not, there is something to be learned from every form of interaction. Even if the thing you learn is when to execute a tactical withdrawal.

Nobody here has been overly pushy, IMO. I have no problem with mom coming to clarify things, but I do have a problem with_ my daughter has a disorder, handle her with kid gloves_. (Paraphrased of course.) Either let her engage in discussion like an adult with other adults who are not manhandling her, or coach her interactions off the board. Like I said, I have no problem with mom coming to bring clarity and illumination to the topic where it pertains to her dogs and her program. But if you don't like how your daughter is representing you, its not really up to us as a community at large to edit our replies when we are not even being rough with her in the first place.

Sometimes being overprotective is counterproductive. I came to greatly resent my mom for her interference in my life and now I live two states away from her.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

Okay so I read the whole thread and I think everyone handle the girls posts correcctly no one jumped on her or bashed her there were questions that people wanted answers too just like any other thread about someone picking a puppy. I think it was uncalled for the mother to come on here and tell us about her daughters illness we don't need to know that we were treating her kindly. Alot nicer than my son got treated on his board. I didn't jump in there and blast anyone. He needs to know that life isn't all hugs and bunnies. I hope that they both stick around and realize we only have the dogs best interest at heart.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

does anyone else notice the similarities in the mom and daughters typing/writing style? How do we know that there are really two different people using that user name?


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

I just see one young uneducated girl and a closed minded mother that is rubbing off on her daughter.


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

Well to bad, It sound like the mom might not let her come back to talk to us. She was asking questions and learning. She could have taught her mom a thing or two. Sorry if we hurt your feelings, sweetie I think we trying to help you understand what it takes to have a good respectable program.


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