# What to expect health wise?



## Deadbolt

My brother as well as I have been researching and we are looking at every angle here.

One question that came up between us was...

What are some health related issues to pay attention to, expect, or are common for bullys from classic/standard to xxl?

Let it out the good, the bad, the ugly...looking for anything you can offer from the most minor to the most extreme.

One note would be a properly bred dog from a reputable breeder not a BYB who doesnt care for the dog or the breed.


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## MY MIKADO

The most comman health issue I have seen in this breed is allergies.


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## PittyLover314

yes allergies. skin, food, enviormental. The allergies sometimes lead to skin issues, ear infections, stomach upsets. That is just a few my boy has had. Nothing to serious, but its a good idea to know before hand


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## pitbullmamanatl

Ah, hip and elbow problems are possible for those that keep their bully pups too heavy at such a young age. The bones are not developed enough to support so much weight and can cause fronts to turn amongst other issues.


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## Sadie

Getting to a good breeder is going to be the first and foremost thing you can do to ensure your getting a good quality bully ... They are out there you just have to find them. 

The larger ones like the xxl dogs are known to have cardiac and joint problems because they are bred to the extreme.... Again this can be prevented if you find a breeder who is health testing the parent's that helps to rule out any of these issues early on.... Also they are limited to the amount of working ability due to their size .. However the classic style bullies still maintain an overall healthy size that would allow them to maintain working ability without causing any strain on the heart, joints, and structure longterm. 

Any time you breed blue on blue your bound to have skin allergies .. I owned a blue dog I know LOL .. The over diluting or doubling up on the dilute genes causes the skin issues/allergy induced problems and infections due to the lack of pigment. So if you get a blue dog be prepared for that.


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## Deadbolt

Sadie said:


> Getting to a good breeder is going to be the first and foremost thing you can do to ensure your getting a good quality bully ... They are out there you just have to find them.
> 
> The larger ones like the xxl dogs are known to have cardiac and joint problems because they are bred to the extreme.... Again this can be prevented if you find a breeder who is health testing the parent's that helps to rule out any of these issues early on.... Also they are limited to the amount of working ability due to their size .. However the classic style bullies still maintain an overall healthy size that would allow them to maintain working ability without causing any strain on the heart, joints, and structure longterm.
> 
> Any time you breed blue on blue your bound to have skin allergies .. I owned a blue dog I know LOL .. The over diluting or doubling up on the dilute genes causes the skin issues/allergy induced problems and infections due to the lack of pigment. So if you get a blue dog be prepared for that.


Thanks for the input...thats something new to me with the coloration. Ive never owned dogs bred specifically for color. So a blue dog will almost always have some form of skin issues if both parents were also blue?

I knew the larger breeds and the xxl were prone to joint and hip problems due to their size but didn't know about cardiac issues. With a clean diet and proper exercise should one have to worry or better yet would one have to worry about exercising them to much?



pitbullmamanatl said:


> Ah, hip and elbow problems are possible for those that keep their bully pups too heavy at such a young age. The bones are not developed enough to support so much weight and can cause fronts to turn amongst other issues.


Thank you! At how many weeks is ones structure strong enough to keep them in shape and work them...I would guess 8 months? I know not to run them to much or to hard the first few months of their lives keeping it short to 10-20 minutes max but at one point is it safe to play with spring poles and work up to mile hikes etc etc?


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## Deadbolt

PittyLover314 said:


> yes allergies. skin, food, enviormental. The allergies sometimes lead to skin issues, ear infections, stomach upsets. That is just a few my boy has had. Nothing to serious, but its a good idea to know before hand





MY MIKADO said:


> The most comman health issue I have seen in this breed is allergies.


thanks for the input ya'll...I take it a sustained comfy home and proper management will do just fine to treat that?


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## Sadie

Deadbolt said:


> Thanks for the input...thats something new to me with the coloration. Ive never owned dogs bred specifically for color. So a blue dog will almost always have some form of skin issues if both parents were also blue?
> 
> I knew the larger breeds and the xxl were prone to joint and hip problems due to their size but didn't know about cardiac issues. With a clean diet and proper exercise should one have to worry or better yet would one have to worry about exercising them to much?


A lot of American Bullies were bred for Color specifically BLUE ... I don't know how much you have studied up on genetics but in a nut shell when you breed 2 blue dog's they can only reproduce blue dogs. Blue is a Dilute of Black- so the color BLUE is considered a diluted color. When you breed diluted colors over and over what your doing is weakening the pigment and doubling up on those diluted genes. This is what makes blue dogs prone to skin/allergy issues ....it's better to breed a blue dog to a red dog. Or a blue dog to a fawn dog... Because your adding back pigment that's been lost from over diluting and your not doubling up those dilute genes by breeding blue on blue .. I hope this makes sense. Genetics can be a pretty complicated subject that even I don't fully understand but I am still learning ...

With the larger xxl's those dogs are already predisposed to those conditions so even with clean diet and exercise it won't matter if the issues are genetic. That is why I stress the importance of health testing and getting one of these types of dog from a breeder that does health test the parent's (and they are cleared OFA/PENNHIP prior to breeding them .. this is just more piece of mind that you will likely have a healthy dog long term. It's always good to maintain good diet and exercise though regardless. The cardiac issues usually stem for a dog being extreme some of them are just so large that heat and exercise can put an even bigger strain on dogs and they collapse and die. Or they have a congenital heart issue that the added bone mass and size just add's extra strain on the heart I will post the links for you about the health testing so you can read more about it ...

Orthopedic Foundation for Animals

PennHIP Home


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## pitbullmamanatl

Deadbolt said:


> thanks for the input ya'll...I take it a sustained comfy home and proper management will do just fine to treat that?


I suggest feeding a RAW diet to help with skin issues/allergies. It isn't for everyone, but worth a try. It is everything your dog needs and nothing he doesn't.


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## Deadbolt

Sadie said:


> A lot of American Bullies were bred for Color specifically BLUE ... I don't know how much you have studied up on genetics but in a nut shell when you breed 2 blue dog's they can only reproduce blue dogs. Blue is a Dilute of Black- so the color BLUE is considered a diluted color. When you breed diluted colors over and over what your doing is weakening the pigment and doubling up on those diluted genes. This is what makes blue dogs prone to skin/allergy issues ....it's better to breed a blue dog to a red dog. Or a blue dog to a fawn dog... Because your adding back pigment that's been lost from over diluting and your not doubling up those dilute genes by breeding blue on blue .. I hope this makes sense. Genetics can be a pretty complicated subject that even I don't fully understand but I am still learning ...
> 
> With the larger xxl's those dogs are already predisposed to those conditions so even with clean diet and exercise it won't matter if the issues are genetic. That is why I stress the importance of health testing and getting one of these types of dog from a breeder that does health test the parent's (and they are cleared OFA/PENNHIP prior to breeding them .. this is just more piece of mind that you will likely have a healthy dog long term. It's always good to maintain good diet and exercise though regardless. The cardiac issues usually stem for a dog being extreme some of them are just so large that heat and exercise can put an even bigger strain on dogs and they collapse and die. Or they have a congenital heart issue that the added bone mass and size just add's extra strain on the heart I will post the links for you about the health testing so you can read more about it ...
> 
> Orthopedic Foundation for Animals
> 
> PennHIP Home


I have studied some about genetics in school and on my own for various purposes and I understand 100% what you are talking about. I guess its just another question I will be adding to the list to ask breeders when I find enough.

Thank you for the links I will read through them tonight after work!


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## angelbaby

Id have to disagree with the blue dogs having skin issues my girl is blue and both of her parents were blue and she has the nicest coat and skin. I know the larger xxl bullies can have respiratory issues if you let them get obese there are some nice xxl dogs that are healthy and fit but you need to keep the fat off of them. like lauren said you gotta watch the hip problems very common in the breed. everyone else has already touched on teh main issues, good luck with what ever you decide to get


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## Deadbolt

angelbaby said:


> I know the larger xxl bullies can have respiratory issues if you let them get obese there are some nice xxl dogs that are healthy and fit but you need to keep the fat off of them.


Oh that wont be a problem one bit...I refuse to let my dog be out of shape haha...hell Im so anal I dont even let my leapord ghecko get out of shape. She has to do a few sprints for her meals and she is kept trim LOL.


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## Indigo Bully Connection

I have to stick my nose in this one... Particularly with these bully type dogs... 

I agree, weak immune systems are passed on, but NOT because of the simple color, but because of the way the pedigree was put together for these blue dogs. When you line or inbreed you bring out both the negative as well as the positive things within the pedigree. Without any culling process you cannot begin to hold a valid argument that is truly related to color instead of the representatives we have chose to base the foundation of the breed. 

three- four years ago the statement that they are bred for color may have held it's own in an argument, but with the information we have covered time and time again within this very forum states otherwise. . 

It has happened and will continue to be done blue x blue breedings without skin conditions/ allergies. It's a matter of the breeders personal goals within their program whether or not they chose to eliminate the bad apples from their program.


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## pitbullmamanatl

Deadbolt said:


> Oh that wont be a problem one bit...I refuse to let my dog be out of shape haha...hell Im so anal I dont even let my leapord ghecko get out of shape. She has to do a few sprints for her meals and she is kept trim LOL.


OMG I am dying. Too funny. My leopard gecko was super fat poor thing.


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## pitbullmamanatl

Indigo Bully Connection said:


> I have to stick my nose in this one... Particularly with these bully type dogs...
> 
> I agree, weak immune systems are passed on, but NOT because of the simple color, but because of the way the pedigree was put together for these blue dogs. When you line or inbreed you bring out both the negative as well as the positive things within the pedigree. Without any culling process you cannot begin to hold a valid argument that is truly related to color instead of the representatives we have chose to base the foundation of the breed.
> 
> three- four years ago the statement that they are bred for color may have held it's own in an argument, but with the information we have covered time and time again within this very forum states otherwise. .
> 
> It has happened and will continue to be done blue x blue breedings without skin conditions/ allergies. It's a matter of the breeders personal goals within their program whether or not they chose to eliminate the bad apples from their program.


:goodpost::goodpost:, Shana!


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## Sadie

I disagree .. There are many breeder's who do not agree with blue on blue breeding's for the reasons I have stated ... There is ton's of info on genetics and blue dog syndrome and all of the issues that arise from these practices ... You breed blue on blue over and over again ignoring the importance of skin pigment your going to have problems. I am not making this stuff up it's proven. No not ever blue dog walking around has skin/allergy problems but MANY of them do.


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## Sadie

Deadbolt said:


> Thanks for the input...thats something new to me with the coloration. Ive never owned dogs bred specifically for color. So a blue dog will almost always have some form of skin issues if both parents were also blue?
> 
> I knew the larger breeds and the xxl were prone to joint and hip problems due to their size but didn't know about cardiac issues. With a clean diet and proper exercise should one have to worry or better yet would one have to worry about exercising them to much?


Deadbolt here is another good read for you about the whole Blue dog thing ...

Blue pitbulls


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## pitbullmamanatl

*Alopecia*
CDA which is also known as "Blue dog syndrome" is Alopecia and it is not directly related to just blue dogs. It is related to all dogs with a diluted pigment and blue is only one of the dilutions.... one of the many many many dilutions. It is something to look into, but in my opinion, it doesn't seem like a health concern that would be uncomfortable for the dog. Weimeraners as a breed are dd, all individuals are dilute, yet the disease is unreported in this breed. In Dobermans, the dilute individuals comprise only 8-9% of the breed, yet 50-80% of the dilute dogs have CDA. My point is.... it isn't just bully bred blue dogs.


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## Indigo Bully Connection

Sadie said:


> I disagree .. There are many breeder's who do not agree with blue on blue breeding's for the reasons I have stated ... There is ton's of info on genetics and blue dog syndrome and all of the issues that arise from these practices ... You breed blue on blue over and over again ignoring the importance of skin pigment your going to have problems. I am not making this stuff up it's proven. No not ever blue dog walking around has skin/allergy problems but MANY of them do.


Blue dog syndrome also known as CDA is alopecia is related to diluted coat color genes as a whole. It's not just for blues 

I by no means insinuated that someone should be breeding strictly FOR color... there are so many aspects to take into consideration before putting two dogs together to get rich or die trying. What I meant was, as a kennel owner myself... I wouldn't eliminate a compatible stud for my bitch based off of color, just like i wouldn't let the color affect my decision to use that dog. If the dogs structures and temperaments through out the pedigree are complimentary... As a breeder you should keep records and get to know all of the dogs at least within the first three generations and get input about the dogs that have been produced by them.

What has been created can be undone as long as you adhere to some sort of culling process and not let the bad gene continue.

The rocky part of the "research" that is out there on the web is that they are not locating, identifying, and minipulating these genes over 5-20 years of breeding. it's all about their case subjects, their direct off spring and possibly the offspring of the offspring. There is not enough of a control.


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## pitbullmamanatl

Indigo Bully Connection said:


> Blue dog syndrome also known as CDA is alopecia is related to diluted coat color genes as a whole. It's not just for blues
> 
> I by no means insinuated that someone should be breeding strictly FOR color... there are so many aspects to take into consideration before putting two dogs together to get rich or die trying. What I meant was, as a kennel owner myself... I wouldn't eliminate a compatible stud for my bitch based off of color, just like i wouldn't let the color affect my decision to use that dog. If the dogs structures and temperaments through out the pedigree are complimentary... As a breeder you should keep records and get to know all of the dogs at least within the first three generations and get input about the dogs that have been produced by them.
> 
> What has been created can be undone as long as you adhere to some sort of culling process and not let the bad gene continue.
> 
> The rocky part of the "research" that is out there on the web is that they are not locating, identifying, and minipulating these genes over 5-20 years of breeding. it's all about their case subjects, their direct off spring and possibly the offspring of the offspring. There is not enough of a control.


Agreed and :goodpost:!


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## Sadie

Guys .. this guy is looking for honest answer's a blue dog is a blue dog regardless ... The point is and this is not a lie the American Bully was bred for looks color being part of that .. The whole blue dog thing was pimped out as rare and a great deal of bullies are blue and were bred for that RARE blue color even though it was never rare .. So one has to take these issues into account if we are being honest about this subject. I never said all blue bullies were unhealthy because they are blue but because of how they were bred it puts them at a disposition to have issues with the skin due to the blue on blue breedings. That's my take on it I posted an article for the OP if he wants to learn more about this subject.


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## Indigo Bully Connection

Sadie said:


> Guys .. this guy is looking for honest answer's a blue dog is a blue dog regardless ... The point is and this is not a lie the American Bully was bred for looks color being part of that .. The whole blue dog thing was pimped out as rare and a great deal of bullies are blue and were bred for that RARE blue color even though it was never rare .. So one has to take these issues into account if we are being honest about this subject. I never said all blue bullies were unhealthy because they are blue but because of how they were bred it puts them at a disposition to have issues with the skin due to the blue on blue breedings. That's my take on it I posted an article for the OP if he wants to learn more about this subject.


Unfortunately, your assumptions of the creation of the American Bully is incorrect once again. The American Bully was not created FOR a blue anything. It was created with a life style in mind. The majority of their heritage was from the Am Staff and show bred APBT. Blue just happened when the gene pool got smaller.


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## Sadie

As I stated the American Bully was bred for looks that was the original purpose when you take looks into account we look at size, color, being the main things. This breed may have a different purpose now but it didn't when it first started .. So I have to disagree with you there.... I am not going to get into a pissing match with you about it. There is more than enough evidence to support what I am saying. Technically they are not even a breed they are a TYPE of dog. But I am not here to bash these dogs I am trying to help the OP I posted a very informative link about the cautions of buying a blue dog there are some concerns that need to be taken into account.


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## Sadie

Indigo Bully Connection said:


> Blue dog syndrome also known as CDA is alopecia is related to diluted coat color genes as a whole. It's not just for blues
> 
> I by no means insinuated that someone should be breeding strictly FOR color... there are so many aspects to take into consideration before putting two dogs together to get rich or die trying. What I meant was, as a kennel owner myself... I wouldn't eliminate a compatible stud for my bitch based off of color, just like i wouldn't let the color affect my decision to use that dog. If the dogs structures and temperaments through out the pedigree are complimentary... As a breeder you should keep records and get to know all of the dogs at least within the first three generations and get input about the dogs that have been produced by them.
> 
> What has been created can be undone as long as you adhere to some sort of culling process and not let the bad gene continue.
> 
> The rocky part of the "research" that is out there on the web is that they are not locating, identifying, and minipulating these genes over 5-20 years of breeding. it's all about their case subjects, their direct off spring and possibly the offspring of the offspring. There is not enough of a control.


And furthermore no one is saying that through selective breeding and culling that issues can't be corrected .... Which is why I said FIND A GOOD BREEDER!!! Because a good breeder is not going to be breeding for color they are going to be breeding quality animals.... So don't twist up my words. I simply brought it out on the table because the OP asked what he should be concerned about health wise .. Well I think considering how many breeder's of these dog's have pimped the color blue out for so long ignoring skin pigment it's a legitimate concern that it be brought up. There is a right and a wrong way to do everything but unfortunately these dog's haven't always been bred to ethical standards but we won't go there the positive side of it is now there are bully breeder's who are breeding to ethical standards and are selectively breeding and culling to create healthier animals.


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## angelbaby

pitbullmamanatl said:


> *Alopecia*
> CDA which is also known as "Blue dog syndrome" is Alopecia and it is not directly related to just blue dogs. It is related to all dogs with a diluted pigment and blue is only one of the dilutions.... one of the many many many dilutions. It is something to look into, but in my opinion, it doesn't seem like a health concern that would be uncomfortable for the dog. Weimeraners as a breed are dd, all individuals are dilute, yet the disease is unreported in this breed. In Dobermans, the dilute individuals comprise only 8-9% of the breed, yet 50-80% of the dilute dogs have CDA. My point is.... it isn't just bully bred blue dogs.


:goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:


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## angelbaby

Indigo Bully Connection said:


> Blue dog syndrome also known as CDA is alopecia is related to diluted coat color genes as a whole. It's not just for blues
> 
> I by no means insinuated that someone should be breeding strictly FOR color... there are so many aspects to take into consideration before putting two dogs together to get rich or die trying. What I meant was, as a kennel owner myself... I wouldn't eliminate a compatible stud for my bitch based off of color, just like i wouldn't let the color affect my decision to use that dog. If the dogs structures and temperaments through out the pedigree are complimentary... As a breeder you should keep records and get to know all of the dogs at least within the first three generations and get input about the dogs that have been produced by them.
> 
> What has been created can be undone as long as you adhere to some sort of culling process and not let the bad gene continue.
> 
> The rocky part of the "research" that is out there on the web is that they are not locating, identifying, and minipulating these genes over 5-20 years of breeding. it's all about their case subjects, their direct off spring and possibly the offspring of the offspring. There is not enough of a control.


:clap::goodpost:


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## Deadbolt

Thanks for the info ya'l!!! Im keeping my nose clean and just absorbing on this one heh.


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## Cindy1979

What about ataxia and heartproblems?


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## pitbullmamanatl

Cindy1979 said:


> What about ataxia and heartproblems?


Here is a thread about *ataxia*. 
Ataxia is a common Am Staff problem and most Bullies have predominately Am Staff peds so anything is possible. It is rumored many heavier bullies have heart problems, but I have not seen hard proof. Just remember that owner care plays a big part in a dog's health and even if you get a bully whose parents have been heart tested (which you probably won't find unless you get a pup from Semper Fi and they stingy with their productions lol jk Manny and Steph) it is still possible to have a dog with heart problems even if the parents did not have any.


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## bahamutt99

I would think that blue x blue _over the generations_ would result in washed-out pigment and other issues when you breed extensively for a recessive trait. That's not to say that a single blue x blue breeding would produce defective pups. But over time, if you don't reintroduce some strong pigment, you're going to end up with dogs that are silver (and therefore worth more, don'tcha know? LOL).


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## pitbullmamanatl

bahamutt99 said:


> I would think that blue x blue _over the generations_ would result in washed-out pigment and other issues when you breed extensively for a recessive trait. That's not to say that a single blue x blue breeding would produce defective pups. But over time, if you don't reintroduce some strong pigment, you're going to end up with dogs that are silver (*and therefore worth more, don'tcha know? LOL*).


lol Lindsay:rofl:


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