# Apbt Trivia!



## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

What kind of dog is the brother breed to the APBT? And what was the early name for the APBT that was also used to call this kind of dog?

***Now that I read^^ It's kind of confusing I'll reword it***

A brother breed to the APBT is the __________? And Another name for the ________ was also an early name for the APBT. What was this name?


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

wow.the question is kinda a trip so ill take a whole lotta guesses,lol,ill guarentee i nail it with one of these,lol..
As far as i know the apbt was bred from staffy bulls and evolved into its own breed,possably you could be refering to the scottish "blue paul",or the irish "red smut" but these dogs are more of the fathers rather than the brothers..all this is fine and well but i gotta belive your talkin about the american bulldog,it is the brother of the apbt,and up intill 1984 was known as the american pitbull dog,it was said that the only diffrence between the two was a 15% terrier in the apbt,although today the apbt or many of them seem to have no terrier in them as breeders tend to want a bully type apbt,also the american bulldog has changed alot in its own right through the infusing of st bernard,mastiff etc,but back in the day they were virtually the same...My finall answer american bull dog


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## redog (Oct 14, 2005)

Maybe Bull and terrier?


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Lol! U guys are going to be shocked when you find out the answer. I sure as hell was.


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

I would say the early name would be the "bull and terreir" and the brother breed would be the Olde English Bulldogge.


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Early name Pit bull terrier......brother---Staffordshire Terrier.

Origins of the APBT go way back into Western European mastiffs which inturn led to the bulldog. From there The English and Irish took the bulldog and terriers and began cross breeding. THe English White Terrier, the black and tan terriers eventually led to the bull terrier and the crosses due to sport and baiting led to the Boston Terrier. The Boston terrier greatly resembles alot of the APBT traits. So they English bull baiting dogs lead to the bulldog and continued crosses of this bulldog breed with performance bull baiting dogs formed the foundation.

Now names.....

The "Pit bull terrier" originated in England for bull/blood sports. With the outlawing of the sports and dog fighting being introduced in America the name stuck for the dogfighters. However back in England the same dogs had been renamed Stffordshir Pit Terriers.

When the owners wanted a registry Chauncey Benette formed the UKC (1898)to register Pit Bull Terriers but there was a fuss over the name between the AKC and the UKC so "American" was added to the name and ORIGINALLY "Pit" was dropped. So you had American Bull Terriers being registerd. However the name PIT snuck back in and now you have the American Pit Bull Terrier. Thus why you cant register APBT with the AKC and they only recognize the English Staffordshire Bull Terrier and Staffordshire Terrier.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

***Hint***

*This breed that I'm talking about is a smaller breed!*


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

rat terrier


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

how about the "Patterdale Terrier", they look like miniature APBTs.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

*And the answer is....*

*Boston Terrier*. The ABPT and Boston Terrier were both called the "*American Bull Terrier*" at one point.

A brother breed to the the APBT is the Boston Terrir. The original Boston Terrier is clearly a very close relative of the original APBT. A number of books about the Boston Terrier make the following assertions:
~Both breeds were originally about the same size, approximately 35 pounds.
~Hopper's "Judge," the founding sire of the BT breed, was identified as a bull-and-terrier cross and was imported around 1865 from England by William O'Brien of Boston,Massachusetts.
~Judge, described as"more like a bulldog than a terrier" was dark brindle w/ white markings on his face and a white chest.
~Judge had cropped ears, a common surgery performed on pit dogs.
~Judge weighed 32 pounds and"...was a well-built and high stationed(tall) dog."
~Both breeds clearly demonstratd their bull and terrier heritage.
~An early name for the Boston was the "round-headed Bull and Terrier"
~Another early name for the Boston was also an early name for the APBT, the "American Bull Terrier"
~Both breeds are athletic and packed with power; prominent writers still remark on how much the physiques of the two breeds look alike.
~Both were originally bred and then imported to America for the same purpose-to fight in the pits against other dogs.
~From bull and terrier stock, imported to the US from Britain, the BT was number one on the AKC's list of most popular breeds in America for many years.
http://books.google.com/books?id=sY...andbook&sig=cKAnTXKu3lXUtX1adzBr7tl_vu4&hl=en
**All info from above is from The American Pit Bull Terrier Handbook by Joe Stahlkuppe**

Comparison. Colby's Logan(APBT) and Int.Ch. Oranjelust Royal Showman 
U.S. Import (BT)


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

> THe English White Terrier, the black and tan terriers eventually led to the bull terrier and the crosses due to sport and baiting led to the Boston Terrier. The Boston terrier greatly resembles alot of the APBT traits


So do I get any points for that?


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

YESS!! U sure do Oldfort!!!


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Do I at least get a loosing ribbon


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> Do I at least get a loosing ribbon


Lol. U get a an effort ribbon!you gave a good answer!


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

LOl i was going to say Bull dog, hahah i will give myself a million points for that!!!:cheers:


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

That was a great posting Tashaslegend very interesting I alway thought the two looked a lot alike but never looked in to their backgrounds.:clap:


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

I like Trivia it helps us learn so lets keep this going!!!

this one should be easy.

Lets do some bloodwork some of the foundation greats

give me the parents to JEEP.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

MY MIKADO said:


> That was a great posting Tashaslegend very interesting I alway thought the two looked a lot alike but never looked in to their backgrounds.:clap:


Thanks I thought it was interesting. Also b/c Legend has this thing for Boston Terriers. He absolutely loves them! He has a couple of Boston Buddies that he plays with. I just thought it was strange since he really doesnt pay small dogs any attention.


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

OldFortKennels said:


> I like Trivia it helps us learn so lets keep this going!!!
> 
> this one should be easy.
> 
> ...


Oh! Oh! Oh! I know! I know! ....... I think  .... I hope so...

Finley's Ch. Bo ROM and Crenshaw's Ch. Honeybunch ROM


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> Oh! Oh! Oh! I know! I know! ....... I think  .... I hope so...
> 
> Finley's Ch. Bo ROM and Crenshaw's Ch. Honeybunch ROM


Yup I do believe thats right. I remember reading it somewhere.


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Yeah that was to easy!


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Okay I have another one.

What does ROM mean and how many points did JEEP earn on his ROM?


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

register of merit[rom].
this has to do with how many grch a grch offspring continues to produce.right off hand with out acssesing game dogs or apbt pedigrees online im gonna say 19,or perhaps that was chinaman:woof: ...


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

*U are correct Cane!!!*

A male dog becomes eligible to be placed on the R.O.M. list if he has sired four or more champions. The R.O.M. dog will be awarded one point for every champion he has sired and will receive one additional point if any of the offspring should go on to become a Grand Champion. 
The rules are the same for bitches to get on the Register of Merit list, except,a bitch need only be the dam of three (3) Champions to gain a spot on the list.

19 points
Crenshaws CH JEEP

14 points
Tant's GR CH YELLOW

13 points
Garner's FRISCO

11 points
STP GRCH BUCK

9 points
Long's WEIRDO

8 points
WCC Deacon
Southern Knls GRCH MAYDAY
White's TAB

7 points
Giroux BOOGER
Finley's CH BO
Lee's CH RENO
Patrick's TOMBSTONE

6 points
Allen's BUTCH
Untouchable's CH Butkus
Mountain Man's CH Homer
Patricks HOMER
W&P's LITTLE BOOTS
LG's CH LITTLE MAN
Wildside Knls LUCIFER
Ling Limey's NELIS
Crenshaws CH OTIS
Snakeman's GRCH PEDRO
Busenbarks CH RATLER
Rebel Knls CH SUNDANCE
Rolling Hill Knls CH TAZ
O. Stevens GRCH VIRGIL
Chavis CH YELLOW JOHN

5 points
R. Hall's GRCH ANDY CAPP
Dave's BLACK POISON
Boyle's CH BOLTACTION
Rebel Knls CH BUBBA
Loposay's BUSTER
Kamakazee Knls HUNTER RED
DreamTeam CH JESSE JAMES
RC/Soso Boys CH FRITZ
Hammond's RUFUS
Mason's SMILEY
Otter's CH TONKA BEAR
Bristol's CH THOR
O. Steven's TROLL
Rebels Knls CH TURTLE
Adam's GRCH ZEBO

4 points
Stinson/Glover GRCH ART
Smith & Walton GRCH Badger
Coy's GRCH BANJO
INDIAN BOLIO
Giroux GRCH CARLO
Holland GRCH CHEROK CHIEF
Garner's CHINAMAN
Giroux CH GUNNER
Goner's GARBALDI
O.Steven's CH HOMER
Phils Ch LITTLE GEORGE
Mayfields ******
Cherokee Knls OILER JR
Larson's RED ED
Hardcore Knls REDMAN
Smith & Williams REUBEN
Mayfields SNAKE
Woods SNOOTY
Carolina Knls CH TERMITE
Mister K'S TEX

3 points
Smith/Walton CH BAD BILLY
Patricks BULLYBOY BOD
Harris ELI III
Thibodeaux EMILE
R. Sorrells GATORSON
Randy's GONNER
Norrod's IRON SPIKE
McCollums JESSIE JR
Redb's REDDOG
B. Sorrells RED JERRY
Hargrove's SPANKY
Matlock's TRUCK

FEMALES
7 points
JC Shaw CH Honeybunch

5 points
StoneCity AWESOME BABY
Road Warriors BOOGER
Boyle's LIMITED EDITION
B Line LITTLE BITS
LG's MISS KIM

4 points
Byrd's ANGIE B
WCC ASSASSINATOR
Lewis CH CATFISH
Boyles DIRTY MARY
Hollingsworth DOLLY
Wright's JILL
Boyles LADY UNDERTAKER
DreamTeam CH LITTLE BIT
McCollums LYDA
Undertaker Knls MS LEAKY
O.Steven's RAMONA
King Limey's TUG

3 points
TKO Combine's AUTUMS
Can Am Boys CH BECKY
HardCore Knls BREAKER
Mister K's BUP
Losco's COLLEEN
Man's CRAZY TIPPI
Untouchable's DAISY MAE
BulldogHeaven's GERALDINE
Lee's HANNAH
Duprel's JILL
Yankee Boys LUCI
Ozarks Jim's LUCY
Havannah Boys MAGGIE
Fitch's MEAN JOLENE
Hackman's MISS CHAMP
Hardcore Knls PEPSI
I.Jerry's MS POOLHALL RED
Patrick's RED BABY
Hollingsworth RED LADY
Barbwire Knls ROXY
Giroux RED PINKY
Rolling Hills SAPELO
Tomsic's SPIDER
Boyles TEA CUP


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## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

Wow, this is a good thread. I would have said the brother dog to an APBT would be the American Bull Dog, but that was wrong.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Who was Rushin Bills Grand Champion? And how did he get his name?


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

smokey joe,i gusse there half brothers,lol.But at on time they were basically the same.


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## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

cane76 said:


> smokey joe,i gusse there half brothers,lol.But at on time they were basically the same.


I love American Bull Dogs. I didn't know there was such a thing until a guy I worked with was telling me his stepdaughter had one and started telling me about them. He showed me a pic and they look just like APBT's to me, just bigger. I did a little research, and they seem like pretty cool dogs.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

smokey_joe said:


> I love American Bull Dogs. I didn't know there was such a thing until a guy I worked with was telling me his stepdaughter had one and started telling me about them. He showed me a pic and they look just like APBT's to me, just bigger. I did a little research, and they seem like pretty cool dogs.


American Bulldogs are cool. One of Legend's best buddies is an American Bulldog named Drake. He comes to stay at my house when his parents are out of town. I didnt want to give him back! lol. Legend adores him!


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Yeah, Am Bulldogs are a great breed :thumbsup:


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Ive got no idea what rushin bills grch name is[or who rushin bill is],ya got me.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

*The answer is...*

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme3/heartoftheapbt/35.html








BREEDER: UNKNOWN
OWNER: RUSHIN KENNELS
SEX: MALE
COLOR: RED
CHAIN WEIGHT: 45
CONDITIONED WEIGHT: 38-40

8XW from the Southwest U.S. He was bought from a drifter for $35. Bill believes him to be Heinzl. Tim, had pups off him that looked like Bolio. He was very smart with alot of mouth. His last win was at age 8, went 1:30 and he won on gameness.

Rushin Bill's Gr Ch 35 
Many of us have read the depiction of the great "35" dogs 3rd match in Richard Stratton's book. I thought it might be interesting if Rushin Bill would elaborate some more on the life and times of that outstanding canine warrior of the 1980's and he has kindly consented to do so. Hopefully this will clear up any misconceptions, if there are any, about that dog and his amazing career and enlighten and amuse our readers in so doing. Hope you enjoy it. ( Ed. )

GR. CH. "35" THE BEGINNING

It was a blistering hot day in central Oklahoma the second time I saw the little buckskin dog that, as fate would have it, was eventually to change my life. We were in the midst of the heat wave of 1980, suffering through over forty straight days of hundred degree plus temperatures, and when I heard the knock at my door, I really didn't feel like answering, not just because of the heat, but due mostly to one of the worst hangovers of my adult life. Fortunately I did answer, only to be confronted by a fellow who looked at least as bad as I felt. I didn't recognize him immediately as we had only met once before and it wasn't until I saw the dog in the back seat of his car that I knew who it was that had summoned me from my nauseous stupor aboard the "porcelain pony" in my bathroom.

He probably didn't remember my name either as we had only spoken briefly one day when I had seen him walking the pup and stopped to ask about it. He didn't know how the dog was bred and said only that a friend had given it to him as a young pup the last time he passed through New Mexico, judging from his apparent age, at least six or eight months ago. I thought no more about the man or his pup until that day, several months later, when in the scorching midday sun, he and the dog showed up on my doorstep.

He said, "I know you know about these dogs and I was wondering if you would give me thirty -five dollars for him. I have to go away to McAlester (state prison) for a few months and my wife doesn't like the dog. Its okay if you want to fight him or whatever." My first impulse, standing there staring at him, his long sweat-soaked hair clinging to the ashen skin of his face and neck, (and my stomach doing cartwheels across my torso ) was to tell him to "take a hike" so I could rush back to my retreat in the "John". But a little voice in the back of my brain ( the crazy "dog man" voice ) said "Hey Bill, you cannot raise a pup to a year old for thirty-five dollars, much less buy one. Maybe you should give it a shot?" I said, "Wait here. Ill see if I have the cash." It turned out to be one of the luckiest ( if not the most immediately enjoyable ) decisions I've ever made.

I must confess I didn't even feel like walking the yearling pup for almost twenty-four hours. I just put him in a crate downstairs and went back to wishing I were temporarily dead. I remember marveling at how uncannily silent the dog was, never making a peep the whole time, nor did he soil his crate before I finally got around to taking him out. It was only then that I saw he was absolutely covered with ticks! They were in his ears, between his toes, in his armpits, everywhere! So, after he took a long, long pee and moved his bowels our first mission was to soak him good with a powerful insecticide. I noticed too, on that first walk with him, that he would go in any direction except where you wanted him to go, a trait which would stay with him the rest of his life. And one which isn't too convenient for trying to "empty out" a match dog.

I got him "wormed out" as well as taking care of the tick problem and wondered if my money might not have been better spent on feed for the twenty or so dogs I already owned. After all I didn't even know the breeding of the dog and what were the odds of this orphan turning out to be worth keeping? But he was mine now and the money was gone; I might as well keep an open mind about him and see how my investment turned out. I mean, I had some well bred dogs in my yard but nothing that was looking like a world-beater, and who knows, maybe this little buckskin dog would be that "ace" every dog man dreams of. He was already a year old so it wouldn't take much longer or much feed to find out. And he was a good-looking little dog, nice head, good body structure and big teeth!

Five or six weeks later I decided to walk him up to another of my males to see if he might be ready to start. I chose "Cody", a well bred "Hank"/ "Jesse", "Bolio" cross with some "old Wallace" and "Jim Williams" blood mixed in too. He was a few pounds larger and six months older than the buckskin pup, which at that point I don't think Id even chosen a name for; ( no sense in "wasting" a good name on a dog that would probably "quit" anyway, right? ) But this was just to be a "starter bump" anyway, to see how badly Id squandered my thirty-five bucks. I wouldn't let "Cody" hurt him, as "Cody" had started and looked promising in rolls and, of course, the pup had no experience at all. I intended to give him the same chance as all my dogs got, to "make the grade", though I vowed he would certainly get "game-tested" a lot harder due to my lack of confidence in his, at least to me, mysterious family tree.

I took him off his chain and approached "Cody" cautiously, as I didn't even bother to pick up a breaking stick, so sure was I that probably nothing would happen anyway between the two youngsters. "Cody" stiff-legged it and growled but before either "Cody" or myself could do anything to stop him ( we had different methods in mind, "Cody" and I ) the pup had grabbed "Cody" by the side of the head, flipped him over his shoulder and was vigorously shaking and working his hold! Fortunately I was seasoned enough not to panic but I was so surprised that it took me a few moments to collect myself enough to formulate a plan and get the now angrily combative, young adversaries apart. Later, after putting the soon to be named, buckskin "pup" back on his chain, I had a chance to ponder what had happened. What had happened? "How did that thirteen month old "pup" do that to "Cody", I wondered? Soon enough I would understand that it wasn't a fluke I had just witnessed but the coming of age of the best pit dog I have ever seen. That tick-infested, buckskin "pup" of unknown breeding was soon to become the feared, "35" Dollar Dog, destined to win eight straight contract matches, without a loss, and would eventually become known as the famous...GR. CH "35"


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Ah,damnn!!,
ive read that story.good one tasha,lol
He was called 35 because he was bought for 35$..duh.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

I got one that might be alittle difficult also,
Who was the creator of the apbt/mastiff hybrid that would come to be known as the bandogge,and what was his doctrine that proved very helpfull to dog men around the eastern usa in the late 60s early 70s.This particular individual got his start with the help of dogmen martin lieberman and sdj founder Jack kelly?


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

The creator was John Swinford who was a veterinarian? Maybe? Possibly? I think! lol


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

tasha correct ,
John bayard Swinford was the creator of what we now no as the swinford or american bandogge mastiff and influenced all types of diffrent strains now found today,and yes he had a doctrine as a vetrenarian but never opened a practice.Insted he used his skill as a vet at pit matches.Swinfords bantu is the only nonapbt to be featured on the cover of the sporting dog journal [circa 1972],i own a copy of that issue,cool stuff,also featrures a section on him and his dogs..


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Wooohoooooo!! Yeah!


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

DID YOU GOOGLE THAT,LOL,GOOD JOB.:woof:


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Lol. No. I had looked up apbt x Mastiff mix a while back since I like both(of course apbt more than the mastiff)breeds and it brought up Bandogge. And I looked on some of those kennel sites and one of them had a history page. And I remember reading it on there.And decided I did not want another guard dog(I have a German Shepherd)


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## Jenny Poo (Oct 30, 2005)

I love this thread! Very informative


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Rushin Bill is a awsome look'n dog!


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