# Nice for the price?



## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

I recently picked up my first boy at 4 months, here's his ped tell me what you think (just spent an hour sloppin it together)
I only payed $400 for him and with some of the names in there I think it's a steal, but tell me what you think thanks!



If the image is too big please tell me how to resize it.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

i dont know what others may think but i believe anything over $300 is over priced, regardless of the names in the ped, this is also coming from someone who has never paid more than $200 for a well bred apbt in the past.
ambully breeders tend to be more about profit than anything, generally speaking so as far as that goes $400 isnt entirely ridiculous.


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

KMdogs said:


> i dont know what others may think but i believe anything over $300 is over priced, regardless of the names in the ped, this is also coming from someone who has never paid more than $200 for a well bred apbt in the past.
> ambully breeders tend to be more about profit than anything, generally speaking so as far as that goes $400 isnt entirely ridiculous.


There's some good names in that ped.(i know not as great as some)
He was marked at $650 before I even got off the phone with him :hammer:


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

thats not a bad price up here from what I gather with my american friends the price for a dog is wayyyy more then what americans pay , our large dogs in shelters go for $450-$500 and thats a shelter dog no papers. here a papered dog starts at $1000 and up wayyy up lol. so that price looks good to me , what matters to me more then papers though and price is what the pup looks like and what the parents look like , any pictures?


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

angelbaby said:


> thats not a bad price up here from what I gather with my american friends the price for a dog is wayyyy more then what americans pay , our large dogs in shelters go for $450-$500 and thats a shelter dog no papers. here a papered dog starts at $1000 and up wayyy up lol. so that price looks good to me , what matters to me more then papers though and price is what the pup looks like and what the parents look like , any pictures?


(SORRY FOR LARGE PIC TELL ME HOW TO MAKE SMALL PLEASE)

1st two images are the pup
last image is the dad. I don't have a pic of the mom







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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

u going for pet quality? the front end on the pup looks wrong to me the front legs and the paws not sure how to explain it or maybe its just the way im seeing it. You got a great deal though and i think he will be a great lil dog. dad looks ok but hard to tell from one pic maybe slight easty westy but nice markings and I like him. you have more of the pup from the fron standing up ? maybe him sitting is making him look off? and if you scoop from under him near the back he will stand better pulling his tail up is making him tuck his rear  I like his markings though.


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## dsgdlover (Feb 21, 2011)

I like the pup better then the sire, from the looks pup want be as short, but what do I know, and as far as deals I paid $200 for mine and she is UKC PR" which I thought was a deal, but being a member to this forum you hear everything. There is always someone who has something to say about bullies aka pitbulls, so don't let a reply put you down.I've been catching up in bullies 101, and learning more about what I have and what to look for in my male Im looking to buy here in the future. Good luck with that awesome pup.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

I didnt mean to put him down dsg Obviously I like bullys I own them lol. he asked for opinion on his dog and I gave it never said it was a bad pup at all and he got a good price. JFYI 'PR" doesnt mean anything lol breeders try using that to make it sound like there dog is extra special says that on all my dogs papers and most everyones now adays


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## dsgdlover (Feb 21, 2011)

angelbaby said:


> I didnt mean to put him down dsg Obviously I like bullys I own them lol. he asked for opinion on his dog and I gave it never said it was a bad pup at all and he got a good price. JFYI 'PR" doesnt mean anything lol breeders try using that to make it sound like there dog is extra special says that on all my dogs papers and most everyones now adays


I'm aware of the breeders and them using PR, I wasn't Praising it nor was I speaking on your reply, which I though was true . Come to think of I've never read a negative reply from you until now. FYI I was prewarning about others who will tell him everything they feel is wrong regardless of how it comes out. Sorry for the confusion, with all do respect, in my Ricky Bobby voice.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

oh lol my bad , Im like I didnt think i was that mean to him I like the pup and all was just pointing out what i saw lol again could very well be the pic hard to tell when he is sitting  yes there canbe some anti bully remarks at times but I think most everyone has grown past those and tend to not post if thats all they have to say. this forum is very helpful to all breed owners alot of issues we have arise arent breed specific and everyone comes together nicely for the most part . the rpoblem with online writting is you cant get the tone or sarcasm across that some of us posess lol so it gets twisted every now and then , take what you can use and what you cant just ignore lol hope you stick around and get to know us all. would love to see how your new pup grows


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## dsgdlover (Feb 21, 2011)

Lol, it's all good angel. And yes I can't wait to see how his boy turns out. Heck I can't wait to see how my girl turn out....lmao


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## mamas boy (Dec 5, 2010)

congradulations beautifull pup


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## motocross308 (Oct 5, 2010)

i may be wrong but his back looks a bit strange. your just looking for a pet right ?
even then .
maybe im just seeing things


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## Luvum (Nov 11, 2010)

motocross308 said:


> i may be wrong but his back looks a bit strange. your just looking for a pet right ?
> even then .
> maybe im just seeing things


I think the pup is leaning against the guy's leg, so what you're seeing is the pup's loose back skin.


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## Patch-O-Pits (Jan 12, 2008)

Very cute pup, but the structure of both him and his sire though is concerning and looks painful. What counts is that you are happy with the pup. That is an low average price for a pet quality pup from what I've seen; with no titles or health tests in the ped I'd don't know if I'd consider it a deal. Just my opinion though.

Regardless he is adorable and I hope makes you very happy for many years to come. CONGRATS!


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

Patch-O-Pits said:


> Very cute pup, but the structure of both him and his sire though is concerning and looks painful. What counts is that you are happy with the pup. That is an low average price for a pet quality pup from what I've seen; with no titles or health tests in the ped I'd don't know if I'd consider it a deal. Just my opinion though.
> 
> Regardless he is adorable and I hope makes you very happy for many years to come. CONGRATS!


The sire and dam both had health tests/x-rays for breeding.
And what do you mean by the structure looks concerning?


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

UngodlyBullies said:


> The sire and dam both had health tests/x-rays for breeding.
> And what do you mean by the structure looks concerning?


I got my dog for 400 as well and I wont sugar coat it. The parents weren't health tested or anything like that and the backyard breeder used the fancy ped to get me to rescue the dog from the terrible condition it was in. I got lucky with a good pup with good temperament, but I highly doubt your puppy's parents were health tested before breeding, if they did what organization did they use? do you have digitical copies of the x-rays? what did they x-ray?

the pup looks good in my opinion, you gotta baby the heck out of him and make sure you let him grow slowly because he looks to have weak pasterns. Keep the pup lean, don't over exercise him at all and make sure he has a soft bedding. Anyway, that's a good looking pup, very leggy which is good


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

I do hope that you bought this pup with the knowledge that it is an American Bully and not an American Pit Bull Terrier. Welcome to our forum.


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

There is no way those parent's were health tested if the breeder said they were he lied to you. Only a blind man would breed dog's that poor in structure. I know you love your pup and that's all that matters. I would neuter him as he is not show quality or breeding quality for that matter. But I am sure he will make a wonderful pet.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Perhaps they were health tested... and the results were not good... but they bred them anyway lol That would be the only way getting around that. Some people think health testing is just taking the dog to the vet for a check up though!


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

I wouldn't waste my money for health testing on parent's that looked like that for what? You don't even need the x-rays to tell they have some serious structure issues. That's why I believe the breeder lied and fed this guy a crock of tales.


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

Sadie said:


> There is no way those parent's were health tested if the breeder said they were he lied to you. Only a blind man would breed dog's that poor in structure. I know you love your pup and that's all that matters. I would neuter him as he is not show quality or breeding quality for that matter. But I am sure he will make a wonderful pet.





Shes Got Heart said:


> I do hope that you bought this pup with the knowledge that it is an American Bully and not an American Pit Bull Terrier. Welcome to our forum.


What's wrong with his structure?
I've tried stacking him and he looks just as good as some of the show dogs i've seen.

And yes I knew I was buying an American Bully and not an apbt.


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Sadie said:


> There is no way those parent's were health tested if the breeder said they were he lied to you. Only a blind man would breed dog's that poor in structure. I know you love your pup and that's all that matters. I would neuter him as he is not show quality or breeding quality for that matter. But I am sure he will make a wonderful pet.


after seeing pictures..x 2:goodpost:


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

UngodlyBullies said:


> What's wrong with his structure?
> I've tried stacking him and he looks just as good as some of the show dogs i've seen.
> 
> And yes I knew I was buying an American Bully and not an apbt.


Do you have a digital copy of the x-rays?


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

I wouldnt judge a dog based on looks, there are plenty of thick American Bulldogs, Matiffs and Frenchies that are health tested. 

What I think is that the breeder went to the vet and got a check up and called it health testing lol


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

UngodlyBullies said:


> What's wrong with his structure?
> I've tried stacking him and he looks just as good as some of the show dogs i've seen.
> 
> And yes I knew I was buying an American Bully and not an apbt.


For one he has a terrible front end and Bad feet. I can't really say anything about his tope line because he looks like he is not standing up properly in that picture you posted or he is only half way standing up anyway. If you want to learn about proper structure in the American Bully I would start here. Just because you have some well known bullies in your pedigree doesn't mean your pup is a well bred example for the breed. Paper's tell you one thing how the pup is bred not how well they are bred.

You should take a look at this thread

http://www.gopitbull.com/bullies-101/33292-correct-fronts-vs-ew-bullies-bred-abkc-standard.html


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

davidfitness83 said:


> Do you have a digital copy of the x-rays?


No I don't but I believe He said they xrayed the hips and the pelvis?
I never got any health-test info with him, although my vet says he is looking very nice.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

UngodlyBullies said:


> No I don't but I believe He said they xrayed the hips and the pelvis?
> I never got any health-test info with him, although my vet says he is looking very nice.


Don't sweat it man you gotta listen to these people and learn. You don't x-ray the pelvis for a dog you are considering in breeding breeders usually x-ray hips, elbows. your breeder lied to you, now move on and learn as much as you can about keeping your dog healthy. Big names on a pup don't mean anything, wait till your dog develops and see how it turns out. Just make sure I can't stress it enough keep the dog lean, there is another thread I posted on, look at the diagram and make sure you follow it. With weak pasterns like the ones your puppies has, you can seriously ruin his legs if you keep him chubby while developing.


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

Sadie said:


> For one he has a terrible front end and Bad feet. I can't really say anything about his tope line because he looks like he is not standing up properly in that picture you posted or he is only half way standing up anyway. If you want to learn about proper structure in the American Bully I would start here. Just because you have some well known bullies in your pedigree doesn't mean your pup is a well bred example for the breed. Paper's tell you one thing how the pup is bred not how well they are bred.
> 
> You should take a look at this thread
> 
> http://www.gopitbull.com/bullies-101/33292-correct-fronts-vs-ew-bullies-bred-abkc-standard.html


He doesn't have any easty-westy. I'll have to retake some pics of him so you guys can see his structure, the one where I am holding his tail he is on his way to sit lol


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

From what I can see, the pups elbows are very bowed out and he is easty westy. The sire, from what I can tell is easty westy as well, same elbow's. I don't know a lot about bully show dogs. I am into APBT's. But I would think the structure of any dogs would be similar as far as mobility goes.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

Look at this front feet how they are facing out and the pasterns are pretty much bent.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

Not the best examply since Bernie is not extreme and he was a puppy here but look at his front legs


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Please remember, we are not here to bash your dog or anything. None of us are meaning to do that. But you did ask for opinions. And so we are just telling you the truth with no sugar coating. Bad structure can lead to possible health problems so you will want to do what you can to prevent them, and that starts with good nutrition.


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

His front end looks off in the picture you posted and his pasterns are def week. What are you feeding him? If you can try getting better shot's of him properly stacked and one from the front end it would be easier to evaluate his overall structure. I am not trying to give you a hard time. But I am not one to lie or sugar coat anything and I hope that you can appreciate my honesty if nothing else. Here are 2 shot's of my pup I have an APBT but shots like these make it easier to evaluate your pup. One from the front and one from the side like these where the pup is standing up completely.


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

Oh boy I hate to be negative but you should really know what you have, you can understand why your dog is not breed or show quality. 
The front end on your dog is horrible. It is not how you are holding him you can see the turn in the bone and the feet go E/W and so does the sire. It is a genetic fault that many bad bully breeders are over looking.
The sire's front end is just about fiddle front and that means the bone turns in then back out. One the left leg of your pup the bone is twisted and bowed out and that is not how he is standing that is bone that is not straight. I cannot say anything about the rear since he is not standing. Take at look at that thread about easty/westy legs and you will see what we are talking about. I think you over paid based off the quality of dogs they breeding. Just looking at the site I see lots of structural issues with what they are breeding.
Razorsfarm


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

performanceknls said:


> Oh boy I hate to be negative but you should really know what you have, you can understand why your dog is not breed or show quality.
> The front end on your dog is horrible. It is not how you are holding him you can see the turn in the bone and the feet go E/W and so does the sire. It is a genetic fault that many bad bully breeders are over looking.
> The sire's front end is just about fiddle front and that means the bone turns in then back out. One the left leg of your pup the bone is twisted and bowed out and that is not how he is standing that is bone that is not straight. I cannot say anything about the rear since he is not standing. Take at look at that thread about easty/westy legs and you will see what we are talking about. I think you over paid based off the quality of dogs they breeding. Just looking at the site I see lots of structural issues with what they are breeding.
> Razorsfarm


:goodpost::goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:

We want to be able tell everyone that comes here that their pups are beautiful show quality animals and well bred examples of the breed. But sadly there are far more poor examples of the breed out there than their are quality bred animals. This goes for both the American Bully and the APBT. Just because an animal has paper's does not make it a show quality animal. There are plenty of papered dog's in the world that are products of BYB breedings. If your goal is to eventually show a dog or compete in working sports you have come to the right forum to learn the difference between show quality vs a pet. And eventually you will be able to seek out a good breeder for that very purpose.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

wow thats there site? most of those dogs have bad form and have some big issues. I wouldnt have bought a dog from them, but since you already have him best to just learn what the issues are and do what you can to minimize them like watching his weight and gettin him proper nutrients and exercise. I hope you havent been scarred off people are just trying to help and show you what is right and what isnt they really do want to help. you do have a cute lil pup and he will be a great dog for you hopefully. everyones dog on here has some fault whether small or big and noone loves there dog any less for that , there is no 'perfect' dog , helps to know your dogs weakness though so you can do things to improve it or prevent it from being worse in some cases. Hope you stick around


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

Yes please do not get discouraged, I am sure your pup is a great pet and it makes no difference what his structure is if you love him! Please stick around this is a great forum and we have a great bully section. I have a large kennel of over 18 dogs and I have a few with major structural issues. They are just my pets and I love them dearly!


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

So you guys are saying I should NEVER show him and NEVER breed him?


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

No he is not breeding material he has major structure issues that won't ever go away the faults are severe enough that he would not do well in the show ring. If you breed him all you would be doing is passing those faults down to the offspring.


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

no to breeding , but fun shows or event type of stuff you could get him into maybe look into some sporting stuff would help keep him active and isnt judged on structure at all, although If you want to go into weight pulling and stuff you may want to have him health checked xrays and stuff to make sure there isnt any big risk to him getting injured.


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

Sadie said:


> No he is not breeding material he has major structure issues that won't ever go away the faults are severe enough that he would not do well in the show ring. If you breed him all you would be doing is passing those faults down to the offspring.


Can you point me in the direction of cheap, correct bullies? (UKC REG)


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## KMdogs (Apr 22, 2011)

Sadie said:


> No he is not breeding material he has major structure issues that won't ever go away the faults are severe enough that he would not do well in the show ring. If you breed him all you would be doing is passing those faults down to the offspring.


:goodpost:

Breeding him unfortunately would just be adding to the already damaged American Bully breed. There are too many extremes, too many dogs with all kinds of genetic/structure issues its ridiculous. I honestly try to stay away from that entire world as much as possible because when i do im just left with..  and :hammer: and :rain:.

Just love your pup and be sure to train and care for him properly. Im sure he will make an excellent family pet.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

UngodlyBullies said:


> Can you point me in the direction of cheap, correct bullies? (UKC REG)


that's kind of hard, there are a handful of kennels that have those dogs. If you want a healthy dog that is more exagerated and heavier than an APBT since it seems that you don't want an APBT you can always find amstaff kennels.


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

UngodlyBullies said:


> Can you point me in the direction of cheap, correct bullies? (UKC REG)


My best advice to you would be to go out to some ABKC or UKC show's to network and meet some other show folks. We do have some good bully breeder's on this site I don't know how often they breed or what they charge for their pups. I know any good breeder is going to be selective to whom they let their pups go to.

Can I ask are looking to breed your dogs? Is this what your plans are? I guess I am just confused on what your plans are for your dogs??


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

you can get bullys ukc registered but no bully will show in the ukc as they wont conform to the standard of the ukc which is set for the american pitbull terrier , the more legit bullys that are 'show ' quality show in the ABKC you may want to look into that registry and get to know the people involved in there . some great breeders in the ABKC bully world are on this site and others are easliy looked up . check out semper fi bullys, gomez pits, suarez bulls, just google them or check on the boards using the search function. 
What do you consider cheap? I highly doubt you will get a show quality bully from quality breeders at the price you paid for your boy Id say a starting point for a show quality dog would start at $1000 if your lucky and go up , way up from there. 
Best bet is to use your boy as a learning tool and educate yourself on this breed, look at the structure and faults and try to grasp as much as that info as you can { it will help later down the road when picking out a quality pup} And even better see if there is a good breeder in your area and apprentice with them , go to shows with them help with there dogs and learn. sounds ike you want to do the show and breeding thing and it never turns out good just jumping in blindly, take your time and educate yourself


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

davidfitness83 said:


> that's kind of hard, there are a handful of kennels that have those dogs. If you want a healthy dog that is more exagerated and heavier than an APBT since it seems that you don't want an APBT you can always find amstaff kennels.


No I am not looking for a true APBT or an amstaff.
Perhaps I should shop over seas for my Bullies?


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

read wrong oops lol. I havent seen anything overseas comparing to what is over here . ABKC started in the states and most quality dogs are comming out of the states, infact there are breeders who have been selling to over seas lately


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

I agree no breeding but you could always try your luck in the show ring. If you go to ABKC shows and get to know some good breeders you might find a good show dog. Low price dogs sometimes you get what you pay for. Not that you cannot find a good priced bully but when breeders put time and money into breeding dogs that can leave the price around 1,000 or so. It is not so much about making money as it is to recoup some of the money you spend showing and caring for the dogs.

Also like Angelbaby said bullies are not UKC standard and should not be shown in UKC but in ABKC instead.


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

UngodlyBullies said:


> No I am not looking for a true APBT or an amstaff.
> Perhaps I should shop over seas for my Bullies?


Why would you go overseas to buy an American Bully????

here is a good breeder
http://semperfibullies.net/

do some mroe research and you will find a lot of good breeders. We have a bully 101 section with a lot of info I suggest you take a look.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Since many bully breeders breed for looks, color and exaggerated features it can be difficult to find a well bred one. I would go look at shows and try to get to know bully owners on the forum.


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## UngodlyBullies (Apr 23, 2011)

This is only my second time attempting to stack. I am not very good.
What do you think of his structure now? Still bad? :S





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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

ya his front still has the same issues mentioned before looks a lil bowed , just watch his weight and watch how he grows make sure things dont get worse, his rear looks high to me as well even though you have his legs kicked out to far , he is a puppy though so has alot to grow still. he's a cute pup, hope you still love him no matter what we point out


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## dsgdlover (Feb 21, 2011)

UngodlyBullies said:


> This is only my second time attempting to stack. I am not very good.
> What do you think of his structure now? Still bad? :S
> 
> 
> ...


Looking good, and if you live Indiana there is not a lot of kennels there to choose from. I own a home in Indianapolis,IN and most of the dogs for sell are from BYB, and most have a lot of CKC b/s.

P.S man I wouldn't buy a dog from Gary,IN


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

His chest and shoulders are not great it is very U shaped and his pasterns are worse than I thought. Also that left front leg is stil bowed and twisted a bit. While he does not look as E/W in the front feet his pasterns are very broken down and over time that will cause structural issues. It will get worse as he ages and I have seen older dogs get crippled because they cannot walk on them any more. With good nutrition you can maybe help the pasterns a bit but it may just be genetic. As before I think you should try and show him, you never know who will like your dog. I would not have him as a breeding prospect just for the fact that his front is so bad you do not want to promote that in future generations. JMO
Again I have dogs with major faults and I just love them to pieces!!


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

He is a cute puppy, but I agree with the comments on his structure; it is not ideal. You should get him on glucosamine supplements now, and probably calcium, too. And keep his weight down. (Not thin as a rail, but you don't want to put any more stress on those joints than there already is.)

I always encourage people to try showing, even if they don't have a show-quality dog. If nothing else, it will be a learning experience for you. But no, I would not bank on breeding this dog later if you consider yourself an ethical person. When you are ready for a real show prospect, you will have to search carefully and not be limited by price or location.


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## pitbullmamanatl (Jun 1, 2010)

You can submit a stacked shot in the *Bullies 101 structures and faults* thread and I can evaluate him for you. Definitely see some bowing out at the elbows and lack of fore chest. No need to go overseas to buy an Am Bully from a reputable breeder. They are out there and I'd be happy to give you some direction. Trust that the Bullies overseas have a long way to go. Is that his ped on the first page? He is a super cute puppy with a bangin sweet face!


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