# watchdog bloodline...



## tazmaniak24_6

can anyone give me some info on watchdog bloodline? or a site that i could go to? any health problems or anything like that in thier history?....


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## WONDERLANDAMSTAFFS

*health*

Being familiar with mostly AKC lines I can only give you a rescource for health issues. Go to the OFA website and look for Watchdog bred dogs. See how many have passed or failed their OFA's. If you don't see any at all, then they are not testing at all, never a good sign.

Good luck!

Sharon


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## cane76

its a line founded off game dogs i believe,and now mostly is a over done blue cross line,that still has some good dogs mixed in with the bullfrogs...
ask oldfort,his kennel is founded off of watchdog blood i believe....
I know alot of the mugleston dogs are watchdog..


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## Crown Royal

The Watchdog was originally bred off of game lines, Carver and Mason to name a few. Originally bred for hog catching. A good representative of the line would be an strong/athletic catch-weight dog. Often times the Chaos blood is seen in the pedigree. Search the past posts and you'll find some good info.

Watchdog Beelzebub


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## littleboyblue

*My dog*

my dog chico and my dog chapparra are both of Chaos/Watchdog lines they are very athletic and not overdone at all.. chico is about 70 pounds give or take and chapparra is about 55 pounds... no doubt very compact and muscular, and like I said very out going dogs.. I love this particualr line Watchdog with a outcross of Chaos.. thats what I mainly run here.. and I have had nothing but great dogs... and they have all passed testing..


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## tazmaniak24_6

i'll post caines pedigree when i have a chance (is that allowed? lol) anyway, he is watchdog (tnt, and some others, its been a while since ive glanced over his papers)


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## tazmaniak24_6

cane76 said:


> its a line founded off game dogs i believe,and now mostly is a over done blue cross line,that still has some good dogs mixed in with the bullfrogs...
> ask oldfort,his kennel is founded off of watchdog blood i believe....
> I know alot of the mugleston dogs are watchdog..


okay, question lol.. wut is this "bullfrog" i'm hearing about? lol


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## Crown Royal

tazmaniak24_6 said:


> okay, question lol.. wut is this "bullfrog" i'm hearing about? lol


Definition of Bullfrog - any fat, short, overdone bulldog that's too big for it's own good. Looks like a toad w/ hair.
DISCLAIMER - not all bullies fit this definition.

yeah post the ped...no probs w/ doing that.


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## cane76

over done blue dogs from bully lines,dogs that arent worked or shown,bluffs,hippos etc....im in no way saying all watch dog line apbts are over done bluffs,some seem to be real nice,just not the line for me...


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## OldFortKennels

I have some of the old watchdog blood in my lines. Originally bred as true catch dogs they were slightly bigger than the average 55lber but still VERY functional.

These are some pictures of some foundation dogs out of an even older magazine.


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## Crown Royal

:goodpost: I love the photos..recognize a few dogs from WAY back in my dogs pedigree.


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## GSDBulldog

Only the original blood is worth feeding IMO, and unfortunately many a peddler has gotten their hand on Watchdog blood. Like others have said, the true-to-type reps of this line are compact catchweight dogs, most with a distinct look about them. 

As far as health issues, I've only seen problems that are typical of the breed overall, the most common one being hip dysplasia (So few breeders health test, so many are not aware of the problem).


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## wheezie

is anyone still breeding the actual foudation standard or are they all bullied out now?


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## tazmaniak24_6

GSDBulldog said:


> Only the original blood is worth feeding IMO, and unfortunately many a peddler has gotten their hand on Watchdog blood. Like others have said, the true-to-type reps of this line are compact catchweight dogs, most with a distinct look about them.
> 
> As far as health issues, I've only seen problems that are typical of the breed overall, the most common one being hip dysplasia (So few breeders health test, so many are not aware of the problem).


The reason i asked in the first place is Caine is about 70 pounds (give or take) and has a destinct look about him (like crown royal's), but overall is a VERY awesome dog.. i am very impressed especially after hearing bad things about the bloodline (ie. "watered down" "overbred" "over-domesticated, etc).. he has an AWESOME temperment (lil dominant with dogs he doesnt know, but never jumps). He's been VERY "trainable" without many complications at all.. the only thing we need to work on with him is tearing the garbage up when hes in the house  but no biggie.... as far as health goes, hes a healthy young man  he has dandruff (or the equivelant of) all over him though... i thought it was from spending time outside at first, but that was a year and a half ago and , unfortunately, still has a small case of dry skin... but other than that, id like to keep some of the features in watchdog and mix in a lil of Falins  (hence the puppies )


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## tazmaniak24_6

Here is Caine... (i've tried to post his ped online and cant figure it out)... so , if u glance at Old Forts "Gracie" you'll be looking at Caines ped as well... as you can see, he is pretty strong watchdog.. (by no means "bullied out")


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## Crown Royal

Dat's a good looking dog you got there. These pictures are a few months old. He was only 11 months old at the time. I wouldn't call him short--23 in. at the shoulders.


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## mikecsmith

*Gv*

I have a Grapevine dog, which is a strain of Watchdog. I'm very happy with him and haven't had any heath problems. There are other strains as well, such as Chaos, Hughzees, Padillas and TNT. I wouldn't trade him for anything.


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## cherol

beautiful dog u got there!!! omg, u wuznt playin huh? almost a MIRROR image of each other... :thumbsup:


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## cherol

cherol said:


> beautiful dog u got there!!! omg, u wuznt playin huh? almost a MIRROR image of each other... :thumbsup:


 (sorry bout that, Cherol was still logged in  this is tazmaniak24_6  )


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## Crown Royal

mikecsmith said:


> I have a Grapevine dog, which is a strain of Watchdog. I'm very happy with him and haven't had any heath problems. There are other strains as well, such as Chaos, Hughzees, Padillas and TNT. I wouldn't trade him for anything.
> View attachment 856


Check out the ped in my sig...Grapevine, Hughzees, Chaos, Watchdog all in there. Most dogs that have one usually have a few of these.


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## Mybluebull

*my male*

Hi,
This my male watchdog his name is Toda he is 75 pounds.


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## BlueScarFace

OldFortKennels said:


> I have some of the old watchdog blood in my lines. Originally bred as true catch dogs they were slightly bigger than the average 55lber but still VERY functional.
> 
> These are some pictures of some foundation dogs out of an even older magazine.


:cheers: Great to see pictures of my dogs grandparents !:snap:


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## drsven

Here is a picture of my female Tonka. She is 1 1/2 years old and 65 lbs. She 's one tuff dog. Her dad is from Chaos Kennels and is 100% Chaos/Watchdog, her g-grandfather is Watchdog's "Beelzebub". Her mother is Gaff & 187:


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## cane76

OldFortKennels said:


> I have some of the old watchdog blood in my lines. Originally bred as true catch dogs they were slightly bigger than the average 55lber but still VERY functional.
> 
> These are some pictures of some foundation dogs out of an even older magazine.


curious if these photos are from a magazine called"the american bulldog review".I guess the watch dog kennels guy was also a american bulldog guy and registered a few dogs as american bulldog that had a touch of carver apbt in there pedigrees...


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## wheezie

hmmm interesting stuff there


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## cane76

wheezie said:


> hmmm interesting stuff there


More interesting stuff.
Founder of this line was dude by the name of Casey Catoure[sp].
He is the reason the "american bulldog association" is in existance,he founded it.the "aba" is the largest registry for ab's in the world.he is also the the reason why the "ukc" registered the ab....
I wonder if he ever added a ab or two into his apbt stock?....
Man you can find out alot of info when you dont have sh#@ to do,lol....


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## drsven

cane76 said:


> More interesting stuff.
> Founder of this line was dude by the name of Casey Catoure[sp].
> He is the reason the "american bulldog association" is in existance,he founded it.the "aba" is the largest registry for ab's in the world.he is also the the reason why the "ukc" registered the ab....
> I wonder if he ever added a ab or two into his apbt stock?....
> Man you can find out alot of info when you dont have sh#@ to do,lol....


Sometime ago I did some limited research on this exact question. To the best of my knowledge Casey Couturier stopped breeding APBT's all together. He is the original founder of the ABA. WD kennels is still alive today, they are located in Covelo, CA. My dogs both have WD ancestors in their pedigrees (Beelzebub, Zulu and Couturier's Blue Bully) more recent ancestors are from Chaos Kennels. I don't see anything that would lead me to believe he mixed AB's with APBT's but you never know. Chaos Kennels works a with WD, Carver, Mason and McCoy lines... if anyone has some top secret information  regarding this I would love to know.


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## drsven

*Almost forgot*

St. Louis vet clinic in Oakland has a more recent (than posted) APBT flier from Watch Dog Kennels in their ear crop book. Next time I'm in the area I'll see if I can get a photo copy of it to post.


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## cane76

drsven said:


> . I don't see anything that would lead me to believe he mixed AB's with APBT's but you never know. Chaos Kennels works a with WD, Carver, Mason and McCoy lines... if anyone has some top secret information  regarding this I would love to know.


I never said he did,although he registered a ab with pitbull blood in it with the aba,thats all,lets just say he wasnt the first to do that,would it suprise me if he mixed in a ab with his apbt stock absolutly not but who knows,the two breeds are very similar anyways.
check out theis story abouthis old ab that was shot for attacking his neighbor,weird stuff..
http://www.american-bulldog.com/aba_dedication.htm


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## drsven

cane76 said:


> I never said he did,although he registered a ab with pitbull blood in it with the aba,thats all,lets just say he wasnt the first to do that,would it suprise me if he mixed in a ab with his apbt stock absolutly not but who knows,the two breeds are very similar anyways.
> check out theis story abouthis old ab that was shot for attacking his neighbor,weird stuff..
> http://www.american-bulldog.com/aba_dedication.htm


WD APBT's are usually a bit larger than average but are still very athletic; WD adding AB's into the mix could explain this. Several true "game" owners I've spoke with in the past felt the WD line was bullied out. I always disagree, my dogs are athletic. I'm not tring to put down the Gottiline or some of the RE dogs (I actually think these dogs are pretty cool) but these dogs are not athletic. Another strange thing is that WD is was of the few kennels to advertise it's APBT's for personal protection, security or for hog catching.


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## drsven

*Here's Tonka's Ped (Sire)*

I've posted Tonka's Ped from the sire's side. Even looking further back at the public pedigrees I don't see anywhere in her ancestory that would make me think that an AB might have been crossed or mixed in. Looks like there may be quite a bit of Amstaff blood. Cane, what do you think? Also, here is a like to Beelzebub's ped: 
http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=30155


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## cane76

drsven said:


> I've posted Tonka's Ped from the sire's side. Even looking further back at the public pedigrees I don't see anywhere in her ancestory that would make me think that an AB might have been crossed or mixed in. Looks like there may be quite a bit of Amstaff blood. Cane, what do you think? Also, here is a like to Beelzebub's ped:
> http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=30155


i cant say,
honestly i just dont know,ive heard it from a few diffrent people but its all here say.When i see the mugleston dogs,i know there crosses but they are not true old school watchdog.Casey Couturier was rumored to have crossed some dogs,thats all i know and i dont believe it was his foundation stock....
Ive seen in a few pedigrees that the watchdog line was also used in the box.
i wonder who was matching these dogs or how many diffrent kennels?i dont believe youd have much sucssess using cross bred or duel registered dogs in the pit..


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## BlueScarFace

*WatchDog Blood Line*



tazmaniak24_6 said:


> can anyone give me some info on watchdog bloodline? or a site that i could go to? any health problems or anything like that in thier history?....


You have a great Bloodline on your hands !:woof:


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## drsven

BlueScarFace said:


> You have a great Bloodline on your hands !:woof:


Do you have an updated picture of your pup? I'd love to see it.


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## *COESR*

tazmaniak24_6 said:


> Here is Caine... (i've tried to post his ped online and cant figure it out)... so , if u glance at Old Forts "Gracie" you'll be looking at Caines ped as well... as you can see, he is pretty strong watchdog.. (by no means "bullied out")


thats a nice watchdog there...........


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## smokey_joe

cane76 said:


> I never said he did,although he registered a ab with pitbull blood in it with the aba,thats all,lets just say he wasnt the first to do that,would it suprise me if he mixed in a ab with his apbt stock absolutly not but who knows,the two breeds are very similar anyways.
> check out theis story abouthis old ab that was shot for attacking his neighbor,weird stuff..
> http://www.american-bulldog.com/aba_dedication.htm


I read this "dedication". The guy sounds like an idiot to me...


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## cane76

smokey_joe said:


> I read this "dedication". The guy sounds like an idiot to me...


agreed,I mean his dog was also out unsupervised,so who's fault was it really.sounds like some real hillbilly types............


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## roqstarblues

IDK if anyone is still on here, but all of our dogs are from Chaos. We bought these dogs from Michigan to Texas in early 2000's. They are just as everyone says, great hunters and very athletic. I love to see that there are so many supporters of this line out there. We wouldn't have any other. We ahve produced great pullers, hunters and companions. Please look at our website and myspace for my pics.

roqstarblues.com


myspace.com/roqstar_blues


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## Haul-N-Guns

*Love Your Dog*

Your pit looks damn good. Here's a picture of my Chiefy Lee. Also 100% watchdog


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## strongman_atlas

*%100 Pure Athlete!!! (Watchdog)*

Just thought I'd share my lil mommy Keylis who's %100 watchdog too


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## Wootness

I have bubu and woot both have some watchdog in him, Watchdogs beezlzbub is in his


not sure on what % would be on watchdog


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## dixie

we also love the watchdog bloodline.our main stud is watchdog/chaos orfn bred
he gets his dimentions from the watchdog bloodline i believe.but wow what a nice strong dog.sorry but i cant figure out how to post pics here.


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## ABK

From what I understand, Casey Couturier was originally a breeder of UKC style blues bred down from AmStaff blood. He did however cross this AST blood into game blood; mainly Mason, Patrick & Carver from what I recall. The AST blod would account for the size of his dogs. 

The fact that he advertised them for PP, catching & pulling just shows me he was being honest about what he had - show dogs, not pit dogs. All the CH.s & GR.CH.s on his dogs were conf. show titles after all. 

CC was so much into conformation that eventually went on to become a UKC judge. But when UKC began to take a real strong stand against game testing he took his dogs over to ADBA & quit the UKC. Eventually he sold all of his stuff & moved from Arkansas to Cali & got into ABs.

As for health issues, there are several in the WD line. Here are some that I know of right off the top of my head are:

- allergies (both inhalant & contact)
- cancer
- elbow problems
- elongated soft palates
- heart problems
- hip problems
- oral malformations 

Hope this helps.


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## BLUE PIT BULL MAN

*watchdog bloodlines*

I got this dog from a breeder in arkansas and I have had no problems with him. He is 100% watch dog and is a great addition to the family; I haven't hunted him yet but he realy seems interested in the hogs out back. He has the size and the agility to make a great catch dog. I am waiting patiently for my females to come into heat so I can breed him and see what he throughs...


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## BLUE PIT BULL MAN

I guess you have to see him in my pics cause I can't figure this out thought the attachment was good but I guess I was wrong.


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## nate

god i hate ppl 
breed a dog just to see what it makes 
i will say this noone NOONE that's hunts or works there dog's would breed just to what see what come's from it 
mmmm dig up a 3 yearold thread to piss me you realy REALY should read more on the rules and sticky's before you post anything else


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## American_Pit13

BLUE PIT BULL MAN said:


> .I am waiting patiently for my females to come into heat so I can breed him and see what he throughs...


I have to agree with Nate thats the stupidest thing I have heard. For the main thing it has nothing to do with what "he" throws it will have to do with both sides of what you are combining. People like this are what is ruining it for responsible breeders.


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## chic4pits

Crown Royal said:


> The Watchdog was originally bred off of game lines, Carver and Mason to name a few. Originally bred for hog catching. A good representative of the line would be an strong/athletic catch-weight dog. Often times the Chaos blood is seen in the pedigree. Search the past posts and you'll find some good info.
> 
> Watchdog Beelzebub
> View attachment 844


wow, this dog has the same body as kolby, only dif. is kolby's head and snout are a bit longer. ...


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## chic4pits

kolby is very much 'gameline' watchdog, i believe the watchdog that you are reffering to is called 'old school watchdog' which is the older line, the newer bulldog/bullie line is 'watchdog' which came from the 'OS WD' just bred in with more bulldog. 

but kolby is a very handsome boy, you look at him and you see a 75 lbs. boy who can catch your butt and bring ya to the ground in 3 secs. flat. i loove the muscle defination on this line as well, i find it's strong and more destinct in this line...jmo. but this is a very distinc line, same as gator..you know a gator when you see it..


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## Pitrich0132

Hey whats "catch-weight" mean?


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## smith family kennels

im keeping my mouth shut cause some things in this thread piss me off. I have my own opinions on chaos and on breeding to see what they will throw but im going to keep them to myself. Be responsable!


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## nate

lmfao my wife is keeping her mouth closed (that means i got get an ear full )

and for chic4 there is just one line some of it might have been crossed with am bully but there is just one line the new line is edge or gotti 
i will stop there best thing for everyone


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## lloyd23704

*watchdog mixing ab in the pot*

I was breeding watchdog stock tnt falins .. in late 90s to early 2000s first chaos ... is th the tolit bowl of these lines there was a lot of staff in the mix but it worked a high breed 5/8 or beter dog was dynomite strong wind size and a nice bite cc had feds knocking on his doors for his dog testing . And his blood line was going down hill blue bully ... moon shadow ... big thor... red woman... were the dogs to speak of in his line and the only ones to look for damion was the last good dog he produced at 77 lb girls were 55-65 now with the ab picking up the feds movin in and his dogs breed out he got out all togeather was a good move and only one to make now ab werent pure breed at this time they were establishing the breed and ironing put the dog so a lil pit in the pot was a improvement for the ab.. now on the pit side the last dogs cc advertised was romaz (watchdogs brutus) mc coy .. was around 90 ponds that was unheard of then and the look color and head on that dog screams ab was mostly white brown patches all his dogs up untel then were solid dark colors blue brown red black if theres a mix in the bunch id look there ..... and tip looking in a peddigree will not show a ab ... it will be conterfit a pedigree is only as honest as the guy selling the pups


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