# i thought this was kind of crazy(peta bodybag)



## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

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OROVILLE, CA - It's the last thing Karen Metcalf thought she would hear.

The Oroville woman learned about an ad in the August issue of Dog Fancy magazine, offering a free welcome home gift to new dog owners.

Metcalf, proud mother to four dogs, including her new puppy, called the number and was shocked to hear the recording.

The message said, "To receive a free body bag representing the dog that was killed in an animal shelter when you bought your puppy, please leave your address after the tone."

The ad, listed under the name ABC Puppy Products, was a fake, placed by PETA to get its message into the mainstream.

It's a message PETA admits is edgy, but one they claim was needed.

"It is shocking and it is a way to get into people's heads, but we are in crisis and it is time to pay attention to how we can stop millions of animals from being abandoned and euthanized," said PETA spokeswoman Melissa Karpel.

Dog Fancy denies knowing PETA placed the advertisement. Magazine representatives say they don't agree with the group's extremist views.

"We apologize to all who have been offended by PETA's offensive and misleading stunt," said Lisa MacDonald, Director of Marketing for BowTie Inc.

MacDonald called the free gift bag offer deceptive. "We will continue to refine the systems in place to prevent our readers and advertisers from being exposed to such distasteful hoaxes," she added.

Metcalf, just one of thousands of dog lovers who bought the nationally-sold magazine, said she couldn't believe PETA would actually send a puppy body bag. However, just days after her call, she received a package. Inside the envelope, along with an ABC guide to spaying and neutering, was a folded-up black garbage bag.

"Their tactics are horrid. That's not how you get a message across to people," said Metcalf. "You get your message across with education, sponsoring spays and neuters for those people who can't afford it."

News10/KXTV
Copyright 2008 / All Rights Reserved


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## Phoenix (May 3, 2008)

Well, PETA actions are the personification of the term "Sociopath".
If anyone else did something like that,I am sure some kind of charges would be brought against them.
Seems like such actions would fall under "terroristic threats" .
Whoever recieved such a response should pursue legal action if possible.
Which magazine(month) was this ad in?


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## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

Phoenix said:


> Well, PETA actions are the personification of the term "Sociopath".
> If anyone else did something like that,I am sure some kind of charges would be brought against them.
> Seems like such actions would fall under "terroristic threats" .
> Whoever recieved such a response should pursue legal action if possible.
> Which magazine(month) was this ad in?


 Exactly, That says a lot......


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## los44 (Jun 1, 2008)

this doesnt shock me, in fact i expect this kind of thing from peta afterall these are the same people that believe all pitbulls should be put down.


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## hell no they wont go (Oct 4, 2007)

they are a bunch of loonie toons if you ask me.

i remember someone psoting something like this here a while back ago actually it will help you understand peta better

peta: people eating tasty animals (i believe that is what it was.)


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## 0ni (Jul 8, 2008)

i swear i cant stand them in my eyes they are not truly for animal rights they were only for the media. a news reporter called out a member of peta by asking him why have they not did anything to help the dogs and why were they making a deal with vick.he was stomped had nothing to say about it they were some of the pet organizations that said that the dogs needed to be put down you ask me they are some sick hypocritical people that are just using the animals to get the attention that they never got. why don't they use the money that they used for that ad to save a few of the animals life. i think the animals would prefer that. oh and why don't the stop complaining and and go volunteer all of there time all over the world and stop saving animals from celebrities


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## Phoenix (May 3, 2008)

Here is what PETA really means...

People for the Extermination of Trustworthy Animals

This is EXACTLY what they do!!!


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## BedlamBully (Jun 6, 2008)

Thats seriously messed up.


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## cnlevo (Sep 8, 2008)

I am not the type of person who is quick to say "i'm am going to sue for having to see this" because i believe in freedom of speech and all that it stands for, but that is taking it WAYYYY to far. 

Infact I have never wanted to or said I am going to sue anyone for anything i've read or saw, but I really believe I would start a class action suit against PETA. I just bought my very first dog on my own after having a few as a child, but this is MY FIRST dog and if I listened to that not only would it make me feel bad, but PISSED at the same time. If there is one thing i CAN NOT STAND MORE THEN ANYTHING IN THIS WORLD it is a hypocrite. I knew they were a crazy organization but unfortunately never put ANY effort into it, but now as a PROUD owner of a APBT I am going to do as much as possible to fight those a**holes!


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## Kat&Kumho (Sep 10, 2008)

So they want animal rights and mailing out trash bags does so much for that.Imagine the animals they could help with all those 50 cent stamps and trash bags they are mailing out.


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## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

At least they didn't send a dead dog. Lord knows they kill enough animals to send one to everyone in the country.


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## rgrande (Oct 1, 2008)

Although I do not agree with PETA's philosophy of putting pit bulls down, I think their tactics in this situation are quite noble.
They are forced to use extreme measures to get their points across simply because society is deaf. Either deaf, or too lazy to listen. 

"You get your message across with education, sponsoring spays and neuters for those people who can't afford it." 

Referring to your ridiculous response...look it up, there is plenty of information out there encouraging people to neuter their animals. And for people who can't afford it...they shouldn't be BUYING animals dumb shit.

Their way provides shock and incite that hopefully gets through to those less ignorant.
There are millions of abandoned animals in need of a home...and selfish people who won't settle for anything less than new and young just keep buying animals instead of adopting.

This is causing clutter in shelters, forcing them to put at least one pet down for every one that is bought.

How about you all just be a little more selfless and adopt a dog/cat/whatever that's in need, and stop supporting the puppy mills that provide your pure bred.

Ever think that your NEW dog's mother is whipped and abused, just so that you can have the "perfect" dog.

Way to go pitbulllover27870...you killed a number of innocent lives.


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## Bleu Clair (Jun 14, 2008)

rgrande said:


> *Although I do not agree with PETA's philosophy of putting pit bulls down, I think their tactics in this situation are quite noble.* PETA doesn't just have the philosophy of putting down pit bulls....they'd like to see an end to all domestic animals. Noble? More like a bit extreme.
> 
> They are forced to use extreme measures to get their points across simply because society is deaf. Either deaf, or too lazy to listen.
> 
> ...


How, by posting an article that's already out there for tons of people to read?

I don't normally respond to stuff like this, but attacking a member on your first post is totally uncalled for. But then again, I'm probably just responding to someone worrying about billy goats trip trapping over their bridge.


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## Mrs_APBT_America (Jul 19, 2008)

> they shouldn't be BUYING animals *dumb shit*.


Wow, I think you need to chill and if you don't like this forum or if you are gonna be rude, then just leave this site!! I am sure your rudeness will not be taken kindly nor will be welcome here! You can state your opinion without trash coming out of your mouth! Opinions are welcome but there are ways to go about expressing them! Apparently you didn't read the forum rules.


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## Marty (Dec 10, 2005)

rgrande, how much do you really know about PETA?

Or are you working for them?

A little back ground on them...

PETA Kills Animals | PetaKillsAnimals.com

And for your first post, I think it was uncalled for calling people *ignorant*,*dumb shit* This will not be tolerated on this site.


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## rgrande (Oct 1, 2008)

I'm sorry, did you even read the opening lines to my reply?
I know what PETA does, and I do not agree with their actions.
BUT I do agree with what they stand for.
I am aware that PETA kills many animals, and I think it should end.
But they have been successful in reducing animal abuse around the world, too.
By no means, just so we get this clear for the third time, do I support those 90% statistics of animals they kill.

And you're right, "dumb shit" was probably not appropriate but the original poster attacked PETA for being ethical.
But I won't say anything about "ignorant" because that is what they are. They are ignorant to the fact that buying animals kills abandoned ones. Do you even know the real definition of "ignorant?" It means uneducated.
So there is a nice grammar lesson for you, before you criticize my diction.


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## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

ok how did i attack peta? all i did was post an article on something that they did.. never said i support abusing animals or puppy mills. just thought it was kind of crazy that they did something like this... but anyway..you might want to make in introduction before you start bashing on people


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## kvndvn6 (Oct 2, 2008)

Ok..look people..to attack someone that is new to the group is rude. oh man..she said shit...let's stone her! what are you guys 5? grow the up! i'm just saying this is america...you may not like it..but we're allowed to use foul language! now..you sign up to post a few things about your favorite breed of dog and all of that fun, exciting shit..i'm just going to say that if you follow rules that tell you that you can not use foul language in a forum..you are a very boring person. In fact, i am sure that you have no excitement in your life. and everyday you come home and cream in your pants to the thought of pitbull discussions on your little forum. Calm down! rgrande has every right to state her opinion..even if it means that she uses some vulgar language..which most Americans use on a day to day basis. So, grow up and if you can't.. keep your mouth shut. I'm sure this is my first and last post. =) have a nice day, .


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*attack on rgrande*

you are all ganging up on rgrande by failing to see the logic in her post. she has a point and sadly enough peta has tried to get the attention of the general public but you are all too ignorant to the facts to care. i will not defend peta on every account... i believe in what they stand for but i think their actions are terrible and unethical at times. but i believe this ad sent some shock into pitbulllover. am i right? it seems a terrible thing to think of dogs in body bags. but millions of animals are euthanized every year because people won't adopt them. people become obsessed with buying pure bred dogs. but what most people fail to realize is that not only are the mothers that are used for breeding abused and sick and decrepit but a lot of times there is inbreeding in these puppy mills which makes for not so healthy or smart and responsive pets. and when people have pets like that they tend to get annoyed and give them up... then they end up in a shelter and eventually put down. also... the conditions of most breeders facilities is less than satisfactory when it comes to cleanliness... a lot of puppies are sick and die within months of being bought. rgrande's point is... why buy when there are so many loving animals out there that need to be adopted. the more you buy pure bred animals from breeders and puppy mills the more you support the killing of animals. it breaks my heart everyday to think how many loving pets are out there and will never have the chance to have a home. i adopted my dog milo over a year ago now... i have no idea what breeds he is mixed with (i have my guesses) but i don't care. he is the sweetest dog i have ever had... he is so loving and happy with his new home... what if i had never found him and he was put down? it's so sad to think that way but there are so many animals that are put down every year because of people always wanting pure bred puppies.

i know you don't appreciate rgrande attacking you but she is a person who is just as hurt as i am to think of all the animals being put down right now because people like you guys are keeping breeders and puppy mills in business.


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## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

y are brand new people jumping into this post? how bout an intro?


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*why bother*

i see no point in an introduction. i was researching some things and found this post and saw everyone attacking someone who had a good point. i love all animals and i love pitbulls and i think peta is a terrible organization when it comes to following through with their beliefs... but i also believe in what i said... and that is... people should NOT buy animals... you love pitbulls you say and there are hundreds if not thousands is shelters right now because their pitiful previous owners couldn't deal with them. you should adopt them instead of buying more and supporting evil.


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## chic4pits (Aug 25, 2008)

*shakes head* u know i'll never understand peta...there's better ways of getting your point across...


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## Mrs_APBT_America (Jul 19, 2008)

I feel like this is all the same person IMO, only because they all seem to know rgrande is a HER and because they are all new w/o introductions. Same EXACT views and attacking points, but that is just MO! They talk about not attacking rgrande when they were attacking pitbulllover. Well I am sorry if I am gonna stick up for a member who has been here alot longer and has been kind throughout their stay unlike some people on this forum that start their bashing without an intro!!

On another account, I wish this person would quit assuming that the majority of APBT owners always buy from breeders. I for one adopted my full blood registered APBT for free from someone on a spay contract, no problem. Just because she wasn't from a shelter doesn't make anything wrong. Big whoopy on her papers, that is just a plus! I just love that I got a new family member to add. My girl is now spayed and the happiest dog ever!



> people should NOT buy animals... you love pitbulls you say and there are hundreds if not thousands is shelters right now because their pitiful previous owners couldn't deal with them. you should adopt them instead of buying more and supporting evil.


I feel some people pay good money to know they got a great deal and that means temperment, confirmation, and so they can show and do events. If you go to a shelter, they sometimes don't even know the background history on a dog, especially a APBT therefore certain people can be a little wary on the idea! Also I adopted my girl for free, paid $40 on her spay and $7 for her rabies. I don't agree with some shelters charging $85 for a pet adoption and then when no one comes to get that dog they just euthanize him/her which cost even more money! Why not lower the price and all to around maybe $45? Don't get me wrong, I totally think alot more people should adopt from shelters but I think attacking the people that don't is wrong!! The majority of great breeders know there dogs! They know the history, temperment, health, etc. that some shelters wouldn't even begin to tell you on their dogs! Everyone has their own opinion on what they look for in a dog! I personally prefer to adopt but others prefer to know what they have by buying from a breeder so quit attacking them!!! Also that remark I made about the shelter charging an $85 adoption fee, well that is the shelter in my area. I feel they are overpriced and when I look at their dogs, the majority of them look sick and depressed, have kennel cough, etc.. I understand they charge so much for the cost of keeping the animals but if they also lowered the fees just a little I am sure more people would want to adopt and the animals wouldn't have to stay in so long! Well anyways, I hope everyone has a wonderful day!!


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## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

Mrs_APBT_America said:


> I feel like this is all the same person IMO, only because they all seem to know rgrande is a HER and because they are all new w/o introductions. Same EXACT views and attacking points, but that is just MO!


i feel it's the same person 2


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*not the same*

It's not the same person... I will tell you the truth though... i am rgrande's sister and kevdev is her boyfriend... we all share the same views and that's that.

As for you Mrs_APBT_America I am glad that you adopted and didn't buy from a breeder. But you are against how high adoption fees are and for how much some breeders charge for their animals... hundreds up to a thousand or more... that makes no sense whatsoever. I am against ANYONE who buys a dog from a breeder. I don't care what their reasons are. Why do you think shelters don't have info on their dogs... uh it's because they find them or they are left there for them when people just drop them off... how are they supposed to get backgrounds on abandoned and stray dogs... I understand this specific forum is about Pitbulls and I love pitbulls and I think peta's stand on pitbulls being euthanized to attempt to stop dog fighting is utterly ludicrous. But what I am saying and I know rgrande was trying to say was there are too many animals out there that don't have homes and get euthanized while there are more and more and MORE animals out there being bred for pure profit. It's crap.

And as for your comment on the sanitary situation of some kennels and shelters you are correct in your observation of them but many puppy mills are in the same state if not typically worse.

Also, everyone's comments about criticizing us about not introducing ourselves is just stupid. We are discussing a serious topic and although it started as serious bashing... we are all dealing with passionate people with way different opinions... so to criticize us for not making introductions instead of giving a decent rebuttal... don't even bother. I told you who we are. Rgrande is a huge animal lover and activist and vegetarian. She researches day in and day out about the bad things that are going on in the world against animals and joins whatever she can and does whatever she can to help put it to an end. This includes the fact that there isn't enough adopting and there are too many people breeding for profit while beautiful sweet and loving animals are put down. 
As for kevdev... he said what he wanted to say in defense of his girlfriend and reaped the consequences of his language by getting kicked off of the forum. As for me... I am rgrande's sister and her and I believe in the same values that all animals deserve to be treated as an equal life to humans. Animals should not be for prizes or money... they are companions in every way. And this obsession with pure bred animals has helped boost the "conveyor belt" breeders who don't care about the animals and care about money. And you have your occasional professional breeders who aren't trashy and horrid, but they are still in it to make money while millions of animals are killed because of our selfish desires.

This all started about the peta advertisement... and we think that although it's crude and harsh... it got the point across... which I have to admit... is one of the few decent things they have done. Well, we believe it was decent. It didn't hurt anyone and it brought forth the reality of the situation...


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## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

.............................


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## Mrs_APBT_America (Jul 19, 2008)

> And as for your comment on the sanitary situation of some kennels and shelters you are correct in your observation of them but many puppy mills are in the same state if not typically worse.


I totally am 100% with you on this. I believe there are way to many byb's and puppy mills and it sickens me BUT I don't think that all professional or reputable breeders are in it for the money! Some yes, but not all! Without breeders with awesome bloodlines, our country would go to a mess with mixes and poorly bred dogs. Don't get me wrong, I love mix breeds, sometimes they are the best dog BUT I also am happy to know that their are people out there that will take it to the extreme to make sure we still have wonderful purebred dogs with great temperments and confirmation from selective breeding!

Anyways, to the 3 of you, welcome and I hope you enjoy it here! Do any of you own any APBTs or mixes or any pets in general? If so I would love to see pictures!


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## pitbulllover27870 (Jul 6, 2008)

Mrs_APBT_America said:


> Anyways, to the 3 of you, welcome and I hope you enjoy it here! Do any of you own any APBTs or mixes or any pets in general? If so I would love to see pictures!


yea i welcome you guys as well.. but a tip.. dont join a forum 2 start bashing and starting arguements or you'll end up getting banned


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*thanks*

I know rgrande and myself did not sign up to get banned. Not was it meant to be purely bashing... but more informative in a way. I am older than her so I tend to be a bit more calm. But in the end I think our points were made and thankfully respected.

We don't own any pitbulls. Rgrande has a golden who is very old and very sick. But he was adopted. I have my little milo who I believe is a mix of a brindle french bulldog and a papillion. He is my little baby and I can't imagine why he was given up... he is a little sweetheart. Although he has no loyalty because he will go to anyone who says hi to him. He loves everyone and everyone says they want a Milo in their family.

I have actually always wanted a pitbull. They are beautiful animals and have a horrible rep that angers me beyond belief. How people can blame their breed for attacks instead of blaming their irresponsible and evil owners is beyond me. I once wanted to adopt a blue pitbull from a friend of mine. But in the end my friend kept him which made me happy either way.

But I thank you guys for welcoming us!


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## kvndvn6 (Oct 2, 2008)

I'm surprised that I was not kicked out of this forum..but I do have to say, introductions. What is this AA? My name is so and so "Hi so and so" and I own a pitbull..come on..that's weird shit. how about we talk and listen?


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## Mrs_APBT_America (Jul 19, 2008)

Well introduction IMO is more for your dog than it is the owner! Alot of people like to introduce and show pictures of their pit or mix on here. We like to know who we are talking to also, it's not a crime to introduce yourself nor is it a requirement! It just helps us understand the each individual on here! Everyone on here is pretty much friends online therefore being friends we like to know a little about someone! 

"Hi, I am a mother of 4 dogs (2 being APBTs and 2 being labs), 2 cats, 2 chinchillas, 2 ferrets, and 3 horses, also a 13 month old daughter! My APBTs are my babies. I adopted Nevaeh and she is 5 months old. She is the pup in my picture to the left! It is nice meeting you 3."

No this isn't AA, BUT it is a pitbull forum therefore we usually introduce are pitbulls, and if you don't have one then that is fine! There are some people in here that don't own pitbulls but they are here to learn more about the breed!


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## chic4pits (Aug 25, 2008)

Phoenix said:


> Here is what PETA really means...
> 
> People for the Extermination of Trustworthy Animals
> 
> This is EXACTLY what they do!!!


*clap* *clap*
*laughs* funny..


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## kvndvn6 (Oct 2, 2008)

Hm...so.... this is like a cult?


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## rgrande (Oct 1, 2008)

My purpose was not to bash anyone. I saw this post and its criticism on PETA's methods, and decided it was my right to include my opinions on the matter. Perhaps I displayed my thoughts in an aggressive manner, but so be it. I AGAIN do NOT support PETA's behind the scene actions, but I felt I should clarify what they stand for and their wholesome protests...since so many people replying to this post attacked their morale.

As for pitbulllover..I understand if you did not personally attack PETA, but I felt the need to defend their magazine article, phone call, and mail delivery. In a world of superficial minds, how else can an extremist animal rights group get their point across? This, hopefully, touches people and encourages them to save a life by adopting.

Who cares if you don't know the background?! If the dog is sweet and kind, then adopt it. If someone asks you what kind of dog, you say I don't know and walk away. Do you HAVE to have an answer? It's the creature in front of you, not the breeds that went into making it.
And I completely disagree with buying because, although those dogs deserve homes too, the money is just supporting the puppy mills where they will continue to abuse and force breed dogs.

Now that's the kind of background you don't want.

And finally...as for introductions...who cares? I saw this and decided to give my input. You should be reading and obtaining my comment rather than worrying when I joined. That was my whole point.


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*now now*

kevdev be nice... or i will beat you with the bat that was supposed to be yours.... so sshhhhh


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## rgrande (Oct 1, 2008)

That isn't what it stands for at all.
For, I don't know, the TENTH time...PETA is not 100% innocent. Not even close. And I, nor anyone else who has stood by them on here, have agreed with their animal killings. It isn't right, obviously, BUT their protests and accomplishments and what they stand for as a whole are wonderful and noble.
I DO NOT AGREE WITH THE FACT THAT THEY KILL 90% OF THEIR ANIMALS!
I will not support that at all.
BUT, AGAIN, THEY STAND FOR A GREAT CAUSE THAT ALL PET OWNERS COULD VAGUELY APPRECIATE.


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## chic4pits (Aug 25, 2008)

kvndvn6 said:


> I'm surprised that I was not kicked out of this forum..but I do have to say, fuck introductions. What is this AA? My name is so and so "Hi so and so" and I own a pitbull..come on..that's weird shit. how about we talk and listen?


our introductions to ppl are just to be nice and say hey, you dont have to post one if you dont want...we just like to know someone is new so we can welcome them..that's all..
oh, and as you stay longer, you'll see we do ALOT of talking and listening..but we respect each others views on here...not bash with foul language(since we are all grown ups on here we can talk like them, not like hot headed kids) ..we are all here for the same purpose, the love our animals (whatever they may be) 
esmith: how can you say you are against ANYONE who buys from a breeder? I see and understand that our shelters are in major overload to say the lest..but that's kinda harsh dont you think? You want ppl to listen and respect your view, that means, you listen and respcet theirs, not come outta the gate saying you dont like someone b/c of where thier dog came from. There are ALOT of wonderful ppl on this forum that will help you in the best ways they can, and some have adopted, some bought from kennels, other have both. that shouldn't be an issue, the issuse should be : we are all here for the same cause, to learn, share, advise and above all else try our best to save this wonderful breed. 
now with that being said, myself and kolby welcome yall to the fourm, i hope yall do stick around for a while ..sounds like you might have some instering views on things. 
o' and renagade ..i dont see what the big deal is about your post, its' ur view.


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## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

kvndvn6 said:


> I'm surprised that I was not kicked out of this forum..but I do have to say, fuck introductions. What is this AA? My name is so and so "Hi so and so" and I own a pitbull..come on..that's weird shit. how about we talk and listen?


Not posting an Intro is exactly why you are where you are dumb ass..:hammer:


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## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

kvndvn6 said:


> Hm...so.... this is like a cult?


Want some kool aide? :hammer:


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## Bleu Clair (Jun 14, 2008)

I know this new member got canned, but I just wanna say what I have to say. People who know me well know I cuss like a sailor. I, therefore, have no problem with foul language, but you don't get a point across by calling someone you don't know a dumb sh*t. If you want to debate a point then fine, everyone has the right to their own opinion, but coming on a pit bull forum, where PETA is not liked because they want to see all pit bulls dead, and insulting a forum member, while defending PETA's actions, will not get your point across well. 

Everyone knows that animals die in shelters every day, even people who aren't animal lovers know it. There is already plenty of information on it out there and I am all for educating the public, but a person doesn't need to be offered a body bag to know this. PETA's attempt at shocking people does nothing, but make them look more psychotic than people already view them as. 

PETA wants to see the end of all domestic animals and I believe that would include animals in shelters, so I really don't get the point in doing what they did.


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

*answers...*

*chic4pits:* i am not saying that all people that buy from breeders is a horrible person.. but i am against their choice. I think it is wrong to buy from a breeder, puppy mill and/or stupid mall pet stores not only because a lot of those animals parents are mistreated and used to badly until they are decrepit but there are so many animals out there that are not being given homes because the general public seems to have an obsession with making 100% sure without a shadow of a doubt they have a full bred animal. I am all for keeping this beautiful breed strong and their existence never faltering. But I also believe it's up to people like us and even maybe some extremist to bring a halt to breeders and puppy mills that are in it only for the money and do not care to take proper care of their animals. I think that breeders need to be licensed (and maybe they have to be i am not sure i have never been interested enough to buy a full bred) and only a certain amount should be allowed because there is already an overload of breeders as well as adoptable animals that are being euthanized. There needs to be a stop brought to places that mass produce and breed to the point that animals are dying and sick before and even after being purchased.

*ericschevy* you just sank to his level... congratulations...

*Bleu Clair* you have misunderstood the whole point rgrande was trying to convey. she already expressed her deepest loathing of the way peta operates during and after her original post. she was just expressing the fact that doing something as shocking as what they did for that ad we both agree to be a somewhat clever way of instilling the ultimate repercussions of buying dogs instead of adopting. we have also already discussed that as inappropriate as her initial bashing was... she still had a good point and later explained in more detail... as have i many times already. the grand point is... we believe this mass breeding needs to have an end brought to it quickly so that perfectly loving and beautiful animals have a better opportunity to be adopted rather than being put down... peta is one of the biggest contributors to this mass euthanization and they are, excuse my language, enormous pieces of sh*t... i hate their action (though i admit i found their ad quite shocking in a successful way) but i believe in what they are supposed to stand for... and that is literally the ethical treatment of animals...


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## Marty (Dec 10, 2005)

7 Things You Didn't Know About PETA

*1)* PETA president and co-founder Ingrid Newkirk has described her group's overall goal as "total animal liberation." This means no meat, no milk, no zoos, no circuses, no wool, no leather, no hunting, no fishing, and no pets (not even seeing-eye dogs). PETA is also against all medical research that requires the use of animals.

*(Ingrid Newkirk is a diabetic and has to use insulin herself) Added by Marty*

*2)* Despite its constant moralizing about the "unethical" treatment of animals by restaurant owners, grocers, farmers, scientists, anglers, and countless other Americans, PETA has killed over 14,400 dogs and cats at its Norfolk, Virginia headquarters. During 2005, PETA put to death over 90 percent of the animals it collected from members of the public.

*3)* PETA has given tens of thousands of dollars to convicted arsonists and other violent criminals. This includes a 2001 donation of $1,500 to the North American Earth Liberation Front (ELF), an FBI-certified "domestic terrorist" group responsible for dozens of firebombs and death threats. During the 1990s, PETA paid $70,200 to an Animal Liberation Front (ALF) activist convicted of burning down a Michigan State University research laboratory. In his sentencing recommendation, a federal prosecutor implicated PETA president Ingrid Newkirk in that crime. And PETA vegetarian campaign coordinator Bruce Friedrich told an animal rights convention in 2001 that "blowing stuff up and smashing windows" is "a great way to bring about animal liberation."

*4)* PETA activists regularly target children as young as six years old with anti-meat and anti-milk propaganda, often waiting outside their schools to intercept them as they walk to and from class-without notifying parents. One piece of kid-targeted PETA literature tells small children: "Your Mommy Kills Animals!" PETA brags that its messages reach over 2 million children every year, including thousands reached by e-mail without the permission of their parents. One PETA vice president told the Fox News Channel's audience: "Our campaigns are always geared towards children, and they always will be."

*5)* PETA has used a related organization, the PETA Foundation, to fund the misnamed Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine (PCRM), a deceptive animal rights group that promotes itself as an unbiased source of medical and nutritional information. PCRM's president also serves as president of the PETA Foundation.

*6)* PETA runs campaigns seemingly calculated to offend religious believers. One entire PETA website is devoted to the claim-despite ample evidence to the contrary-that Jesus Christ was a vegetarian. PETA holds protests at houses of worship, even suing one church that tried to protect its members from Sunday-morning harassment. Its billboards taunt Christians with the message that hogs "died for their sins." PETA insists, contrary to centuries of rabbinical teaching, that the Jewish ritual of kosher slaughter shouldn't be allowed. And its infamous "Holocaust on Your Plate" campaign crassly compares the Jewish victims of Nazi genocide with farm animals.

*7)* PETA has repeatedly attacked research foundations like the March of Dimes, the Pediatric AIDS Foundation, and the American Cancer Society, because they support animal-based research that might uncover cures for birth defects and life-threatening diseases. PETA president Ingrid Newkirk has said that "even if animal research resulted in a cure for AIDS, we would be against it."

Anyone that thinks they can tell me what I can own, eat, wear is out to take away our rights one thing at a time and I will not sit back and let it happen, I do not will not support any of them


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## MADBood (May 31, 2008)

PETA is a slaughterhouse...plain and simple


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## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

esmith said:


> *ericschevy* you just sank to his level... congratulations...


One know it all after another, did you guys just crawl out from under a rock??:roll:


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## Sydney (Aug 14, 2007)

ericschevy said:


> One know it all after another, did you guys just crawl out from under a rock??:roll:


...I hear that is where they typically hide...they usually only come out to stir up trouble...


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## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

Sydney said:


> ...I hear that is where they typically hide...they usually only come out to stir up trouble...


Finaly!!!!!! Someone who's on the same page...:rofl:


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

of course it's you two that are the only ones that are so one sided and ignorant to the rest of the conversations that are attempting to stir up more trouble than what has already been stirred and settled...


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## Bleu Clair (Jun 14, 2008)

esmith said:


> *Bleu Clair* you have misunderstood the whole point rgrande was trying to convey. she already expressed her deepest loathing of the way peta operates during and after her original post. she was just expressing the fact that doing something as shocking as what they did for that ad we both agree to be a somewhat clever way of instilling the ultimate repercussions of buying dogs instead of adopting. we have also already discussed that as inappropriate as her initial bashing was... she still had a good point and later explained in more detail... as have i many times already. the grand point is... we believe this mass breeding needs to have an end brought to it quickly so that perfectly loving and beautiful animals have a better opportunity to be adopted rather than being put down... peta is one of the biggest contributors to this mass euthanization and they are, excuse my language, enormous pieces of sh*t... i hate their action (though i admit i found their ad quite shocking in a successful way) but i believe in what they are supposed to stand for... and that is literally the ethical treatment of animals...


I was just defending my original post to rgrande because of the responses I got back. Personally, I would never agree with anything PETA does, no matter how noble it looked to me, 'cause the bad they do taints any good they do by far (and Marty has summed a lot of that up in his post). I do get what you're saying about rgrande agreeing with the action of what PETA did rather than the group now that you've clarified it more, I just don't believe in being that extreme. Going to extremes such as this makes a group look like a bunch of asses and lunatics, not like normal people trying to get a good point across.


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## esmith (Oct 2, 2008)

kudos to all of those points my friend. especially about weighing peta's rare good against it's mind blowing evil. it was never meant to turn in to such a blowout... although the original post certainly leave didn't leave much room for the correct interpretation.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

*Plus your not gonna find muh support for ''peta" on a apbt site,plain and simple*


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## Marty (Dec 10, 2005)

My avatar says it all


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## chic4pits (Aug 25, 2008)

esmith: to your reply :: answers... 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

chic4pits: i am not saying that all people that buy from breeders is a horrible person.. but i am against their choice. I think it is wrong to buy from a breeder, puppy mill and/or stupid mall pet stores not only because a lot of those animals parents are mistreated and used to badly until they are decrepit but there are so many animals out there that are not being given homes because the general public seems to have an obsession with making 100% sure without a shadow of a doubt they have a full bred animal. I am all for keeping this beautiful breed strong and their existence never faltering. But I also believe it's up to people like us and even maybe some extremist to bring a halt to breeders and puppy mills that are in it only for the money and do not care to take proper care of their animals. I think that breeders need to be licensed (and maybe they have to be i am not sure i have never been interested enough to buy a full bred) and only a certain amount should be allowed because there is already an overload of breeders as well as adoptable animals that are being euthanized. There needs to be a stop brought to places that mass produce and breed to the point that animals are dying and sick before and even after being purchased. 
yes, it's a very nice thought but it will never become reality...but you can't judge someone based on where they want to buy their animal. all of us on here are VERY aware of the situation in our shelters and even for the animals who are not in shelters and just running loose. it's a very sad situation, but until their are tuffer laws this is just a situation we will have to deal with and learn to over come.


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## chic4pits (Aug 25, 2008)

Sydney said:


> ...I hear that is where they typically hide...they usually only come out to stir up trouble...


*giggles* sorry , couldn't help it..but i thought it was the rain that brought ppl outta the wood works? or at lest down here that's how it seems..idk


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

This thread is causing to much rif and bashing. Esmith, Kvndvn6 and Rgrande go and do an intro. Kvndvn6 clean up the foul language or you will be banned. 

It is closed.


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Wrong! This is our forum and we have rules. If you join a forum or any other entity you must abide by said rules. Clearly you care nothing about following these rules and for THIS REASON are getting banned. Not what you said but how you said it.

Read the rules.



> you may not like it..but we're allowed to use foul language!





> i see no point in an introduction.


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