# QUESTION? Razors Edge x Colby?



## pittlover86 (Oct 16, 2008)

So reading through the posts here, I found the one on Razor's Edge and it got me thinking. So I grabbed Athena's parent's papers to double check, but I was right, her father has Razor's Edge bloodline listed. So does that mean she is NOT an APBT?

Her father is Razor's Edge, her mother is Colby. They are CKC registered as purebred American Pit Bull Terrier I have her CKC papers to send in, and it says that she is a purebred American Pit Bull Terrier. 

I may have misunderstood the Razor's Edge post, but I thought it said if the dog had RE, it was not APBT. If that is true, are the CKC papers wrong? 

I love her no matter what (she is my babyup::love2 but I want to be sure everything is correct. I am very interested in showing her (I know I'm a newb but I am learning all that I can now, even as she is just 8wks) and if any of this would make a difference for that? 

Can anyone tell me about RE x Colby lines? I have to send her puppy reg. in this week, and I am getting the option with the Pedigree included, but thought maybe someone here might have some info?

Sorry this was so long


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

Ouch. If her only papers are CKC, then she may not even be purebred. CKC is a registry that people go to when they cannot get legitimate papers on their dogs. You wont be able to show her with CKC papers as far as I know. Then again, if you'd settle for things like weight pull, agility, obedience, etc., you should check out the UKC's LP program. It would require her being spayed, but that might be the best bet for her.

Colby is an old line of APBT that's been around since the 1800s. Here is their website: Colby's American Pit Bull Terriers

Razors Edge is a line that is shrouded in controversy. At best, it is an APBT/AmStaff line that has been bred for greater and greater extremes. At worst, it might be crossed with other breeds. At the very least, it is one of the most overly-peddled lines out there. The founder of the RE line, Dave Wilson, doesn't even call his dogs APBTs anymore. He calls them American Bullies.

Sorry to have to be so negative. I hate seeing people get had by bad breeders.


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Its such a touchy subject but honestly I would have to say that if your dog has RE in it, and you consider the true APBT to be what the original standard says it is, and if you look at purity of blood then no. Is it still a great dog, sure just not pureblood APBT.


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## pittlover86 (Oct 16, 2008)

Wow. Ok. So are you saying that I paid good $$$ for a purebred with papers, that is a mutt? (as I said before, I still love her dearly) If that is the case, I am extremely pissed off at the breeder. How can her papers (and parents) say Purebred APBT if that is not true?


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

You can put anything on paper, ESPECIALLY with the CKC. Now people will debate you to death on the purebred issue with RE. The truth of the matter is that David went outside the APBT to create RE so they CAN NOT be pure if they have RE in their line. Paper hanging is SOOO easy its not funny and really there should be DNA requirements for registering dogs, but even that can be fudged. I can register litters off of dead dogs Ive had as long as I still have the registration numbers on these dogs.


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## BedlamBully (Jun 6, 2008)

CKC is a crap registry, sorry. ANYONE can put together a registry I could print papers off in my garage and charge people $50 a pop. Not trying to put you down that just the general outlook on the CKC.

Razors Edge, Gotti, Mugglestone(sp) are all Bully lines, though they still get registered as APBT's if you look at the standard very few of them resemble a true apbt. They have all admittedly mixed in other 'Bull Breeds' to create the look of the current dogs.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

It also means that some one did one of the most backwards crosses of all time,although im sure she makes you happy and is a cutie,thas what matters now,jmo.....


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

pittlover86 said:


> Wow. Ok. So are you saying that I paid good $$$ for a purebred with papers, that is a mutt? (as I said before, I still love her dearly) If that is the case, I am extremely pissed off at the breeder. How can her papers (and parents) say Purebred APBT if that is not true?


Hey welcome to the forum sorry you got burned for your money sadly there are alot of breeders out there breeding who shouldn't be in the first place. You can google blue pitbull/pitbull and you will find several so called pitbull breeder websites at the top of the search engine that come up that are basically mixed breeds and they are charging thousands of dollars for them and yes people are buying them actually thinking they are buying purebred pitbulls. It's extremely sad and very unfair to the breed the dogs being poorly bred with no standards and the buyers. That's why it's important to join a forum like this one and learn as much as you can about the breed and what the original standard was intended to be for the american pitbull terrier. The only registeries I would consider reputable would be the akc the adba and ukc and even then you still have mutts registered with them as well and hung papers but not nearly as bad as the ckc. Regardless you have found your little bundle of joy and she is beautiful. Papers IMO only matter if your going to show your dog/breed even still if she is ckc regsitered you will be able to show her with the ckc as they do have show events. So I wouldn't put so much into the papers themselves the dog makes the papers not the other way around. It's good to know where your dog stems from but now that you know what happens in the ugly world of breeding should you choose to buy another dog in the future you know what to look for :thumbsup: Good luck with your new pup and make sure to post more pics as she grows


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

the only registries id give any credence to are the akc and fci,although it pains me to say that about the akc seeing as how they destroyed so many working dogs just for fashion and style,at least they don't register mutts as purebred dogs,for the apbt the adba is the way to go,the ukc is so full of crosses they might make up the majority of there registration,"JMO!"


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## sw_df27 (Feb 16, 2007)

wow I just have to say a RE/Colby dog that is one of the saddest things I have heard.............. No offence to you or your dog the pup in you avatar is beautiful I just can't believe someone put those to lines together.........


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## roleary (Jan 11, 2008)

oh comon, have some sense of adventure, venturing out into the unknown, trying the untried, ....I would REALLY like to see what a true colby and razors edge cross would look like. I would love to see pics if you have them! Depending on the dogs bred, habits, etc. it would probably produce a nicely proportioned pup... not to thin, not too thick, some flex... regardless of what the dog would be labeled.


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## MetalGirl30 (Apr 15, 2008)

OldFortKennels said:


> You can put anything on paper, ESPECIALLY with the CKC. Now people will debate you to death on the purebred issue with RE. The truth of the matter is that David went outside the APBT to create RE so they CAN NOT be pure if they have RE in their line. Paper hanging is SOOO easy its not funny and really there should be DNA requirements for registering dogs, but even that can be fudged. I can register litters off of dead dogs Ive had as long as I still have the registration numbers on these dogs.


Andy is right.

Dave Wilson claims they are not APBT's but Am Bullies, but still registers his dogs as APBT's.
There was a petition going around awhile back trying to get the registry to jerk away his papers to his dogs claiming they were not a real APBT.


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## sw_df27 (Feb 16, 2007)

> oh comon, have some sense of adventure, venturing out into the unknown, trying the untried


really breeding a Re Am Bully with a Colby APBT there's no point in that it's two diff. breeds. As far as trying the untried I have no problem with that as long as your not mixing 2 diff. breeds and calling it pure. Colby is one of the oldest APBT lines at this maybe just my opinion but should only be breed with another colby or at the very least a actual APBT line.........


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

sw_df27 said:


> really breeding a Re Am Bully with a Colby APBT there's no point in that it's two diff. breeds. As far as trying the untried I have no problem with that as long as your not mixing 2 diff. breeds and calling it pure. Colby is one of the oldest APBT lines at this maybe just my opinion but should only be breed with another colby or at the very least a actual APBT line.........


I agree 100% makes no sense to take one of the oldest purest american pitbull terrier lines out their and mix it up with an american bully line. + it's not like you see pure bred colby dogs running around everyday I know they are out there but to my understanding the colby family is very picky about who they sell their dogs to they are trying to keep their line as pure as possible without watering it down with outcrosses. I went on his website and you can inquire about their breedings but they do not breed very often. Being though the breeder has given the OP's ckc papers he could say the dog is whatever he wants because that's just how easy it is to register dogs with the ckc and claim them to be whatever. I think it's more common to find colby somewhere way back in a dogs pedigree than it is to find a pure colby dog JMO and any breeder who says they are breeding colby dogs period I would be very leary of . JMO


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## MetalGirl30 (Apr 15, 2008)

I met a guy one day who got his wife's taco dog papered as a pit bull through the CKC. He just wanted to make a point that they have no standards of registry and will accept just about anything you say or send in.
He originally breeds German Short Haired Pointers. He uses them as bird dogs and has a champion hunting retriever sire. I guess that is how you would put it. I do not bird hunt that much, except Turkey hunting every now and then and do not know that much about the bird dog world.


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## PullDawgPits (Apr 15, 2008)

I'm sorry for you. I know that you will love your pup no matter what but since you said you were interested in showing, then I am sorry.

CKC is a junk registry, I wouldn't even bother sending in her papers and giving them any money. Love her and play with her, she doesn't know that she doesn't have papers or that she isn't "well bred", she just knows that she loves you.

If you decide to get a dog for showing or competition then try to find a reputable breeder who has ADBA registered dogs. Learn more about APBT bloodlines, so that you will know when someone is not being truthful.

Best of luck to you and your pup, she sure is cute!

Stephanie


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

roleary said:


> oh comon, have some sense of adventure, venturing out into the unknown, trying the untried, ....I would REALLY like to see what a true colby and razors edge cross would look like. I would love to see pics if you have them! Depending on the dogs bred, habits, etc. it would probably produce a nicely proportioned pup... not to thin, not too thick, some flex... regardless of what the dog would be labeled.


sence of adventure,is that what is now the definition of destroying working breeds?
If the breeding has no purpose than for a pet,the shelters the way to go.
Also to play rebels advocate,go back far enough in any RE dogs ped youll surely find your share of colby stuff,its just been washed out of the modern stuff for the most part.


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## pittlover86 (Oct 16, 2008)

These pics are almost 2wks old, she'll be 9wks on Sunday. I'll take some new ones tomorrow.

Regardless of being upset at being 'had', she is an amazing dog and I love her to death already. We are still obediance training her, as I feel a dog should be at their highest potential, whether or not she will be a Show Dog.

I have started researching APBT more thoroughly, and my husband and I have decided that probably in a year we will get another pup, from a reputable Kennel...maybe the next time one of ya'll have a litter in the making, let me know:thumbsup:

Thanks for all the replies guys, I really love this forum


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

Glad to hear you're sticking with her. You can still do activities with her even though she wont be your show dog. The ADBA lets "purebred but unregisterable" altered APBTs do fun classes and the UKC lets altered dogs do several different sports like weight pull, agility, obedience, dock diving, and dog sport. In fact, that's a really good idea if you've never shown a dog before. It'll give you exposure to the show environment, and give you the opportunity to learn how things run. Then it wont be such a shock to you when you go to show yourself.

In addition, the more you do with your current girl, the more likely you are to be able to get a puppy from a really great breeder. The top-notch breeders tend to look at what folks do with the dogs they've already got before placing another one with them. Most prefer to place the dogs in homes where they'll realize their full potential. If you can go to a breeder and be like "so this dog wasn't what I had bargained on, but I spayed her and put a CGC and weight pull title on her," that's impressive to them. Speaks volumes about your dedication.

Anyway, that's my hot tip of the day. LOL! She's a pretty girl and I'll be very interested to see how she grows.


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## Huberpits (Oct 31, 2008)

Pitlover86, your pup sure is a cutie. I am sorry that you got "had" by ckc papers. Do you mind if I ask how much you paid for her with ckc papers? 
addition.. i am big fan of Colby's dogs. much respect for them and what they do.


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## allaboutpitbull (Nov 5, 2008)

hey their is conformation dogs of america that have verry high standards for APBT no bullie i have my dogs with them and ukc adba they are great


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## Patch-O-Pits (Jan 12, 2008)

No matter what your pup being a great pet is #! in my book. What a doll. Best of luck!!!!

Beware of registries that will take any paperer dog and paper them without proof of spay/neuter. IMO those are people just looking to make $$$ and not in the best interest of the dogs by any means.


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

allaboutpitbull said:


> hey their is conformation dogs of america that have verry high standards for APBT no bullie i have my dogs with them and ukc adba they are great


Please quit promoting this registry. Their only standards are you have to have witnesses who will say your dog is purebred. That's no standard at all. Sorry if you like them, but they're really no better than the CKC, and the OP already has one set of bad papers.

ETA: Seriously, if this CDOA is a project of yours, just come clean about it.


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## allaboutpitbull (Nov 5, 2008)

hey if they ask i will share my exprience with them really stop tallking out your ass i know it kind of hard but cuz it so f** but realy try iv lost all respect for you W.T.


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## bahamutt99 (May 14, 2008)

Again, I could give a rat's ass if a scammer respects me or not. I don't need your respect, and if I had it, that means I'm doing something wrong.

Save your money people. The CDOA is run by our very own allaboutpitbull. The email that that site is registered to is the same email he uses.

CDOA website is registered to:

Reys Belzer ([email protected])
(281) 888-6749
4800 Lamonte Ln
Houston, TX 77092-5434


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

bahamutt99 said:


> Again, I could give a rat's ass if a scammer respects me or not. I don't need your respect, and if I had it, that means I'm doing something wrong.
> 
> Save your money people. The CDOA is run by our very own allaboutpitbull. The email that that site is registered to is the same email he uses.
> 
> ...


:clap: Nice Work Lindsey :rofl:


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## sw_df27 (Feb 16, 2007)

Very nice!!!!!!!


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