# Why are people so mean?



## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

As I was reading the comments on how pretty Vendetta is in her irthday thread I started rembering when I got her. I was so happy to get her I had to have Chalice put down a couple of month before ( she was showing signs of HA) My Mikado was ill ( kidney failure). My sister saw the poster for her on the grocery store wall. We called and I got her for 50$ yes from a BYB. There are alot of them around here. I posted on another forum about her and I received so much grief. I was told she was ill-bred. I shouldn't have gotten her. She would have been better off dead and pretty much told that because of me BYB would never go away. 

Yes she is from a BYBer does that mean she is any less of a dog? She is a fine example of an APBT. She is everything I could want in a dog. 

It hurt me to think that anyone could look at her sweet face and say she didn't deserve a good home and a chance at a good life.

Just felt like venting alittle.


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## Chump (Nov 20, 2010)

I think it helps stoke folks ego to put someone else (or dog) down. Take it in stride! I personally find it humerous when someone who knows nothing of a dog says it should be "put down." It says a lot about that person and nothing about your dog.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

Didn't you know? This is the age of the Keyboard Commando! The internet has allowed numerous people that still live in their mommy's basement to be able to type what ever they want and sound "tough". Fact is that most people that say things like that would never have the cojones to say that to someone's face.

Don't let it get you down. Vendetta is beautiful. You love her and that's all that matters.


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## Lex's Guardian (Aug 8, 2009)

Meh. That's just people being people...If it weren't about a dog it'd be about something else. Seems as though the idea of having manners is fading out.


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

People sometimes get caught up in the "Big Picture" politics and lose their perspective. Vendetta is an individual dog and she deserves to have a good home. I think every dog and every human deserve that, regardless of their breeding, background or appearance.

In the "Big Picture" perfect world no one would ever buy a dog from a back yard breeder or a pet shop and the puppy mills and BYB would go out of business and we'd all be better off for it. But, in the real world there are innocent dogs and puppies that through no fault of their own are already born.

I've found that a lot of people have very strong opinions regarding things that affect them only tangentially, but when those very same things affect them directly they change their position a 180 degrees. Some people talk big about what other people should do until that abstract situation actually lands on their own doorstep.

Add that to the anonymity of the internet and you can get a perfect environment for "meanness". Don't let 'em get you down. You, as an individual, faced with a real life situation, made the right choice and have been rewarded for it.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

Bernie came from a BYB with the belly big as a weiner dog and his hips and spine popping out. At the bully forum everyone was talking down to me because I saved him and they told me I was pretty dumb for not getting a real Bully bred dog. I know how you feel but be proud of your doggy, papers and titles do not make a dog, their heart and loyalty does


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## ashes (Jul 7, 2010)

I had taken my dogs from a BYB once since he wasn't taking care of her and I'm the type to rescue a dog from a freeway which I have :/ my cocker spaniel. MY BYB dog (gizmo) was a good dog and was a great companion. Sometimes it's very rewarding to rescue these dogs and have them turn alright. I know some of them can come woth a lot of issues but that isn't their fault. And vendetta is ADORABLE


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## angelbaby (Feb 4, 2010)

sound slike she came from a bad environment but ended up in a loving home , how could she not be a great dog i'd be forever grateful if someone recued me from that environment as well. I think every dog has a purpose in life wheather its showing, working , rehabilitating someone physically mentally or emotionally { these so called house pets often do alot more then meets the eye } I dont think its anybodys place to judge a dog by appearance or where they come from if they do maybe its to cover up there own jealousy and in securitys they have about there dogs.


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

That why I have loved this forum compared to others. 

I have no patience for people who act that way towards someones animal.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

Agreed!

I believe it was you who commented on my thread describing my experiences in getting Roxie and Kane, who are both from a BYB. I've heard from many people on other forums the same things you have, that my dogs don't "count", that I'm a horrible person for "supporting the industry".

Honestly, these dogs are the best things that have ever come into my life. I live and breath for them and they do the same for me. I got my dogs to be DOGS, not to be a living example of the APBT breed standard. And the fact that I got two pups from one BYB, two pups covered in fleas, full of worms, and being killed by their own mother (which I view as 'saving' them), doesn't mean I support the industry of BYB -- maybe if I exclusively bought pups from BYBs, sure. But I don't.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Since this thread is asking for oppinions, i'll voice mine as nicely as possible.

You know I believe vendetta is a very special girl, has provided you with some comfort in your heart after the passing of Chalice and Mikado... She has done phenominal in training, and is an asset to the bulldog world... and she deserves everything you have to offer... on the same hand..

It is super disheartening when someone who has been such an advocate for the breed as well as rescue their entire life goes against everything they preach about believing in... Purchasing a BYB dog. In a sense I am glad she's in your hands, but on the same note it is quite confusing and contradicitory to the public what your morals truely are when you have belonged to a website like this for so many years with so many posts... the Logo's motto in the top left hand corner of this site says promoting responsibility, increasing awareness, and doing what needs to be done. Ignorance is one thing... buying a dog out of the paper, craigslist, off the side of the road when you don't know any better... but having the knowledge as well as all of the necessary tools to aquire a well bred dog cheap if not free just off of this website is alone is just.... frustrating.

We've preached for many years just because a dog is loving, loyal, trainable, etc. it is not an excuse to breed that dog. 

Those paragraphs stand true for every one of us who have had time to be here and truely learn to love these dogs. It is not a finger pointing gimmick, rather something i would say to any one else who posted a similar thread like this. It's all about the dogs and their future. 

On a side note... Have you been able to hear how her siblings are doing?


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Sharon, people said the same thing about Helena and I. And I was new to the pit bull world at the time, had never even heard of a BYB. I got Helena from a friend who bred her parents. At that time I thought that's just what people did. I didn't think anything of it at all. My friend and her fam lived out in the country. And they had several dogs. They had been BYB snouzers (sp?) for years! lol Helena did end up having the demo mange and stuff so I did learn from my experience and next time would like a dog that I know it's background. But those same people jumping on me for buying from a BYB were very pro rescue. Most of their dogs were rescues... don't they realize their dogs came from a BYB just like mine did? My dog just didn't have to go through the "system" so to speak like theirs did.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

I would pay a couple of hundred bucks for BYB pup to get it out of misery but I would never ever pay more than that for BYB dog. I think those who buy a 3k dollar dog from a breeder that doesn't health test their dogs is supporting a terrible practice.


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## jmejiaa (Dec 8, 2009)

Some people are just passionate about not getting dogs from a BYB. I've seen it on this forum where a new member will get upset because of people not liking BYB's. They have been in a different context like wanting to breed and all...

This world is ugly, don't expect people to be nice this way you won't be disappointed. When someone is nice I am pleasantly surprised, when someone is mean I just shrug it off and continue. Even more so online where a lot of E-thugs hang out behind a screen preaching.

Sasha is from a BYB, I never knew anything about the breeding world and how bad BYB is for these animals. I don't regret it one bit, at this point you can only educate. 

The problem isn't ending anytime soon as long as dogs still make money, people would sell babies if it was legal, hell they still do.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

davidfitness83 said:


> I would pay a couple of hundred bucks for BYB pup to get it out of misery but I would never ever pay more than that for BYB dog. I think those who buy a 3k dollar dog from a breeder that doesn't health test their dogs is supporting a terrible practice.


I agree about the 3k deal!


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> It is super disheartening when someone who has been such an advocate for the breed *as well as rescue their entire life goes against everything they preach about believing in*... Purchasing a BYB dog. In a sense I am glad she's in your hands, but on the same note it is quite confusing and contradicitory to the public what your morals truely are when you have belonged to a website like this for so many years with so many posts... the Logo's motto in the top left hand corner of this site says promoting responsibility, increasing awareness, and doing what needs to be done. Ignorance is one thing... buying a dog out of the paper, craigslist, off the side of the road when you don't know any better... but having the knowledge as well as all of the necessary tools to aquire a well bred dog cheap if not free just off of this website is alone is just.... frustrating.


Isn't buying a dog from a BYB in a sense rescuing it? Now if she paid $500 or more for the dog from a BYB I would say that she was helping to perpetuate the cycle, but buying a dog for $50 hardly seems like the BYB was out to make a buck.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

wild_deuce03 said:


> Isn't buying a dog from a BYB in a sense rescuing it? Now if she paid $500 or more for the dog from a BYB I would say that she was helping to perpetuate the cycle, but buying a dog for $50 hardly seems like the BYB was out to make a buck.


A BYB is a BYB all day long... $1-100,000 it's all the same. Rescue is when someone discovers a dog in need. You hardly discover a dog while responding to an ad or flyer then exchange money for it.

I need to go on record i didn't come back here to argue... I'm here for the dogs, the old salts, and all of the new owners who come into this breed and/or are new to dog ownership.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Yeah but you could argue in a sense that... when you get a dog from a BYB and you are a responsible owner you kept it going to someone who might fight, beat or starve the dog?


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

I guess because I know sharon and her intentions it's different it's not like sharon bought Vendetta to breed her. She bought Vendetta to give her a better life I am glad that she ended up in responsible hands and not in the wrong hands. At least with Sharon the BYB cycle will not repeat itself. I look at this case as a rescue situation it's not Vendetta's fault how she came into the world. I am just glad she ended up in good hands with someone who will love and give her everything she deserves. Sharon has been rescuing dogs for some time now and most people who know her on these forums know this about her.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> A BYB is a BYB all day long... $1-100,000 it's all the same. Rescue is when someone discovers a dog in need. You hardly discover a dog while responding to an ad or flyer then exchange money for it.
> 
> I need to go on record i didn't come back here to argue... I'm here for the dogs, the old salts, and all of the new owners who come into this breed and/or are new to dog ownership.


Not to start an arguement here but Rescues allow stray mothers to have their pups and place them for over 200-300 bucks. I don't see the difference between that and someone that though they could make a buck. A rescue is only effective in my opinion when they deal with neglect or dogs that get thrown out on the street. But letting the mother have puppies from an unknown source is almost the same as backyard breeding. You are charging for puppies that come from parents that are not health tested or temperament tested. My dog was a jewel in a hay stack he came with papers but he came out of BYB, he was a pup that had a lot of promise and so far he has been a heck of an ambassador for the Pit Bull umbrella.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

I do believe I rescued her. I am unsure where the others ended up but I can be pretty sure that they are dead. We have a terrible problem with dog fighting up here. I know of alot dogs that end up as bait dogs. 

I guess I would have to say that if I buy a dog off the street for a a smalll amount of money and give them a good home until I find them a new one or if a dog came from the woods and I found it a new home it is a same in my book. I rescued a life that didn't ask to be born it didn't ask to be thrown away like yesterdays trash. All the dogs I do find homes for are spayed or neuterd all out my own pocket ( this why I'm so poor). 

I consider the two rabits I brought home a month ago a rescue too. They were advertised in the newpaper. I called she brought them to me at work they were so skinny they could hardly stand up. One month later 40$ worth of good food and I have two healthy happy rabbits. A good rescue I think.

Thanks everyone for the replies. I just think a life is a life no matter how it came into the world.

Oh by the way there are some kennels out there that say they are doing the right thing when in fact they are just glorified BYBer's.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

MY MIKADO said:


> I do believe I rescued her. I am unsure where the others ended up but I can be pretty sure that they are dead. We have a terrible problem with dog fighting up here. I know of alot dogs that end up as bait dogs.
> 
> I guess I would have to say that if I buy a dog off the street for a a smalll amount of money and give them a good home until I find them a new one or if a dog came from the woods and I found it a new home it is a same in my book. I rescued a life that didn't ask to be born it didn't ask to be thrown away like yesterdays trash. All the dogs I do find homes for are spayed or neuterd all out my own pocket ( this why I'm so poor).
> 
> ...


I agree 100% I know kennels that pull the old BS excuse "he is a working dog, he doesn't need health testing" and they go right ahead and breed without it and charge couple of thousand for the pups and think they are hot poop.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

I do not agree with the statement that not buying from backyard breeders will stop them. I was talking to a guy selling pit bull pups on the corner one day. He said he wanted 100 bucks a piece. I said " do they have papers?" I knew that would be my out, since I wasn't looking to buy one. I just like to see pups. He said "no, you would pay a lot more if you wanted papers" I said "ok well no thanks" And he continued to try to pitch his sale. I just gave a smile and said "well good luck with them"


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

davidfitness83 said:


> I agree 100% I know kennels that pull the old BS excuse "he is a working dog, he doesn't need health testing" and they go right ahead and breed without it and charge couple of thousand for the pups and think they are hot poop.


I would say a working dog needs health testing more so than a pet! :goodpost:


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

Sadie said:


> I guess because I know sharon and her intentions it's different it's not like sharon bought Vendetta to breed her. She bought Vendetta to give her a better life I am glad that she ended up in responsible hands and not in the wrong hands. At least with Sharon the BYB cycle will not repeat itself. I look at this case as a rescue situation it's not Vendetta's fault how she came into the world. I am just glad she ended up in good hands with someone who will love and give her everything she deserves. Sharon has been rescuing dogs for some time now and most people who know her on these forums know this about her.


:goodpost:


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

davidfitness83 said:


> Not to start an arguement here but Rescues allow stray mothers to have their pups and place them for over 200-300 bucks. I don't see the difference between that and someone that though they could make a buck. A rescue is only effective in my opinion when they deal with neglect or dogs that get thrown out on the street. But letting the mother have puppies from an unknown source is almost the same as backyard breeding. You are charging for puppies that come from parents that are not health tested or temperament tested. My dog was a jewel in a hay stack he came with papers but he came out of BYB, he was a pup that had a lot of promise and so far he has been a heck of an ambassador for the Pit Bull umbrella.


Rescues that take in a pregnant dog and let it have the puppies are not "breeding" they are allowing for whatever is done is done. The mother is then spayed and they're not "selling" puppies. The adoption fees help to fund the rescue so they can take in, feed and vet more dogs. It doesn't matter that the father is an "unknown source" as it's not a breeding/selling situation.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

I am glad she ended up in her hands and not some scumbag with bad intensions. I know she wouldn't breed her, even if she did come with her papers, because that's not what Sharon is about... One thing we both can agree on is that a pregnancy is super tough on our girls and is completely unnecessary. 

IDK, rescue and BYB mean different things to different people. I reckon it's all in what your personal views are.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

Gimbler said:


> Rescues that take in a pregnant dog and let it have the puppies are not "breeding" they are allowing for whatever is done is done. The mother is then spayed and they're not "selling" puppies. The adoption fees help to fund the rescue so they can take in, feed and vet more dogs. It doesn't matter that the father is an "unknown source" as it's not a breeding/selling situation.


Think about it, they are rehoming puppies for a fee right? they don't know whether these dogs will grow up to have genetic disease causing their owners heart break and thousands of dollars in vet fees.


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## boogiebot (Oct 7, 2009)

oour dog nahla came from a byb. but to be honest what the hell did i know until i hit this site.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> A BYB is a BYB all day long... $1-100,000 it's all the same. Rescue is when someone discovers a dog in need. You hardly discover a dog while responding to an ad or flyer then exchange money for it.
> 
> I need to go on record i didn't come back here to argue... I'm here for the dogs, the old salts, and all of the new owners who come into this breed and/or are new to dog ownership.





Shes Got Heart said:


> Yeah but you could argue in a sense that... when you get a dog from a BYB and you are a responsible owner you kept it going to someone who might fight, beat or starve the dog?


That's my point. Isn't making sure a pup from a BYB goes to a good home a pup in need? I'm not here to argue either. Just discussing.


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

davidfitness83 said:


> Think about it, they are rehoming puppies for a fee right? they don't know whether these dogs will grow up to have genetic disease causing their owners heart break and thousands of dollars in vet fees.


What exactly would you have them do with the puppies?

They don't know either whether these puppies will grow up to be the greatest dogs in the world bringing their owners much joy and happiness. Nobody knows what the future will bring. Health testing prior to deliberately breeding is a no brainer - you want to ensure as much as possible against health defects but it's no guarantee on the future.

But, taking in a dog that has been irresponsibly allowed to breed, vetting that dog and her puppies, feeding, spaying, shots - that all adds up. They are not selling they are charging a fee to recoup a portion of the costs. I love people that think they shouldn't have to pay any fees to adopt a properly vetted dog. I bet they'd like free sprinkles too!

Edited to add:
Every dog I've ever owned has been a rescue. I don't know who their parents are, where they came from, or how they lived. All I know is that each and every one of them have been special in their own way and all have given and received much love. None of them have suffered from genetic defects that are common among their respective breeds. Maybe I've just been lucky. But, it wasn't something that I could have mapped out - guaranteed lifetime of health. What I also do know is that when they required vet care they got it, because they were my responsibility and I knew that when I adopted them.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

wild_deuce03 said:


> That's my point. Isn't making sure a pup from a BYB goes to a good home a pup in need? I'm not here to argue either. Just discussing.


Thats the point I'm leaning towards too. Since most BYB's just sell their pups to a stranger and have no contact afterwards. If they do keep contact you generally won't see them take the dog back like a reputable breeder would do if a problem arises and the dog can't be kept.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

I never have nor will I ever take a fee for one of my rescues. I spay them I nueter them and then follow my gut on placing them in homes. I just saw one of the last puppies I placed. He is a beauitful dog and very much loved. Last yr I got to see several of the dogs I had placed. They are all doing well. Yes I sometimes mess up and end up with a bad home but everyone knows they can call me and I take them back.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

One thing that I do know is this... The lady who had Melony for a minute got into BYBing... she found that as these litters came with these bulldogs she couldn't find enough homes... I can't say she honestly screens homes so it was a honest lack of homes... she gave up on our type of dog and switched to the little dogs like Yorkies, Jack Russells, Chihuahuas, Poms ect. ... because they sell.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Wow two to three hundred dollars is a lot for a rescue! I literally did rescue the dog I had before Helena. She was a stray lab pup that came into the vet clinic my mom worked for at the time. She came in with her mom. She was scheduled to be put to sleep the morning and I called my mom and said "make sure they don't do it! I'll take her" My dad paid 60 dollars for her, it included her spay and all of her shots for the first year. That was like 10 years ago though... but I still see rescues advertise on craigslist to adopt dogs for 50 to 100 dollars with spay/neuter and shots.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

My pups would probably be dead if I hadn't bought them for $50 bucks from my ex's friend's uncle.

Instead, they are healthy, happy family pets.

How is that not a rescue? How is that not worth doing?


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> One thing that I do know is this... The lady who had Melony for a minute got into BYBing... she found that as these litters came with these bulldogs she couldn't find enough homes... I can't say she honestly screens homes so it was a honest lack of homes... she gave up on our type of dog and switched to the little dogs like Yorkies, Jack Russells, Chihuahuas, Poms ect. ... because they sell.


What happened to the puppies? Did you find homes for them yourself? Did you sell Melony on a spay contract?


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

k8nkane said:


> My pups would probably be dead if I hadn't bought them for $50 bucks from my ex's friend's uncle.
> 
> Instead, they are healthy, happy family pets.
> 
> How is that not a rescue? How is that not worth doing?


Helena came from a 4 pup litter. Of the 4, I can only say for sure... 1 is still alive and it is Helena. I can say for sure that 2 of them are dead. One was kept by my friends fam and hit by a car out in the country that he was chasing. And the other, died at about 6 months of age because my other friend who took him left him at the vet and never picked him up. The other pup was sold to an unknown person so who knows he might still be out there. He was identical to Helena.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Shes Got Heart said:


> What happened to the puppies? Did you find homes for them yourself? Did you sell Melony on a spay contract?


Melony is back at home with me. There was never any money exchanged, but a contract was made that she would only be able to be bred if she recieved a working or conformation title. Otherwise it was grounds for reposession. Every dog in the litter melony was in, i kept because i couldn't find qualified homes.

The girl ended up giving away the last of her bulldog puppies and fixing her adults at the time... she left Diamond unaltered which is the same age as my dogs, and only lord knows if she will have a breeding career like her mother which made me want to vomit.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

From my pups litter, I can only say for sure that one other pup is alive, and that's because she lives with another friend within our circle. So, that's 3 puppies out of a litter of 12, 4 of which were killed by the mother.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> Melony is back at home with me. There was never any money exchanged, but a contract was made that she would only be able to be bred if she recieved a working or conformation title. Otherwise it was grounds for reposession. Every dog in the litter melony was in, i kept because i couldn't find qualified homes.
> 
> The girl ended up giving away the last of her bulldog puppies and fixing her adults at the time... she left Diamond unaltered which is the same age as my dogs, and only lord knows if she will have a breeding career like her mother which made me want to vomit.


I know that you have all of the pups from Mel's litter. And that is a good thing. But am surprised you did not take in the puppies that were produced as well. Those pups of your dogs line may have fallen into a similar situation.


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

Shes Got Heart said:


> Wow two to three hundred dollars is a lot for a rescue! I literally did rescue the dog I had before Helena. She was a stray lab pup that came into the vet clinic my mom worked for at the time. She came in with her mom. She was scheduled to be put to sleep the morning and I called my mom and said "make sure they don't do it! I'll take her" My dad paid 60 dollars for her, it included her spay and all of her shots for the first year. That was like 10 years ago though... but I still see rescues advertise on craigslist to adopt dogs for 50 to 100 dollars with spay/neuter and shots.


I don't think two or three hundred is a lot for a rescue. I paid close to two hundred for Maggie and she was given all of her shots, treated for an eye infection and had been spayed and licensed. I paid forty dollars for Jake (from a pound) and had to sign a contract that I would have him neutered. I had to pay for his shots - close to 80 bucks at the shelter clinic, another 80 for an ear infection, his neuter was like 150 and his license was 12. I got a better deal on Maggie.

Try to keep in mind too that while the specific dog you adopt may have only needed shots, spay/neuter, and a few days worth of food - some dogs have serious issues that cost a lot in vet care and medications and are fostered or kenneled for extended periods of time. The costs are evened out, somewhat, by making a little on one dog and losing a little on another. All in all it's still a money losing proposition for the rescue.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Gimbler said:


> I don't think two or three hundred is a lot for a rescue. I paid close to two hundred for Maggie and she was given all of her shots, treated for an eye infection and had been spayed and licensed. I paid forty dollars for Jake (from a pound) and had to sign a contract that I would have him neutered. I had to pay for his shots - close to 80 bucks at the shelter clinic, another 80 for an ear infection, his neuter was like 150 and his license was 12. I got a better deal on Maggie.
> 
> Try to keep in mind too that while the specific dog you adopt may have only needed shots, spay/neuter, and a few days worth of food - some dogs have serious issues that cost a lot in vet care and medications and are fostered or kenneled for extended periods of time. The costs are evened out, somewhat, by making a little on one dog and losing a little on another. All in all it's still a money losing proposition for the rescue.


:goodpost: Ok I can understand that.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

The one shelter here charges up to 500$ for a dog. The other shelter has the dogs at around 100$. Guess which shelter finds more homes? All are spayed/neutered and fully vetted.


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

people get so caught up in petty nonsense and finger pointing, and
yet they don't have the courage to stand in front of a mirror and do the same.

byb are here to stay, and being that dogs are listed as personal property
no one has the right to point fingers or put on a big white wig and judge
them. I'm confidant enough in what I've learned over the years to trust my
own personal judgment in the choices i make...albeit in my younger years
alot of those choices weren't in my best interest. this is how one learns, through pain
and loss of money. from these experiences one gains wisdom, and with that you're
more likely to make decisions based off "your" trials and tribulations. no one takes advice,
as there is no foundation for an individual to consider the repercussions of ones actions
otherwise. it seems the internet is one big hub of people to joust and wrestle for a non existent title. 
in short, do what makes you happy. life isn't long enough to make apologies.


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## davidfitness83 (Jul 7, 2009)

I almost got the Presa Canario it would have been 450 for the adoption.


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

MY MIKADO said:


> The one shelter here charges up to 500$ for a dog. The other shelter has the dogs at around 100$. Guess which shelter finds more homes? All are spayed/neutered and fully vetted.


Well, since they're in the same area and all other things being equal I'd have to guess it's the $100 shelter that's adopting out at a faster rate. But, I wonder, and maybe you know, how they manage to do that? Adopt out at $100?

Who is picking up the cost? I know a lot of vets will volunteer some time or lower fees for rescues, but charging $100 seems like someone somewhere is sacrificing a lot more than is normally expected. What about food? Staff? Pull fees?

I have a friend that runs a pretty large horse rescue and over the years she's been just brilliant in coordinating sponsors, volunteers and community involvement. But, she's a phenomenal human being with more brains and energy than 99% of the people of I've ever met. Her picture should be in the dictionary next to "multi-tasking".


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

Padlock said:


> people get so caught up in petty nonsense and finger pointing, and
> yet they don't have the courage to stand in front of a mirror and do the same.
> 
> byb are here to stay, and being that dogs are listed as personal property
> ...


Love it - especially the last two lines.


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## Gimbler (Jan 29, 2010)

davidfitness83 said:


> I almost got the Presa Canario it would have been 450 for the adoption.


Was it a breed specific rescue? It's been my experience that they charge more. Sometimes cause they've paid fees to get the dog out of another shelter or pound and into their own foster homes.

I nearly paid 350 to the Rhodesian Ridgeback rescue, and included in that was the transport fee from Texas to Pennsylvania, but I backed out. I just couldn't bring myself to commit to adopt a dog sight unseen. Especially because we have cats and with Ridgebacks they either love them or see them as prey - there doesn't seem to be any "in between" attitude about cats.


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## Chump (Nov 20, 2010)

*???*

What is wrong with Vendetta? I have seen plenty of worthless high dollar well bred dogs, and plenty of great home grown dogs. Some of the best performing apbt's were byb. That being said, you have to hedge your bets. If you want a dog that will catch hogs you are probably going to have better luck with a pup from proven parents. That being said, some of the best catch dogs I have seen are from ******** who have a couple good dogs so they decided to breed them.

Anyway, I am just saying that Vendetta looks and sounds like a great dog. Don't let any highbrows make you think different.

People like that can go drink their moccha lattes, smoke virginia slims and talk about there wonderful pedigrees. I am fine with a PBR and a stogie. (Actually I don't smoke...but you get my point?)


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

> the Logo's motto in the top left hand corner of this site says promoting responsibility, increasing awareness, and doing what needs to be done


Is not giving a home to animal that is already born and turn said dog into an ambassador for the breed not fullfilling the motto on this forum.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

Gimbler said:


> Well, since they're in the same area and all other things being equal I'd have to guess it's the $100 shelter that's adopting out at a faster rate. But, I wonder, and maybe you know, how they manage to do that? Adopt out at $100?
> 
> Who is picking up the cost? I know a lot of vets will volunteer some time or lower fees for rescues, but charging $100 seems like someone somewhere is sacrificing a lot more than is normally expected. What about food? Staff? Pull fees?
> 
> I have a friend that runs a pretty large horse rescue and over the years she's been just brilliant in coordinating sponsors, volunteers and community involvement. But, she's a phenomenal human being with more brains and energy than 99% of the people of I've ever met. Her picture should be in the dictionary next to "multi-tasking".


Well the one shelter uses a vet that does thing very reasonably. He is a good vet just a little old fashion. They have all kinds of fund raisers and many voluteers. The other shelter uses a vet with a name and really high end equipment. The rely on donations and make it really hard to volunteer for them. One is a comman peoples shelter the other is a snouty peoples shelter.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

MY MIKADO said:


> Is not giving a home to animal that is already born and turn said dog into an ambassador for the breed not fullfilling the motto on this forum.
> 
> Please correct me if I'm wrong.


:goodpost::goodpost::clap: Thank you! That's the point I was trying to make.


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## Alitlebit_ofJACK (Oct 6, 2010)

:cheers: doing what needs to be done


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## mcmlxxxvii (Jul 29, 2010)

i got bella from a byb. i can only imagine the kind of life she could have ended up with had i not come across her ad. i've seen both of her parents so i knew visually what i would end up with. the health risks did not matter to me as she deserved the best regardless of any health problems she may have been born with. luckily, she has been a healthy and happy dog up to this point. papers or no papers, it doesn't make a dog any less. i've noticed that some types of people believe papers make their dog better and almost use it to brag about how they have the best and are above you. what they don't get is that we don't care. our dogs aren't here to show off or make us look better, they're here to be loved as family.

from what i have seen, vendetta is an asset to this breed. the public doesn't look at our dogs and think papered or not papered. they look and see the breed based on physical attributes and then see how well-mannered the dog is. i can't look at the dogs on this board and pinpoint those who are papered. all i see are pit bulls and how great they represent this breed. the people on this board do a lot of good for all of us. 

i've posted this before, but it always comes up. we own the same breed, fight to keep them and show people how great they are, yet there always seem to be divisions between us over stupid things. i don't get it.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

mcmlxxxvii said:


> i got bella from a byb. i can only imagine the kind of life she could have ended up with had i not come across her ad. i've seen both of her parents so i knew visually what i would end up with. the health risks did not matter to me as she deserved the best regardless of any health problems she may have been born with. luckily, she has been a healthy and happy dog up to this point. papers or no papers, it doesn't make a dog any less. i've noticed that some types of people believe papers make their dog better and almost use it to brag about how they have the best and are above you. what they don't get is that we don't care. our dogs aren't here to show off or make us look better, they're here to be loved as family.
> 
> from what i have seen, vendetta is an asset to this breed. the public doesn't look at our dogs and think papered or not papered. they look and see the breed based on physical attributes and then see how well-mannered the dog is. i can't look at the dogs on this board and pinpoint those who are papered. all i see are pit bulls and how great they represent this breed. the people on this board do a lot of good for all of us.
> 
> i've posted this before, but it always comes up. we own the same breed, fight to keep them and show people how great they are, yet there always seem to be divisions between us over stupid things. i don't get it.


Well said! :goodpost::goodpost:


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

Yes.

IMO, it doesn't matter where the dog comes from as long as they are healthy, happy, and a great ambassador for the breed.

Unfortunately, I don't think petty issues will ever go away. Some people thrive on them.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Shes Got Heart said:


> I know that you have all of the pups from Mel's litter. And that is a good thing. But am surprised you did not take in the puppies that were produced as well. Those pups of your dogs line may have fallen into a similar situation.


I think you misunderstood. I had the one litter which i was legally bound to by a written contract. the mother of that litter is Indigo. Melony, Cree, and Pig were produced from that litter. There haven't been any other puppies out of my dogs besides the ones you all watched grow up: Pig, Cree, and Melony

Melony was placed around 12-14 weeks in age in a home i felt was a good match for us all on the contract i mentioned before... i later found her to be neglected and over fed. That is when she came back to my place.

EDIT: I am going to stick to my guns since these dogs are such a huge part of who I am today... Buying from a back yard breeder reguardless of the circumstances is still just wrong. I have had my own BYB dog I won't deny that. Mable (mable was produced from a BYB, but I took her in as a rescue through the person who bought her in the first place) and Bella. They both are spectacular dogs which i would never trade for the world, but if i had to do it all over again, I wouldn't ever ever ever ever ever line the pockets of someone who just wanted to have a litter of pups.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

oh yeah those "puppies" will be 2 in April.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

I'm not here to argue with you sharon. I'm glad you have vendetta, she is a fantastic dog in the right hands. We just don't see eye to eye on what is best for these dogs which is fine and dandy as long as we both make sure no more animals are produced without homes.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

I won't ever willingly go through a BYB to get another dog. Not after what I've learned.

But I think there's a difference between teaching someone why it is better to get their dog from a reputable breeder or rescue and demeaning and belittling them for their mistake and a lesson learned (usually).

I think that's what she's trying to get at by making this post.


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> I'm not here to argue with you sharon. I'm glad you have vendetta, she is a fantastic dog in the right hands. We just don't see eye to eye on what is best for these dogs which is fine and dandy as long as we both make sure no more animals are produced without homes.


in a perfect world those are attainable expectations. sadly, it's not the
world we live in. bottom line, 90% of orgs are in it solely for monetary gain
and the victims are the bleeding heart folks who donate there time and or money.
let me elaborate, predominately women donate to Peta and the HSUS (same org) and other animal rescue establishments due to there emotional based thought process as they "feel" compelled to help...(not to be confused with a logical based thought process. IE: men) no offense meant, it's scientific fact.
pita in turn now has more political pull in buying politicians to put stricter animal laws in place to keep generating this machine of constant cash flow. and what do they do?...they kill the pit bulls anyway. hypocrisy at the highest level. the animals are the smoke and mirrors for a means to an end.
why most cant see it for what it is is beyond me. it's clear as day if one
would just open their eyes.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

k8nkane said:


> I won't ever willingly go through a BYB to get another dog. Not after what I've learned.
> 
> But I think there's a difference between teaching someone why it is better to get their dog from a reputable breeder or rescue and demeaning and belittling them for their mistake and a lesson learned (usually).
> 
> I think that's what she's trying to get at by making this post.


Understandable.....


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

Actually I was just venting. I don't have many people in my real life that understand my love for this breed. I don't have many people that understand the damage that they do by having these litters of puppies. But once a pup or kitten is born they need a home it is a sad state but it will contintue to spiral out of control. It is sorta like the child that is abused he/she will most likely ending up abusing or the child that is raised around alcohol will they themselves drink. Do we not try to help these people? Do we let them be and not offer a helping hand because they should know better. My dog didn't know any better, these people didn't know any better because that is the way it is. You have to teach them not berate the person that wants to give a better life to the helpless and homeless.

That was my beef.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Dave Y Am I STILL Banned? said:


> I think you misunderstood. I had the one litter which i was legally bound to by a written contract. the mother of that litter is Indigo. Melony, Cree, and Pig were produced from that litter. There haven't been any other puppies out of my dogs besides the ones you all watched grow up: Pig, Cree, and Melony
> 
> Melony was placed around 12-14 weeks in age in a home i felt was a good match for us all on the contract i mentioned before... i later found her to be neglected and over fed. That is when she came back to my place.
> 
> EDIT: I am going to stick to my guns since these dogs are such a huge part of who I am today... Buying from a back yard breeder reguardless of the circumstances is still just wrong. I have had my own BYB dog I won't deny that. Mable (mable was produced from a BYB, but I took her in as a rescue through the person who bought her in the first place) and Bella. They both are spectacular dogs which i would never trade for the world, but if i had to do it all over again, I wouldn't ever ever ever ever ever line the pockets of someone who just wanted to have a litter of pups.


I'm sorry I must have misread what you said. I thought you said Melony was bred and produced a litter.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Padlock said:


> in a perfect world those are attainable expectations. sadly, it's not the
> world we live in. bottom line, 90% of orgs are in it solely for monetary gain
> and the victims are the bleeding heart folks who donate there time and or money.
> *let me elaborate, predominately women donate to Peta and the HSUS (same org) and other animal rescue establishments due to there emotional based thought process as they "feel" compelled to help...(not to be confused with a logical based thought process. IE: men) no offense meant, it's scientific fact.*
> ...


You can not be freaking serious..... HSUS is run by a man. Wayne Pacelle... it's a fact. :flush:


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

i think you misread whats stated. that is not what should
be the main focus of my comment and you manipulated 
it's content to throw stones. remember, you can't learn anything
while talking.

"if man is involved, then it must be corrupt." by "me"

that goes for everything in life, politics, religion, law, and 
the hsus.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

Padlock said:


> i think you misread whats stated. that is not what should
> be the main focus of my comment and you manipulated
> it's content to throw stones. remember, you can't learn anything
> while talking.
> ...


What are you even talking about dude? You said not to be confused with a logical thought process IE Men... Such as... women can not think logically. You have already shown on this site numerous times that you are sexist towards women.


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

i think you like to throw words around just to make your reverse
sexist statements seem note worthy. we both already know your
personal preference, which makes anything that i write seem sexist to you.
if you dig, you will find more dirt. leave it alone already.


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Shes Got Heart said:


> You can not be freaking serious..... HSUS is run by a man. Wayne Pacelle... it's a fact. :flush:


I hate to say this... He does have a point... if you're calling him out in a quotation on a sexist remark with your reply insinuating the ignorance of a man is no different.... :flush::flush::flush:

With that being said, i need to walk away before i get in anymore trouble


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Theres no denying that you hate women, now your just trying to brainwash women into thinking they are in the wrong, but you are a true chauvanist.

Most of the women on this forum are better than you. get off your high horse.


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Oh wow I did not see this... Padlock I tried to defend you in another thread thinking you may have been saying that women think on a sensitive side and men dont.. which would be somewhat true for most... 

But thinking sensitively and logically are two different things... Even though women tend to think with a more sensitive point of view... Women are also more likely to carry a higher knowledge of many things... This is because women can think with a larger rational portion of their brain... There have been many studies done on this... Also women tend to be this way because their brains start to mature at a much younger age than men giving them to ability to start critical thinking and retaining informaiton long before a man...

I am not a sexist person or racial for that matter but facts are facts... Bottom line.


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## mcmlxxxvii (Jul 29, 2010)

Padlock said:


> in a perfect world those are attainable expectations. sadly, it's not the
> world we live in. bottom line, 90% of orgs are in it solely for monetary gain
> and the victims are the bleeding heart folks who donate there time and or money.
> let me elaborate, predominately women donate to Peta and the HSUS (same org) and other animal rescue establishments due to there emotional based thought process as they "feel" compelled to help...(not to be confused with a logical based thought process. IE: men) no offense meant, it's scientific fact.
> ...


:goodpost:

i agree. it's true from what i have read and seen. there are MANY more women who volunteer their time at animal shelters and the humane society. men would rather do other things with their time. plus, if you think about all the commercials that show the dying dogs with sad eyes asking for your $$$....they're aimed more towards women viewers than men. men will change the channel and not give it a second thought. women will watch and feel like they need to do something. just a play on our natural tendencies. a well done play at that. nothing sexist about his comment.

and hsus obtains a huge annual revenue, however they do tend to spend more than they make. i don't necessarily agree with the way they spend their money though... and as an ex-volunteer for my local HSUS i can honestly say that i strongly disagree with some practices and the people they hire. so much that i would say some of those people should face jail time.

Charity Navigator Rating - The Humane Society of the United States

they do have a giant pull in the community. our cities tend to look to the local HSUS for statistics/information on animal welfare. IMO this is why our county passed a mandatory spay/neuter law for all pit bull type dogs. :flush:

just my two cents. sorry! lol


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Oh wow I did not see this... Padlock I tried to defend you in another thread thinking you may have been saying that women think on a sensitive side and men dont.. which would be somewhat true for most...
> 
> But thinking sensitively and logically are two different things... Even though women tend to think with a more sensitive point of view... Women are also more likely to carry a higher knowledge of many things... This is because women can think with a larger rational portion of their brain... There have been many studies done on this... Also women tend to be this way because their brains start to mature at a much younger age than men giving them to ability to start critical thinking and retaining informaiton long before a man...
> 
> I am not a sexist person or racial for that matter but facts are facts... Bottom line.


:goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

Reps coming your way Sarge


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

mcmlxxxvii said:


> :goodpost:
> 
> i agree. it's true from what i have read and seen. there are MANY more women who volunteer their time at animal shelters and the humane society. men would rather do other things with their time. plus, if you think about all the commercials that show the dying dogs with sad eyes asking for your $$$....they're aimed more towards women viewers than men. men will change the channel and not give it a second thought. women will watch and feel like they need to do something. just a play on our natural tendencies. a well done play at that. nothing sexist about his comment.
> 
> ...


:goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:

thank you for being able to understand what you read. :clap:
that was exactly on par with what i wanted to convay. 
some seem to have the pitch fork and torches already lit.


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## mcmlxxxvii (Jul 29, 2010)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Oh wow I did not see this... Padlock I tried to defend you in another thread thinking you may have been saying that women think on a sensitive side and men dont.. which would be somewhat true for most...
> 
> But thinking sensitively and logically are two different things... Even though women tend to think with a more sensitive point of view... Women are also more likely to carry a higher knowledge of many things... This is because women can think with a larger rational portion of their brain... There have been many studies done on this... Also women tend to be this way because their brains start to mature at a much younger age than men giving them to ability to start critical thinking and retaining informaiton long before a man...
> 
> I am not a sexist person or racial for that matter but facts are facts... Bottom line.


another :goodpost:

both sexes think logically, women just have (and use) more emotional intelligence. that's the reason men can see those commercials and turn the channel. they avoid the emotion because they TEND to see the commercials for what they are. (women do too, but we still feel sorry for the animals) plus men usually aren't the first to bother with things that don't directly affect them. example = if a guy and girl see a dispute in the street, men won't want to get involved and would rather keep walking but women will usually feel the need to make sure everything is ok or call for help. men and women ARE wired differently and don't process information in the same way. (that's also a scientific fact) examples of this are seen in simple misunderstandings between husbands and wives. or how a wife will get so upset over something while the husband stands there wondering what the heck is going on. or even a common reference is the "no, go ahead, it's ok" or "nothing is wrong" statements when you're in a relationship - depending on who says it, it could be a straightforward remark or it could be a test. lol. of course, as with everything, there may be exceptions. women are naturally prone to that motherly instinct and want to help the helpless. it's not about women being less than men or not as intelligent, because we are, we just use another part of our brain more often so people try to take advantage of that for their benefit. in this case, $$ to fund their organizations. think about it. what other reason would orgs have for putting sad video up of a dying puppy? :rain:

of course i don't have money to throw around to paste science journal articles on here (that's about $40/6 pages of a journal article) but it's a fact that we do process info in different ways

Are There Differences between the Brains of Males and Females?
How Men & Women Think, on MedicineNet.com

i laughed cause i saw that we also tend to "manipulate information". so don't think this is demeaning to us (women) by any means. :roll:


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Padlock said:


> :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:
> 
> thank you for being able to understand what you read. :clap:
> that was exactly on par with what i wanted to convay.
> some seem to have the pitch fork and torches already lit.


I dont think anyone was standing there waiting for you with torches and pitch forks but some of the things you say do sound a little women bashing... I think I saw what you were really trying to say but maybe you just didnt word it the way it was meant to be?


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## mcmlxxxvii (Jul 29, 2010)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> I dont think anyone was standing there waiting for you with torches and pitch forks but some of the things you say do sound a little women bashing... I think I saw what you were really trying to say but maybe you just didnt word it the way it was meant to be?


haha he worded it like a guy. insensitively. :hammer: jkjk


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

...............


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

mcmlxxxvii said:


> another :goodpost:
> 
> both sexes think logically, women just have (and use) more emotional intelligence. that's the reason men can see those commercials and turn the channel. they avoid the emotion because they TEND to see the commercials for what they are. (women do too, but we still feel sorry for the animals) plus men usually aren't the first to bother with things that don't directly affect them. example = if a guy and girl see a dispute in the street, men won't want to get involved and would rather keep walking but women will usually feel the need to make sure everything is ok or call for help. men and women ARE wired differently and don't process information in the same way. (that's also a scientific fact) examples of this are seen in simple misunderstandings between husbands and wives. or how a wife will get so upset over something while the husband stands there wondering what the heck is going on. or even a common reference is the "no, go ahead, it's ok" or "nothing is wrong" statements when you're in a relationship - depending on who says it, it could be a straightforward remark or it could be a test. lol. of course, as with everything, there may be exceptions. women are naturally prone to that motherly instinct and want to help the helpless. it's not about women being less than men or not as intelligent, because we are, we just use another part of our brain more often so people try to take advantage of that for their benefit. in this case, $$ to fund their organizations. think about it. what other reason would orgs have for putting sad video up of a dying puppy? :rain:
> 
> ...


^ ah, true intelligence. how refreshing. lol :woof:


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Padlock said:


> ...............


Why this? I am really just trying to understand your writing... I dont personally think there is anything wrong with what you said BUT that is only after I look past the way it was written...


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## Indigo Bully Connection (Dec 21, 2006)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Why this? I am really just trying to understand your writing... I dont personally think there is anything wrong with what you said BUT that is only after I look past the way it was written...


I read it a second ago... he put the padlock approval on your post.


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

it is amazing to me that one can really read something
as emotionless as type and get butt-hurt over it.
this is where your subconscious exposed your faults,
fears, and insecurities. think before you respond, and if in 
fact it deserves a response, make it an intelligent one.
don't try and sway "the group" for your own personal gain.
this is why the world as a whole is so negative. 
remember these two simple things, the truth always hurts,
and the biggest lies are the ones we tell ourselves.


----------



## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Why this? I am really just trying to understand your writing... I don't personally think there is anything wrong with what you said BUT that is only after I look past the way it was written...


sorry about the confusion, i was typing while you posted thinking i would be under the response i quoted without needing to quote it.


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## truepits92 (Nov 23, 2010)

I just wanna say that BYB or not Vendetta is BEAUTIFUL and it's not about how she came to this world it's about what she is doing now for the breed && YOU <3
Secondly I don't know if it was mentioned but alot of "breeders" lately are breeding and studding dogs that arn't exactly what any of us concider "worthy"! The internet makes it easy for "breeders" to say they are worthy of breeding that their dog has this or that or has even done somthing they have not and not be looked down apon. There is a local breeder over here who cranks out about 6 litters a year. She lives off of it. That is her only sorce of income. Did she have GREAT dogs at one time? YES but now they are decendents and her quality has changed alot. She sells her breeder females for dirt cheap to other breeders when they stop produceing for her. They live bad lives in 4x4 kennels or on 5' chains ... yet people buy her pups like its goin out of style because of - What she used to have... I relize it makes for great dogs and great lines I just think it's wrong that she pawns off her pups without anyone thinking of the parents. When I went there I could not go thru with getting the pup I REALLY wanted. I did not want to support her. I now see the prices of her pups dropping on her site and the number of pups increasing. It just is a reality check that even the dogs with titles in their name and the "good old breeders" is not always the way to go. 
Kera is 2 and still no pups and when I see people breeding on their first heat I want to cry. I also know someone who bought a blue TRI male. about 13" tall and bred to about 10 bitches a week for about 2 months he showed me the records to call people when they need to pay him. I said how did you breed him to sooo many? HE Artifically Inseminated ALL of them because his male couldnt even hump the females yet. Its so wrong that so many people go for it ... the boom of itty bitty pitty unregistered crap pits around here is not a welcomed thing at all. All because they are BLUE TRI pups and hes little and wide. (and long) noone cares. They just want puppies to make money. I lost an okay friend now but its good bye from me because thats not what REAL breeding is about.


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

And the truth is what exactly IYO?


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Padlock said:


> it is amazing to me that one can really read something
> as emotionless as type and get butt-hurt over it.
> this is where your subconscious exposed your faults,
> fears, and insecurities. think before you respond, and if in
> ...


Wait wait wait I am lost.... Who was this referring too?


----------



## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

mcmlxxxvii said:


> :goodpost:
> 
> i agree. it's true from what i have read and seen. there are MANY more women who volunteer their time at animal shelters and the humane society. men would rather do other things with their time. plus, if you think about all the commercials that show the dying dogs with sad eyes asking for your $$$....they're aimed more towards women viewers than men. men will change the channel and not give it a second thought. women will watch and feel like they need to do something. just a play on our natural tendencies. a well done play at that. nothing sexist about his comment.
> 
> ...


Actually the HSUS has nothing to do with the local humane societies. They have no affiliation. From what I've heard in the past (someone back me up on this?) The HSUS does not actually run a shelter that adopts out animals. They piggy back off the humane society name, hoping people will think they are affiliated with the local orgs.


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## mcmlxxxvii (Jul 29, 2010)

Shes Got Heart said:


> Actually the HSUS has nothing to do with the local humane societies. They have no affiliation. From what I've heard in the past (someone back me up on this?) The HSUS does not actually run a shelter that adopts out animals. They piggy back off the humane society name, hoping people will think they are affiliated with the local orgs.


:goodpost:
true. local humane societies don't adopt out animals though and will promptly correct you if you call them a shelter. they tend to follow the lead of the HSUS in education, prevention and low-cost care.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

mcmlxxxvii said:


> :goodpost:
> true. local humane societies don't adopt out animals though and will promptly correct you if you call them a shelter. they tend to follow the lead of the HSUS in education, prevention and low-cost care.


I know the Tulsa Humane Society adopts out animals..... I was going to work for them when I first moved here. They are a no-kill. I was going to take a pit bull mix there that my cousin gave to me once, he was going to take him out to the country and dump him. and they were going to charge me like 45 dollars to take the dog!


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

SARGEnNIKITA said:


> Wait wait wait I am lost.... Who was this referring too?


not you sargeNnikita,...it was a blanket statement for the reader as a whole, but oddly enough, she knew who it was meant for.


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

lol ok... Sorry blonde moment... No offense to anyone lol


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## jayandlacy (Sep 21, 2009)

I figure people are just mean cuz they can be. Sometimes it makes them feel good, or better about some aspect of themselves or something in their life. Some people don't care that others have feelings. Some people have only been shown mean, so therefore they are lacking social skills and mimic what they know. Mean can also be a shield because they are afraid of being found out for who they really are deep down inside. 

Like with your doggy dog. How embarrassing it must be for a person that spent $3000 on a dog that is full of structure problems, has a bad attitude (either mean or still pees all over the floor when they are 1 yr old), and isn't very interested in their human, to hear that you have obtained a wonderful dog from around the corner that loves you, looks awesome, is smart, and was only $50.

Just don't forget peoples negative comments are a reflection of themselves, not you


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## rebeccayhb (Jul 23, 2010)

what's byb?


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## Lex's Guardian (Aug 8, 2009)

rebeccayhb said:


> what's byb?


backyard breeder. Someone who doesn't take proper precautions when breeding. To put it in nice terms... Not a positive thing to be


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## jayandlacy (Sep 21, 2009)

back yard breeder. byb


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## aprilortego (Aug 23, 2010)

O.K. to get back to the OP, I think Vendetta is great and I do not have a problem with you getting her from a BYB and breaking the cycle. Nila was bought from a BYB by my husband and we love her to death. Nila was not abused or neglected in any way shape or form when we got her. She came with papers, shot records and vet records. Both of her parents were on site. With that said she is still from a BYB, but they day we got her she was set up to be fixed. The cycle was broke with Nila. 

With that being said, the byb did have his pockets padded with money from us but we did gain a great dog and I know for a fact that Nila will not ever have to worry about being used for breeding. I know she was not abused so I can't truly say she was a rescue but in my heart I feel she is because the cycle was broken with her. If enough dogs were fixed the byb would not have anything to breed.


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

aprilortego said:


> O.K. to get back to the OP, I think Vendetta is great and I do not have a problem with you getting her from a BYB and breaking the cycle. Nila was bought from a BYB by my husband and we love her to death. Nila was not abused or neglected in any way shape or form when we got her. She came with papers, shot records and vet records. Both of her parents were on site. With that said she is still from a BYB, but they day we got her she was set up to be fixed. The cycle was broke with Nila.
> 
> With that being said, the byb did have his pockets padded with money from us but we did gain a great dog and I know for a fact that Nila will not ever have to worry about being used for breeding. I know she was not abused so I can't truly say she was a rescue but in my heart I feel she is because the cycle was broken with her. If enough dogs were fixed the byb would not have anything to breed.


Well.. it sounds like the people you got her from were more responsible than most byb's. Most times the byb getting their puppies shots is unheard of. And they still want a lot of money for the pups.


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## aimee235 (Apr 29, 2007)

aprilortego said:


> If enough dogs were fixed the byb would not have anything to breed.


I find that to be false. The byb still has their own dogs that they can breed.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

I thnk what she is trying to say that if more dogs were fixed rather than being sold to people who want to breed there would less BYB'ers around. Education is what might change the mind set that BYB is not easy money.


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## YAHHOO (Nov 27, 2010)

I think no matter how you sugar coat it buying from a byb is perpetuating the cycle. If you want to rescue why not go through a reputable means and support an actual organization with that in mind. By buying your dog, she is a good dog im sure, from the breeder you gave him your approval to breed again because people bought his puppies. You claim you saved a life and im sure you did but you could have saved one without perpetuating the cycle if you went through rescue.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

YAHHOO said:


> I think no matter how you sugar coat it buying from a byb is perpetuating the cycle. If you want to rescue why not go through a reputable means and support an actual organization with that in mind. By buying your dog, she is a good dog im sure, from the breeder you gave him your approval to breed again because people bought his puppies. You claim you saved a life and im sure you did but you could have saved one without perpetuating the cycle if you went through rescue.


But is a oe time oops litter really a byb'er. That is the real question. I say NO it is different than the person tat gets two dogs and breeds and breeds and breeds with no regards to his dogs or to where the pups are going.

To me a life is a life. If she had been surrended to the shelter I mostly like would not have gotten her as she was a christmas gift I don't know if my sister would have had the 200-300$ that the shelter charges to get her for me.

I don't know I guess we all have different standards and all that really matters is that I have Vendetta and I am happy with her and she has a good life.


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## Patch-O-Pits (Jan 12, 2008)

Good dogs are where you find them, meaning a pretty pedigree and responsible breeder don't always equal the best dog out there. I hate to give money to people like BYBs, puppy millers or pet stores, but in some situations it truly is saving a dog's life. Though it does make the supply and demand increase as well so it is a catch 22. I think most of us have or have had dogs from BYBs. So many are too quick to jump on others without knowing circumstances.


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## wild_deuce03 (Aug 14, 2010)

Patch-O-Pits said:


> Good dogs are where you find them, meaning a pretty pedigree and responsible breeder don't always equal the best dog out there. I hate to give money to people like BYBs, puppy millers or pet stores, but in some situations it truly is saving a dog's life. Though it does make the supply and demand increase as well so it is a catch 22. I think most of us have or have had dogs from BYBs. *So many are too quick to jump on others without knowing circumstance*s.


:goodpost::goodpost::clap:


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## 9361 (Jun 25, 2009)

I had no idea what a BYB was before I joined my first internet forum. When I was growing up, the way you got a new pet was either from the shelter, the free puppy sign on the side of the road, a stray roaming around... or if you wanted a dog with "papers" the newspaper. lol That is just growing up in a small town. So I would venture to guess that most people really do not know they are doing wrong by backyard breeding or buying from a backyard breeder.


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## YAHHOO (Nov 27, 2010)

MY MIKADO said:


> But is a oe time oops litter really a byb'er. That is the real question. I say NO it is different than the person tat gets two dogs and breeds and breeds and breeds with no regards to his dogs or to where the pups are going.
> 
> To me a life is a life. If she had been surrended to the shelter I mostly like would not have gotten her as she was a christmas gift I don't know if my sister would have had the 200-300$ that the shelter charges to get her for me.
> 
> I don't know I guess we all have different standards and all that really matters is that I have Vendetta and I am happy with her and she has a good life.


I agree as long as you are happy and feel you made the right decision under your circumstances then dont let anyone tell you what you did was wrong. I just know in my situation if I ever want a rescue I would rather supply a reputable bull breed rescue with my time and money, and I wouldn't get a puppy from them I would go with an adult dog so I knew what I was getting. I have had one rescue we got as a puppy and she was an amazing dog besides from her poor temperment which let to us having to let her go. We worked hard for 4 years on her because she was are baby, but after we moved the stress was insane for her and she was become OVERLY protective to a point I didn't feel comfortable with people coming over while my wife was along. So I think situations cause people to see things form a different view point, and believe me I wont judge someone for making a choice and getting there dog from somewhere I don't think is reputable. I was just giving you my opinion on why people were being mean to you about the choice.


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## Xiahko (Feb 24, 2010)

I was surprised I didn't get any grief from getting Beia,from who I assume to be a BYB. But really didn't have proof.
In all honesty,aren't the dogs better off with us,then with the original owner,or some other moron on CL?
I told myself,after being on here I wouldn't get a dog from a BYB,but after meeting Beia and seeing her condition,I just couldn't leave her in her current home. So I paid for her. I hate to think what could have happened to her,had I not.
I honestly think the guy wanted to keep her(he got teary when he handed her over) but he didn't know what he was doing obviously.


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