# Tethered Dogs



## junkyard (Oct 14, 2010)

Due to the issues on Davids dander thread about it being cruel to keep your dogs on a chain i thought it would be a good idea to start a thread on it, i understand in some places it has become against the law and i think for some pretty stupid reasons.

I have never owned an amstaff, a adba or ukc show dog , nor have i owned a bully so i am only speaking out of my own experience which is with gamebred apbt or as anyone who is a true fancier knows, a bulldog.

I have had three exceptions to the rule but generally i havent had any bulldogs that could get away without being chained. Chaining them is the safest possible way to keep them when done correctly and when maintained never creates any issues.
There are a ton of furmommies out there who think the oppisite but if you ask me they read way to many books written by idiots relying on unrealistic statistics and no real life experience with the breed in question.
This breed and the ones it came from have been kept on chains for hundreds of years more than any other, and it is for their own safetey.

Kennel runs are great but they realy limit the dogs movement and without a roof its just a risk at escape and i realy dont need that on my mind when i am not at home, nor do i want to hunt the streets for an escaped animal.

There is a myth that chaining dogs makes them mean, and there are books written about the stats involved, apparently the highest rate of dog attacks as a whole[on the dogs premises] are from male, unaltered adolescent dogs that are chained or tethered.
I think in my breed that is the biggest load of crap ever and is extremely biased from the powers that be.
With one exception i have never seen a single bulldog who was hitting the chain out of ha or wanting to attack, it is allways for attention and nothing more, once your on the spot they are loving it and dont want you to leave.
That exception was a problem dog from its previous owner abusing the dog and we kept him for awhile to see if we could fix him.

Any dog that is kept on a chain and abused and mistreaded will form behaviaral issues as would any dog who isnt kept on a chain.

Unless the dog is unstable from birth all examples of this breed thrive on a chain and there are many many dogmen who have better setups for their dogs than they have for themselves.

If you dont beleive it why dont you get a gamebred bulldog with the drive of twentyh dogs in one and see what happens when you let it have free reighn of the yard, yur other dogs will eventualy be dead and the dog WILL find a way to escape, then besides getting it back, take a garbage bag and collect the local pets bodies and take them to the poor owner whos pet yours dispatched on their little adventure, it happens and its allways the idiot who says, "i cant chain them, just treat them right and everything will be fine".

Chaining is the cheapest and when done the right way the safest way to keep the breed there is short of having a thousand dollar kennel run and you can also keep more than one of the breed and feel safe when you sleep.

In this day and age if your dog of these breeds gets out and does something as little as jump up on your neigbours child a scratch on the kids arm will turn into a full blown pitbull attack by the time the news gets hold of it.

Before you judge because you read some book written by a colledge student who has no experience whatsoevr with the breed take some time to speak to the people who do, you may just learn something.


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

I knew there was a reason why I loved you :goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

Very nice post!! 

Most of my dogs are chained. In my opinion, it is the safest and most responsible way to maintain multiple APBTS. I've had kennels in the past, and can honestly say if a dog wants out, it will get out... I had a female in a pen who was fine for weeks, then decided one day she was getting it...it took her all of 3 mins to grab the chain link and bend it out and get right out of the pen..

In a pen they are limited on space, on a 10-12 foot chain they have alot more room to move around and play.


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## DueceAddicTed (Sep 28, 2009)

:goodpost::goodpost: ( was told I gotta spread the love )


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## Wingman (Oct 21, 2009)

I agree that there is nothing wrong with chaining a dog. But instead of calling the writers of books and such idiots, why don't you post up pictures of proper chain sets up, and inproper set ups? This thread just looks like it's meant to start a fight...


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Good posting JY. I don't see why any state would ban chaining?


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

Places ban chaining for the same reason as banning the dogs. Its people doing it improperly that ruin the image and the right for everyone else. Here is CA you may not chain your dog for more than an hour... Not that it is ever enforced...

I personally crate. Crating IS NOT CRUEL MISSAPBT! LOL. Over crating is cruel and can ruin dogs same as improper Chaining.

Great thread on chaining.
http://www.gopitbull.com/goldmine/11144-chaining-dog-cruel.html

I have chained and am sure will again. My dogs are not bulldogs, but I have had some that Chaining had to be the option in the yard. I am lucky to just have a yard full of dogs that could careless than to jump the fence or leave my yard. However I keep nice chains in my shed in case I need to chain a dog.


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## junkyard (Oct 14, 2010)

I see where your coming from wingman and with good reason. Unfortunatly i am pretty bad with comps and such a thing would take me a year or so, yes i am that bad.

I am not looking at starting a fight i just say what i think and i think the authors of such books are idiots so i said it. Sorry if it came across that way i am a simple man with a simple brain.


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Your right Holly i should have been more specific, Over crating is cruel, and Overcrating is what i would be doing as i work full time. i crate grace at night.


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## Black Label Romo (Oct 15, 2009)

junkyard said:


> Due to the issues on Davids dander thread about it being cruel to keep your dogs on a chain i thought it would be a good idea to start a thread on it, i understand in some places it has become against the law and i think for some pretty stupid reasons.
> 
> I have never owned an amstaff, a adba or ukc show dog , nor have i owned a bully so i am only speaking out of my own experience which is with gamebred apbt or as anyone who is a true fancier knows, a bulldog.
> 
> ...


:goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

A buddy of mine .. He has some great set-ups

And here is a nice cable run set up .....


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

MISSAPBT said:


> Your right Holly i should have been more specific, Over crating is cruel, and Overcrating is what i would be doing as i work full time. i crate grace at night.


I shall forgive  LOL


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## Wingman (Oct 21, 2009)

Sadie said:


> And here is a nice cable run set up .....


We tried setting my sisters rott/pit mix up with a cable set up, but we've been thru several pulleys and several cables and he still keeps breaking them! 1/4in cable would start fraying, or the pulleys would lock up and break.


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Stage is on a cable set up but its just on the ground not raised


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## PerfectPit (Aug 2, 2010)

Ohio has a ban on chaining after 15 minutes. Kinda ridiculous if I say so myself. My old neighbor 2 doors down had a kennel for his APBT. I called him Denise the Menace. No matter what he did that dog would get out, he dug under two fences to come visit us. He scratched our bedroom screen out and came in to visit. I can't tell you how many times my husband walked him home and by the time he returned that dog was back at our house. If we closed the back door he would sit on the picnic table until we opened our door. The guy had triple locks, wood on top of kennel with cinder blocks on top of it. Old tires at the gate opening and he would still find a way to come to our house. He was a very pleasant dog other then when he destroyed our outside couch because we finally stopped letting him in the house, but no matter what the guy did the dog found his way to us. I think he was simply lonely at his house and wanted to be around people. The guy moved so I do not know what he did with his pup. A chain post would of kept him safely on his own property.


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## aimee235 (Apr 29, 2007)

I love that cable run setup Sadie. I prefer those over chaining in just one spot, but at least with tethering you are pretty certain your dog isn't going anywhere. I have no problems with it done right. As long as people do it responsibly.


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## Sadie (Jun 18, 2008)

Yes I agree Aimee chaining is more than humane and more often times necessary with bulldogs especially with multiple bulldogs so long as it's done properly there is nothing cruel about it. The biggest issue with chaining is ignorance and not knowing how to properly chain.


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## Alitlebit_ofJACK (Oct 6, 2010)

I think what the people who write about chaining a dog are not looking at people running large yards or even working their dogs. I think its more with people who use small chains and never interact with the dog once its chained out. I think when your talking about a 10 to 20 foot chain your talking about enough space to move around and probably bigger than alot of the yards out there with the way these new homes are built. But I would be surprized if youve never seen people with dogs chained on real short chains and never getting any attention. Not sure if its an lower income thing but where I grew up you saw it alot and not the dogs were not just wanting to play.
The set ups in the picture are not what most have in the backyards. But they did look great I cant imagine a yard like that


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

I've tried the cable run set up in the past, just didn't like it... like it was said..the pullies wore out fast, and the cable wasn't reliable enough for me..

Tried and true, the chain set up is what is the safe way for me!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Great pics and examples of tethered dogs Sadie! A great post by junkyard as well, :goodpost:

kenneled dogs are just as mean as chained dogs,


> a mean dog is a mean dog, most likley people made em thata way


Cable runs are nice but not as inexpensive as the good ol axel tie out system  I always worried about my dogs on cable runs during Thunderstorms, LOL, Im sure dog is good in China esspecially with all that muscle but I aint wanted to smell Cooked dog..

Crate training is great for people who have some sense. The dogs use them as their rooms basically, and are in a crate for no more than 8hrs in row with a 3hr break, dogs gotta run..

I set up a 40 by 30 dog pen for my crew to run in together, Dog whisperer style, and I use crate training as well. However the leaving the game dogs to run around freely together does not go with out the occasional miff, but nothing no bulldog enthusiast isn't ready to handle and prepared to give first aid. I only get rukus when the dogs are restless, so we run together, ALOT... gotta have em run together and work together to keep them red eyed dogs from gettin bored and rollin around for fun.. <<< FUN for them NOT for ME. THATS WHY

THE AXEL TIE OUT SYSTEM IS THE BEST AND SAFEST METHOD OF KEEPING A GAME BRED BULLDOG.. 
Excellent post, Junkyard.. Excellent, very nice point to bring to light.


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## Alitlebit_ofJACK (Oct 6, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> Im sure dog is good in China esspecially with all that muscle but I aint wanted to smell Cooked do
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## junkyard (Oct 14, 2010)

Thanks guys, and jack you have hit the nail on the head with your post, a massive generalisation has happened with all this "animal research" and it is realy unfortunate that it is realy only a certain type of person who it was aimed at but alot of us who indeed do it for the right reason and the safe way, are persecuted for it.

The dogs that do fit into that catagory are infact dogs that are generally malnourished, get little to no attention at all and are on a poor setup.

Anyone who has owned a apbt has heard horror stories about dogs setups being near fences and trees and the poor dogs hanging themselves while playing up or scaling the fence.
Every single part of the chain setup is important and and the little things such as a water bowl that can be knocked over can result in death, a aquaintance of mine lost their last apbt because she didnt have the water supply in the right area, in hot weather ants harrased the dog [first mistake location] and stressed the dog out in the hot weather the dog needed water from exaustion as he was moving around in the heat to escape them , where his water container was knocked over. Poor bugger died from heat stress and she came home that evening to a dead family pet. 
Remarkably she blamed the fact the dog was chained instead of using her noggin and seeing it was infact her fault for those two major errors in setup.
Lots can go wrong with a poorly set up spot, pretty much nothing can go wrong with a well setup spot.

A fellow member at GD has a cable setup to die for, and missapbt will vouch for that, the fella makes his own pulley system and says with minimal maintanance it has little issues, he has one cable with stoppers and the entire run is 200ft long, from memory i think he said each dog has a 150 to 200 square foot area for each dog and the whole setup is complimented with a gravity fed water area for each dog and each dog has a fully insulated kennel, and the kennels dont look cheap wouldnt suprise me if each dog had a flatscreen inside. It doesnt look like much but when you put it all together in the little parts the effort he has put into it is awesome. It would be a privledge to see the setup on day i can tell you that.


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Actually pully set up to die for, i want to have them in the future!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

You know if half these humaniacs seen how to keep alaskan huskies, they would think our game dog tie outs were like the hilton.. LOL howabout 3 ft per dog with once a day feeding of "scraps" LOL with no water pales and in subartic temps....


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

I'm new to this chaining business, so excuse my ignorance, which you can knock out of me if you find something you disagree with. 

I, personally, wouldn't chain my dog up without me being there to supervise it. I don't want my dog outside, exposed to whoever wants to do whatever to it; APBTs and pit bull type dogs have been known to be stolen around here -- last year, there were ~35 stolen for god only knows what.

For me, crating is beneficial because it keeps my dog inside out of the elements and harm's way and out of things within the house. I give him multiple toys of differing textures (kongs, stuffless stuffed toys, antlers, tug ropes), which I feel is almost as stimulating as being outside, albeit without the fresh air and room to run. But after you've sniffed the same blade of grass for the millionth time, it's still the same blade of grass. 

The longest he's ever been in the crate was 8 and a half hours -- too long, IMO, but I didn't have any other option and made sure he got plenty of exercise and attention before and after. He usually averages about 7 hours in the crate out of a 24 hour period.


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## junkyard (Oct 14, 2010)

In my opinion , if someone wants to steal your dog they will find a way to steal it.
I dont have a dog chained at the moment and thats simply because i only have one dog my house dog and the yard is as secure as can be in that regard.
But if i had more than one wheather the other breed was a apbt or a foxy they would be seperated if they were both apbt they would be chained.
A high drive apbt out of bordom can and will chew the metal through a crat unless you have the best crate known to man, and most dont. Call me a liar but its happened and it will happen again.
The dogmen of old have been using this method since the dawn of the breed and if it was working for them with minimal effort its good enough for me.
Who ever though a car axle could spell safety once it was off said car?

At the end of the day they are just dogs but i couldnt lock mine up in a cage just for the sake of its daily safetey i would be moving somewhere safer so it wasnt needed. 
And i would still be chaining my dogs.

A friends gamebred dog was running loose in its yard with no issues then one day he learnt he could scale an eight foot fence.
The owner of the dog got him back after thirty or so minutes but the damage was done. I think it was about three dead cats and a dead white fluffy that was walking loose on the street. He did the right thing and went around to all the people and explained it was his dog and how sorry he was. Obviously didnt help because he had to move house because of irate neigbours thinking their kids were not safe.

Not good for image and i would rather have my clueless neigbours thinking its not right to chain than thinking their kids or pets are at risk.

I am looking around at land in my general area and there are alot of places with old horse stable yards, fence em properly and it would convert into a perfect kennel run, but they will still be getting chained once in the run. 
Its better to be over safe than it is to have to rectify a mistake.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Well thats the best argument for the breed against media mindfkd people. IF the American Pit Bull Terrier is the most dangerous dog in the nation, why are adult American Pit Bull Terriers the most stolen dog in the nation?....

If someone is gonna steal your dog, they are gonna steal your dog..... well put.


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> You know if half these humaniacs seen how to keep alaskan huskies, they would think our game dog tie outs were like the hilton.. LOL howabout 3 ft per dog with once a day feeding of "scraps" LOL with no water pales and in subartic temps....


Not to mention go ahead and try to walk up to a sled dog on their chain without being their owner... you will come back less one arm if not more


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

k8nkane said:


> I'm new to this chaining business, so excuse my ignorance, which you can knock out of me if you find something you disagree with.
> 
> I, personally, wouldn't chain my dog up without me being there to supervise it. I don't want my dog outside, exposed to whoever wants to do whatever to it; APBTs and pit bull type dogs have been known to be stolen around here -- last year, there were ~35 stolen for god only knows what.
> 
> ...


I crate my dogs too for sometimes up to 12 or 14 hours... The key with crating is that you make sure they are worked real good to get out all of the extra energy... When I am not working from home the dogs are crated... When I am home the dogs go out one at a time and I watch them outside.

I would chain as I feel that chaining is better for them mentally than crating... However I live next to two people that have dogs that bark all day long and I live in a rental that I have put a lot of money into the landscaping. I do not have a place that I could chain them were they couldnt get to a fenceline either which would have me worrying all day that they were hanging themselves.

Containment is containment any way you look at it... As long as you have a well rounded exercised and socialized dog any containment you provide by your own choice will be fine.


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## SARGEnNIKITA (Jan 3, 2010)

junkyard said:


> Its better to be over safe than it is to have to rectify a mistake.


This is the best statement in this entire thread

:goodpost::goodpost:


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## apbtmom76 (Nov 4, 2008)

ok so here is my opinion, lol, and only my opinion, I completely agree with JY in this whole thread, I think what he says is very true. 

Now in my adult life I have never chained any of my APBT's. I had a Chow mix that I chained as he was never house broken, but he rode inthe car well, anywayz, as a kid, my father was all about the dog being outside, yadda, yadda, yadda, and I was ok with that, not when it was cold out as I was the one who fed the dogs, lol. Anyway, ther eis a law here in Austint hat you cannot tether period inside the city limits, the only time yor dog is to be tethered is IF YOU ARE outside with the dog.
That being said, teh only time any of mine have ever been tethered is when we go to the lake. Cause they cannot run loose. I do not have a problem with it, i could not leave my dogs outside to the elements, IDK it just bothers me, and yes I know they have dog houses, lol. One day when I get some land I do wanna gt a nice chain set up as i want more dogs. And I will go with the axle set up, I like it best. SO right now I do have pet bulls, but my boys do things, and I plan on more things next year, including Phoebe 

ok, I'm done, great thread.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

junkyard said:


> *In my opinion , if someone wants to steal your dog they will find a way to steal it.*
> I dont have a dog chained at the moment and thats simply because i only have one dog my house dog and the yard is as secure as can be in that regard.
> But if i had more than one wheather the other breed was a apbt or a foxy they would be seperated if they were both apbt they would be chained.
> *A high drive apbt out of bordom can and will chew the metal through a crat unless you have the best crate known to man, and most dont.* Call me a liar but its happened and it will happen again.
> ...


The parts I bolded are all very good points, let me address them:

1. That is very true. The person is going to do it whether the dog is inside or outside the house. However, I believe it's harder to steal my dog when he's locked inside a house than just outside on a chain. My dog will walk off with anyone that has a toy or food and, as I live on a busy street without a fenced-in yard, I feel much more comfortable having him inside the house unable to wander around, possibly getting hit by a car, if he were to somehow get off his chain. With me at work (the only time he's ever in his crate), I wouldn't be there to run around the neighborhood searching for him. I probably wouldn't even know he'd gotten out until it was too late.

2. That is why I put multiple toys in his crate and make it a place he WANTS to go. He only gets certain, high value treats while he's in there, he only gets certain toys while he's in there, and his favorite dog bed is also in there. I have no indications of Kane trying to chew out of his crate; I inspect the crate daily for any signs of damage. If he does start to chew out of it, I will work on fixing that and finding a solution.

3. See above. That's why it's important to make the crate a place the dog WANTS to go. If you just shove a dog in there, with no training, heck yeah it's going to be torture for a dog. But if you take the time to show the dog the crate can be a good thing, I honestly don't see the harm in it. Kane loves to go into his crate to sleep or just gnaw on his toys during the day, without any prompting from me.

4. This last part is the best part of the thread, I agree. That is why I crate Kane. 

All in all, I can definitely see the benefits of both chaining and crating in certain situations. If the shoe fits, they say.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

I've had my porch dog fed a victor in a cheese burger and my front door kicked in while the dogs were all crated, they just took the litter, well all but 3 I had with me that day at the vet office.  Good times.. Where there's a will there's a way. Better a dog disappear off a chain than that happen, makes ya feel real secure while your away 

Thats why I have dogs that run loose, PLURAL, out in the sticks... cost someone half a script, LOL


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## fishinrob (Apr 14, 2010)

No matter how you keep your dogs, it's the amount of attention they get that makes them anti social or not. I ran a petstore in the late eighties early ninetees and we had a customer who's business was renting guard dogs to protect lots overnight. He'd pull up in a big stake truck with crated dogs that we were not allowed to speak to. He used pups from the pound ,mostly shephard style dogs and raised them in solitude. Only him and his wife would provide food, pick up and drop off these dogs. They were all mean as hell. I asked him about Pitbulls, since I had my second one at the time and he said they sucked at this sort of training because they don't show a threat display. No growling or barking and that that was what was needed.

I've had two dogs stolen from me, both while on chains. My new neighborhood I have no worries.


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## k8nkane (Jul 9, 2010)

fishinrob said:


> No matter how you keep your dogs, it's the amount of attention they get that makes them anti social or not. I ran a petstore in the late eighties early ninetees and we had a customer who's business was renting guard dogs to protect lots overnight. He'd pull up in a big stake truck with crated dogs that we were not allowed to speak to. He used pups from the pound ,mostly shephard style dogs and raised them in solitude. Only him and his wife would provide food, pick up and drop off these dogs. They were all mean as hell. *I asked him about Pitbulls, since I had my second one at the time and he said they sucked at this sort of training because they don't show a threat display. No growling or barking and that that was what was needed.*
> 
> I've had two dogs stolen from me, both while on chains. My new neighborhood I have no worries.


That's really interesting!! I wonder why that is.


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## HappyPuppy (Oct 11, 2007)

Cuz it was bred out of them - pit bulls generally do not make good guard dogs. In the pit, they didn't need all of the threats and warning displays - they went straight to business.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

which is why you don't want a man bitting fighting dog.. that HA just makes novice ppl more fearful let alone adding weary to your/educated handlers self about the other ppls saftey cause they are flippin out.. Didn't ya read how he grew up playing with neighborhood dogs and all, he might as well have said I kick it down in Ecua with Mr.A.. LOL cause you know his azz would let dogs get into it to see how fast they could break it up, LOL its not the states pick a country below the rio =D I agree with padlock, I think he halfazz enticed the damm thing so he could SAVE the day.. which is what I would let happen in training ppl in that situation but he should have gave them APBT handling 101 or how to grab your dog for dummies step 1, before letting that happen, cause them others were like: " yeah, you go on get that, handle your sht DW"


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## Padlock (Nov 19, 2010)

all these laws get passed by bitter people who can't mind their own business.
this law doesn't do anything for anyone. irresponsible owners that tie out their
dog/s like dispensable personal property don't give a rats azz about laws either way.
this is another case of one bad apple spoils the whole bunch....


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

To say chaining a dog is cruel, IMO is crazy, but hey thats me.

We have used cable runs for the past 5 years with no problem. IF you are having trouble with the cable or the pullies, its probably what you are buyin. No dog will wear out a 1/4 braided wire cable if it has a good pully on it, not the $30 pully from lowes or TSC but a good pully that has grease fittings and all.

All our dogs are still on cable runs and will continue that way. Much better than a 10x10 kennel or crate.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

I think the problem with chainng a dog come only when you chain them and forget them. Chaining a dog that is worked daily and has human contact is not going to make the dog a mad dog or a mean dog that happens to the dog that is tied out back and only sees someone once a day that throws some ood at them and gives them some water( hopefully).

I have cable tie outs I have crates and I have an acre that is fenced in for the dogs.


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