# New Pedigree for Analysis!



## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Ok, so I haven't been planning on getting any new pups lately.. Some good friends of mine, and some good Dogmen, have been doing some planning, and in the future we're plannin on taking my male "Yeller" and putting with one of females.. I was going to take a pup out of that then.. but I've kind of decided I really like a litter he has on the ground now.. And so I'm taking a female out it instead of one out of male later.. She's too young to get just yet, but I went to "pick her out" last night (turned out there was only two females and he was keeping one). I'm stoked over the whole ordeal! Very excited! 

Here is her ped.. I've already broken down.. But I like to read the same ped being broken down by different people because I seem to get a better grasp of the whole thing as different people will word things differently.

ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [467871] :: DUE IN AUG


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

The sire of that ped there.. is 

3/4 wildside breeding (krazyside per wildside productions) > Jeep Nigerino (primarily)

1/4 is tants yellow primarily with a lil tiny shot of jeep and 1/4 boudreaux

1/4 Mason hog essentially is what Chaos' bob is... Mason hog being Heinzl/Colby/Lightner essentially... 

1/4 Mason Hog Eagleton X up with some AST, OFRN, Tants/Davis ... a scatter shot Used for outcross no doubt. .. 

The Dam: 
almost 5/8 Tant smidge of Maday .. heavy on the yellow; 

near 2/5 wildside ... 

1/8 patricks........... 

outcrosses used: wildside nigerino jeep, jeep, jeep a sorrells, bullshit,redboy,carver, fox, alligator......


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

Hole lot going on a guy owning a bitch very simular to the gyp wanted to breed to Mety.
APASA I beleive you knew him on point in time a guy was going to give you a pup off his breeding. You posted here some months ago. So what was you break down and thoughts on them?

FH How you do that so fast is awesome. I would know if hadnt seen simular peds recentley!


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

sorry refresher,, mety the dog in your avatar?


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## BuckskinBeauty (Aug 14, 2013)

Want to do that with my peds Firehazard? lol Just posted them.


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

Yeah Thats Meaty up their in the photo.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

I agree mostly with Firehazard, 

Starting with Eli, the father of the litter.. 
The top half of his Sire is a dog named Buckshot who breaks into a lot of jeep, but also a good bit of honeybunch (not through Jeep), with a blend of Carver up from the Eli dog, essentially Boudreaux, on his top most half then there is all of this plus Nigerino added in again on the bottom side of Buckshot's top half. 

The Bottom side to Buckshot is Casino Girl, who is heavy Tant's using the Yellow dogs with a leg of Maverick/Boudreaux on top and on bottom she brings in jeep/honeybunch/Carver(Boudreaux) in the exact same way, as her dam is a full sybling to the dog on the top side of Buckshot's top half.

This goes into a bitch who on her topside has the Mason's Hog stuff mixed with the Carver by way of Stompanato like the dogs on the top half of Buckshot and the bottom side of Casino girl. Also similiarly included are some of the same dogs going back to Eli. And on her bottom is stuff I don't know much about with the Hog dog here and there. 

Making.. Eli and the top half of the litter's ped.

The Dam, Jada, is outta Lucas who's top most half brings back in Tant's yellow dogs with a leg of White's Tab adding a lil jeep and redboy, put to a Texas Express bitch who is heavy Tant's yellow stuff with a good mix of Jocko. You find a lot of the same stuff on the topside of Lucas' bottom half but with a little more Redboy and Jocko with the Tant's and a leg of Mayday. And below that is more Tants an outcross into some stuff I don't much about, with a hint of Maverick.

Lucas' Bottom half is Casino Girl's full brother outcrossed to some stuff that gets back into Jeep, and a dog name Marlowe's Peaches pretty frequently, and that was put back to Casino Girl which doubles up on the same kind of dogs in Eli's top half.

Jada's dam, Reba's tophalf is similar to Buckshot's tophalf with Cowboy again bringing a lot of Jeep, Honeybunch, and the same Carver stuff heading back to Eli, and the Renegade dog adding more of the same plus his bottom quarter of Nigerino.
The bottomside of Reba is an outcross of Tombstone, Indian Bolio mixed with Chinaman and a small leg of wildside's brought in the same way as the tophalf. 

..and that makes the bottom side of the pups.. Overall a large mix of Tants, Jeep, Honeybuch, Carver, and a chunk of Nigerino with a whole lot of bits and peices from plenty other like the Mason Hog, Redboy, Jocko, Maverick, Chinaman, Tombstone, and Bolio.. I have to write it all out like this and then go back and read it for me to be able to line it all it out in my head.. Pretty much I go dog by dog down the ped and make note of what he/she brings, and then in the end look at how it all plays together.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Rudy4747 said:


> Hole lot going on a guy owning a bitch very simular to the gyp wanted to breed to Mety.
> APASA I beleive you knew him on point in time a guy was going to give you a pup off his breeding. You posted here some months ago. So what was you break down and thoughts on them?
> 
> FH How you do that so fast is awesome. I would know if hadnt seen simular peds recentley!


Yes, I think I know who your talking about. A good friend of mine ended up with, I think, the only surviving one of the pups, unless the guy ended up keeping one. I lost contact with the guy who bred them, who I was initially going to get one from, but when my friend, Bill, got the three out to his house I was supposed to pick up one of them through him, but only one lived, and he kept her.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Sometimes its better to address the breeder I.E. Wildside.. Any dog man knows what they had crossed up. Breaking it all down like that makes it sound more scattered ;-)

3/4 jeep/nigerino/ Boudreaux. Sounds much cleaner. You cand wind that up for s while and never leave your yard


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Yes, that's going to be my plan. She's coming in, and then we're hoping (all cute puppies with todiefor peds staying AWAY) to just sit back (well not really, it will be balls to the wall helluva great time all the time) and watch em grow and mature into what their going to be and from their decide, within what've got (maybe a similar dog or two of a good friend included) want we want different in the next gen, while keeping the things we like about them. I figure we'll do best if we try em hard, push em to their limit, and see what kinda dogs they are, before we try to say what they need or shouldn't have. 

Because.. as I like to say.. You will never know it if they don't ever show it.. and they can't show it sitting on a chain.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Firehazard said:


> Sometimes its better to address the breeder I.E. Wildside.. Any dog man knows what they had crossed up. Breaking it all down like that makes it sound more scattered ;-)
> 
> 3/4 jeep/nigerino/ Boudreaux. Sounds much cleaner. You cand wind that up for s while and never leave your yard


Well I'll be honest, I'm not a dog man, atleast not if you view the term as something to describe those great men who made are breed and those who have found themselves equal to them...

I just like bulldogs. I like who they are.

And to get the point.. I have yet to learn what breeder many of the important iconic dogs have come from unless it's the first of their name..  So.. that's my pedigree analysis .. and it's written in crayon  Because by the time I've gone down nearly every leg of that 4 generation ped and beyond the 8th generation on many.. atleast twice.. and written down what I concluded.. I've learned something. I've got a better handle on a whole of APBT history in terms of who came from what outta who put to back to their uncle. Plus.. maybe someone else would like the detailed to version to better help them understand the summary!

I'm learning.. Got a ways to go, and a lot to forget.. but I'm making progress daily, and that's better than back tracking or none at all.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

APASA said:


> Well I'll be honest, I'm not a dog man, atleast not if you view the term as something to describe those great men who made are breed and those who have found themselves equal to them...
> 
> I just like bulldogs. I like who they are.
> 
> ...


were all green to anothers stand point.. No worries, hope you don't think I was doggin ya. More helpin you organize it. When you have so much wildside bred stuff and your country boy bulldog pot luck stuff. Some of the names stick out  I labeled in crayon for ya, you threw out the index 

You'll get several generations of good bulldogs before you lock down on your consistency of what you have worked and picked out. Its the FUN part!! at least to me anyway.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

No FH, I didn't think that at all.. I just didn't want to come off as something I wasn't... And thank you. I've been wondering kind of about how to describe the pup's breeding if I were asked just out of the blue somewhere. I couldn't figure out which ones I should say and why I should say that one, yet leave out another that appears just as much lol.. and then i end up with a mouthful! Although is it ok to leave out the Tant's? It seemed like a large portion of it.. ugh, see... here I go again..


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Firehazard said:


> The sire of that ped there.. is
> 
> 3/4 wildside breeding (krazyside per wildside productions) > Jeep Nigerino (primarily)
> 
> ...


Thats seperating the parents.. use a calculator and do the math on the ones that match... I can break it down MORE with time, this was a quick sum it up.. .. 
.. Mostly its a Wildside Tant X with some extra outs of good source and diversity.. Just Me.. I'd call it a wildside tants X with a smidge of mason hog and a bit of patricks... and leave out the outcrosses unless talkin real bulldogs and genetics with someone. Or just lay it out like that ^^ above.

I like how you know your own stock well enough to follow this back to that and back to that and find where similar bred or same dogs were used here and there.. :clap: got a good eye


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## welder (Jan 25, 2013)

Dammit fire,couldnt you jus say at's a dam good bulldog????

Hehehehe....jus fn with ya bro......


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Thank you Fire Hazard. This a detailed, yet concise version of the ped. Very Nice. And I have to say I do put more importance in learning my own dogs peds vs just lines in general.. But then again by learning my dogs' peds, I can recognize things in other places and know where it came from because I learned it for my own hound. 

I have a habit of using the physical dog more so than the ped though it seems. I love watching my hounds hunt/work/think ect.. and when I see one lack in an area I would like it to be more efficient at I look more towards a dog who has those characteristics to give over a dog with a nicer matching pedigree. 

Sure the dog may be hell fire in a box.. but It's not like I'm going to put him there.. If it doesn't have sense enough to be something I can make work for me because it's straining at the collar 24/7 for breathing animal insight, I'd rather pass it up for the dog who is more reserved, hold his own ground? You bet, but not nucking futs about getting the chance to show it. A sensitive dog is easier to handle/train vs a an over down animal with a one track mind. I don't want to have to physically turn my dog around to break his gaze at something interesting.. I want him to be sensitive enough that a sharp correction or two will learn him quick his focus is best kept on me. 

And Welder.. Thank you .. I'll take that as a compliment


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## welder (Jan 25, 2013)

It was my friend!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## surfer (Feb 20, 2013)

i dont believe i've ever heard of an apbt the way you describe,
or at least a true 'balls to the wall' apbt.

i've heard of some that could sometimes walk around their own yard,
because they feel no threat or any need to dominate.

but as soon as any apbt worth his salt, gets around another dog, they 
try to establish the 'pecking order'

i ALWAYS want my dog to think he's TOP DOG.

these should be working dogs, not fifi's that you parade around a dog park,

if thats what you wanted, there are other breeds out there for that.


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

Some might not agree. But it is my opinon. That you should not be able to give a bulldog a sharp corection when he is drawin into another dog. Even dogs that I have seen that don't seem to be bothered by other dogs have to be brought away physically onec they decided they wanted after the prey. 

My buddy has a sog that is not bothered by dogs he seems to know serious dogs from bs so he is generally a calm dog. So easy to handle. Bit when he fimd something that hets under his skin man gotta drag hom off. 

Like you I like a calm trainable dog but I want em to know when to be serious too. The dig I saw off os that blood in person was a tiny dog but a wild little thing. Good luck.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Hey welder, I'll try that next time... LOL I love ped and matchin traits with dogs... Kinda ocd bout it sometimes.. :rofl:


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## OldDog (Mar 4, 2010)

Daaayyyuuuummmm. 

Don't quite know how to get into this one , so look APasa , this is not said to bust your chops , there is no insult intended. 


YOU are the one supposed to be in control of the dog , not the reverse , and you'd best get used to the fact that given that pedigree you stand a chance of getting a dog that will end up with that one track mind you spoke of , especially if *you* allow too much stimulus to develop in a given situation. 


And just because a dog is a lunatic about other dogs ( and God knows I've had and shown enough of 'em , if you doubt that then ask around folks who conformation showed west of the Big Muddy during the '80s and '90s) doesn't mean that YOU shouldn't be in control. 

You need to be careful what you wish for , and then be prepared for getting what you wished for and the eventuality of it not being what you actually *needed* or indeed in reality *wanted*. 

And yeah , ( since I've already outed myself way too much in this forum) I'm the one that at certain Socal and other shows folks would say " there's X and the crew of Screamin' Meemies"....... 

And you'd best learn to be REALLY aware as regards the quiet one who just stands there and VIBRATES while never taking his/her eyes off the other dog or dogs , the one that's smart enough to back up two steps on you 'cause he's knows he's gonna get a bit of slack in that line. 

Again , be careful what you wish for , you might get it.


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## Firehazard (Dec 4, 2009)

Be careful for what you wish for.. LOL aint that the truth.. 

There are a LOT of people who have touched or studied game dogs will eventually get one... once they have one, they fall in love head over hills.. OR... :stick: they think what did I get myself into! 

:rofl:

You better put your seat belt on... I'll tell ya that much~


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Ok, I just re read what I posted after a good nights sleep and yes.. It sounds a bit contradicting.. or atleast.. it doesn't really describe what I meant. 

I kinda of had a particular situation in mind.. And I guess was more meaning when picking between grown dogs vs raising a pup. 

We have bulldogs that work together and some that will not.. I understand that.. But for us the ones that will work other dogs (most... they all have atleast one or two mortal enemies with in the yard lol) can be used more often.. 

In many of the time we have the dogs (ones that will work together) out hog hunting or critter getting it is in our pastures.. which have cows.. We have to be able to keep them off cows. Most of our dogs have been with us since they were pups, and have learned that cows are off limits.. still every now again, a calf will dart off that had been laying down asleep, and a dog will make a move like he wants to go after it, even ones that know better.. We can call em off. 

I know there is a difference in dogs on dogs and dogs on cows.. But cows are what I had in mind when posting that. I was also thinking in terms of grown dogs.. when I wrote it ("I'd rather pass it up for a dog that is more reserved.") As if i guess getting to try out two grown dogs or something.. idk.. But anyhow... If he doesn't acknowledge a correction and will not redirect his focus back on me.. He will not be a dog we could trust on hunts like that.. 

For example.. Bug, when on a leash walking through say Atwoods.. Someone else has a dog in there and they see each other from across the store.. "Bug, No." She will relax slightly. Enough that while she is still keeping an eye on it (esp if it's staring at her) She will continue walking calmly and behaving.. 

Same senario.. See's the dog.. "Bug, Get that Mother F...er" She's gna all out try to fly into it.. 

Could we call her off and back to being completely calm.. Probably not to the same degree lol Most likely have to carry her out.. That's fine.. It's the fact that she can be told when to get started.. 

Same senario again.. See's the dog.. and we don't say anything.. Depending on the reaction of that dog (whether is stares her down or ignores her) If it challenges her 
she is most likely going to try to get him. Or atleast whine and dance in place ears perked, tail wagging, looking at us and then staring intently at the dog asking if she can "get that Mother F...er" If the dog ignores her. She will probably go about her buisness.. But depending on her mood.. she might still ask lol.. 

In our yard... off leash.. if she sees Bill, our AMbulldog (the dog she absolutely wants to kill) most likely she is going after him and you can't call her off. If you take off her chain and tell her no right then and make her stay right with you she will restrain herself.. but you better keep an eye on her.. 


Rudy.. I didn't mean when directed at another dog with it already on his mind.. This is my bad for not thinking about the many contexts it could be applied to.. 

And I know what you mean about getting under the skin  That's Bill to Bug lol

Surfer.. I want them for working dogs.. I said that.. never mentioned dog parks.

It's nice when they will work with other dogs.. Some won't .. that's ok.. they just have to work by themselves.. I understand that.. but they still need to have enough sense to learn that are just some things (not dogs) they cannot go after.. 

Old Dog.. I realize that. The dog being in control is not the issue here... Kinda like if two bulldogs must be parted with a break stick bc you can't call him off.. Doesn't mean your a bad trainer and the dogs in control.. it's a whole different situation.. Like Rudy said... 
You should not be able to give a bulldog a sharp correction when he is drawn into another dog.. 

And that isn't exactly what I meant by reserved.. I realize that was my fault on wrong choice of words..


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Add.. I do have a bulldog or two that be can't trusted around cows.. One we got as a 2 yr old and the other we get around em enough.. He can hunt in the pastures as long we stay away from the cows as he will leave em be at a distance.. But up close I believe it'd be too much.. Never chanced it..


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## surfer (Feb 20, 2013)

see brah, after a good nights sleep, sometimes you can have a different perspective on things.

and as far as me mentioming dog parks, do pay no attention to me, i was probly 
thinking i was in another thread, and no you dont have to point and laff...............

there was another thread going recently, and everyone was defending their stance,
but didnt realize all saying the same thing, i think that was about the dog parks,

i've wondered when you have to use more than one dog to catch something, 
boar or cow, those dogs are they full-blooded apbt's?

we have some fellas down here that hunt racoons, but they mix the blood,
usually they'll get a good female and take her to a good hound, then cross it to the full-blooded hound one more time and then use those dogs to hunt with.

if they are full-blooded how do you keep them from goin on each other?


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## Rudy4747 (Nov 29, 2009)

Surfer I understood hat you were saying bud I got a couple dogs I show my gyp amd a dog belonging to a good freind that both act exactly as you just described.


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## OldDog (Mar 4, 2010)

APASA said:


> Add.. I do have a bulldog or two that be can't trusted around cows.. One we got as a 2 yr old and the other we get around em enough.. He can hunt in the pastures as long we stay away from the cows as he will leave em be at a distance.. But up close I believe it'd be too much.. Never chanced it..


 Hey now , that's just the BIGGEST dog he's ever seem.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Haha Old Dog.. Yea, a whole "pack" of em.. and them momma's aint backing down!

And surfer.. No, we just have to choose carefully who we run together.. Only one male at a time.. and then usually two girls who will do ok as long as they are busy or not tethered next to each other and or a young pup not yet turned on... Alot of people who use apbts for catchdogs I believe start em pigs before they are hot and I've heard that helps. idk.. Southern Inferno might be better help answering that.. for how the majority manage that problem.


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)

Got my lil girl! I know you guys have already seen the ped for the litter.. But this one is hers!!

ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [77411] :: GBAR DAYS OF GRIMM


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## APASA (Dec 27, 2010)




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