# The Bandogge ( pic heavy )



## NinaThePitbull

*The Bandogge*

*The Bandogge, or Bandog if you prefer, is not a purebred dog in the way we know the word purebred.
The words Bandogge and Bandog is being used on dogs of mixed Molosser ancestry, most often with Pit Bull as one of parent components.










The name Bandog, or Bandogge, comes from the old Saxon word "banda"; the Saxon word for chain. It was used on watchdogs chained at day and released at night, to carry out its watching and guarding duties. It is quite obvious that the name was used on any chained watchdog, Mastiffs, Bulldogs and dogs of mixed ancestry, but it is also certain that these chained dogs must have been of a recognisable watchdog type, which eliminates all dogs which was not of more or less Molosser blood.










This means that any Molosser cross of today could rightfully be called a Bandog, even if the most common crosses today which is called Bandog is the Mastino Napoletano/Pit Bull and the Bullmastiff/Pit Bull. *










One of the fairly common methods of producing Bandogs is by crossing Pit Bull males with Bullmastiff bitches. This cross was earlier much more used in Europe than the Neo/Pit cross. Some refers to this cross as Bandogs, while others, especially in USA, call them Pitbullmastiffs. Considering that the Bullmastiff is a British breed, and that the Pit Bull is derivatived from the British "Bull and Terriers", this cross should be more like the original Bandogge of Britain than the Neo/Pit cross.










Another method to bred Bandogs is to cross the Pit Bull with English Mastiffs, but many breeders is of the opinion that the Mastiff is a too much laidback bred and they prefer using the Neo in the cross instead of the Mastiff, so the cross will be thougher and inhabit more gameness.










*History of the Bandog*

DNA sequencing has confirmed that all dogs (Canis lupus familiaris) originated from the wolf (Canis lupus); however, the exact development of the original Bandogs still remains a mystery. Although, it is impossible to say exactly how the Bandog originated, it is certain the original Bandogs were bred with a functional purpose, as were all working breeds, and for the Bandog this purpose revolved around guarding and protecting.[citation needed]

Early incarnations of the Bandog probably had bloodlines from bull baiting dogs and the Guardian Mastiffs or the cross of both like the war dogs used in the Crusades.










William Harrison, in his description of England during 1586, first mentions the type in his statement, "Bandogge which is a huge dog, stubborn, uglier, eager, burthenouse of bodie, terrible and fearful to behold and often more fierce and fell than any Archadian or Corsican cur." It is assumed that the word "Bandogge" originated from the use of strong bonds and chains to secure the dogs.[1]

In 1576, Dr. Caius states that, among others characteristics, the "Mastiff or Bandogge is serviceable against the fox and the badger, to drive wild and tame swine out of meadows, and pastures, to bite and take the bull by the ears, when occasion so required." [2]




























The Bandogs of old were strictly working dogs, often of various crosses and various sizes. Usually these dogs were coarse-haired hunters, fighters and property protectors without a strictly set type, developed from eastern shepherds and mastiffs crossed with western Bullenbeissers and hounds, with a few local bloodlines eventually being established as specific types in some regions, such as Britain, Spain, Germany, Poland and elsewhere in Europe. One of the most famous Bandog programs in England led to the establishment of a recognized breed, the Bullmastiff.










*Foundation breeding
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What is reported here is just an estimated expected average range of various foundations breeds commonly seen in various Bandog programs.

*The Primary Group* , approximate average of 25-75% from American Pit Bull Terrier and/or Bull Terrier.

*The Secondary Group* ,approximate average of 25-75% from English Mastiff and/or Neapolitan Mastiff.

*A Tertiary Group* (used in some programs) approximate average of 0-75%: American Bulldog, Boerboel, Bullmastiff, Bulldog Campeiro, Cane Corso, Dogue de Bordeaux, Fila Brasileiro, Great Dane, Perro de Presa Canario,Dogo Argentino, and/or the Tosa Inu.










more photos:
American Bandogge Mastiff Pictures and Photos


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## OldSchoolAPBT

Nice dogs i like the 3rd one


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## beccaboo

no wonder people have such a hard time figurin out what a pitbull is  its so crazy that there are so many different breeds that look so much like the apbt and the only difference really is size and muscle compilation. mix one with another and keep that mix and u have a whole new breed. this was a good read as i'm not a huge reader on the in depth history of where the lines and all that came from. i tend to have the opinion my dogs aren't papered so alot of the info doesn't really pertain to me. as long as i have the basic knowledge to back the breed when asked questions i think thats good enough. for me anyway. the history is kinda cool tho. would love to know what went into that black n white beast with the cropped ears cuz i want one like him some day


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## NinaThePitbull

OldSchoolAPBT said:


> Nice dogs i like the 3rd one


yeah he's a beauty, thats my fave too.


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## dixieland

Those are some beautiful dogs!That was a good read too.


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## redog

I love mine, he is AMAZING! very interesting subject thanks for posting


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## NinaThePitbull

dixieland said:


> Those are some beautiful dogs!That was a good read too.


i have to be honest, i really though of you throughout the process, you seem like a bandogge person. that sounds weird doesnt it? im guessing you like the gorgeous beast in the bottom.


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## Mcleod15

I like the swinfords my self


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## NinaThePitbull

Mcleod15 said:


> I like the swinfords my self


your knowledge of this breed of dog impresses me. Here are some Swinfords, might do a part 2 to this and include info on the man. Thanks!!!























































*a great blog on the Bandogge*
Bandog Mastiffs


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## Mcleod15

NinaThePitbull said:


> your knowledge of this breed of dog impresses me. Here are some Swinfords, *might do a part 2 to this and include info on the man*. Thanks!!!


A post about John Bayard Swinford would make for a interesting read for everyone.


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## GTR

Yeah, I want more information on these dogs, mos def.  Maybe a good schutzhund breed prospect? Are they hardy? I bet they inherit a lot of those health problems though...


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## Mcleod15

GTR said:


> Yeah, I want more information on these dogs, mos def.  Maybe a good schutzhund breed prospect? Are they hardy? I bet they inherit a lot of those health problems though...


Schutzhund I don't think they would make a good canidate for that, but for PP work, home guarding, or sentry work they really excell(from what I've learned)

You can go to game-dog.com do an advanced search for user name Lee Robinson and you will learn just about anything you want to know about the Swinford K-9 and his breeding program. Just click the stastics link on his profile, then find all posts link and read away.

Here is a link that talks about one of his breedings a purebreed APBT to a 50%APBT/50% EM, he posted 3 pictures of two of the dogs produced.
Chimera's chief - Pit Bull Forums


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## CINCINNATIBULLIES

so bully's are bandogges bred for looks?


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## dixieland

NinaThePitbull said:


> i have to be honest, i really though of you throughout the process, you seem like a bandogge person. that sounds weird doesnt it? im guessing you like the gorgeous beast in the bottom.


Hehe,yeah that does sound kinda weird!lol. No doubt that dog at the bottom is gorgeous!I like them all.


NinaThePitbull said:


> your knowledge of this breed of dog impresses me. Here are some Swinfords, might do a part 2 to this and include info on the man. Thanks!!!
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> *a great blog on the Bandogge*
> Bandog Mastiffs


I really like those.The second one kinda reminds me of a larger male version of Suey.
I love all big type dogs of this nature.


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## Mcleod15

CINCINNATIBULLIES said:


> so bully's are bandogges bred for looks?


Are bullys APBT/Mastiff Crosses?
Or
Are bullys APBT/AmStaff Crosses?


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## gamer

CINCINNATIBULLIES said:


> so bully's are bandogges bred for looks?


Pretty much what I think anyway. Bandogges are suppose to have a ton of drive and be good working dogs. I think they are really pretty dogs!


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## OldSchoolAPBT

Mcleod15 said:


> Are bullys APBT/Mastiff Crosses?
> Or
> Are bullys APBT/AmStaff Crosses?


a little of both

Some bred APBT with amstaff some did mastiff

me personally i dislike bullies, its cool if people own them in all but i wouldnt
own one i like my dogs lean muscular and agile


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## Mcleod15

Bandogges and AmBullies are not the same thing. Bullies are not bandogges bred for show.


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## Mcleod15

OldSchoolAPBT said:


> a little of both
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> *Some bred APBT with amstaff some did mastiff *
> 
> me personally i dislike bullies, its cool if people own them in all but i wouldnt
> own one i like my dogs lean muscular and agile


You know this for a fact, that mastiffs were used


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## gamer

Mcleod15 said:


> Bandogges and AmBullies are not the same thing. Bullies are not bandogges bred for show.


Can you explain the difference? Both are pit mixes arnt they?


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## Black Rabbit

Mcleod15 said:


> Bandogges and AmBullies are not the same thing. Bullies are not bandogges bred for show.


:clap::clap: Totally agreed didn't we have this same discussion a while back. No they are not the same. I have seen some XXL bullies that looked like Mastiffs but that doesn't make them Bandogges. They are both their own breed now and are totally seperate.


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## Sampsons Dad

GTR said:


> Yeah, I want more information on these dogs, mos def.  Maybe a good schutzhund breed prospect? Are they hardy? I bet they inherit a lot of those health problems though...


have had good results and bad with my neo crosses.

Good- stable healthy dogs
imposing look and presence
stable temperments

Bad---a couple dogs had no drive
some pups are slow to mature
require extra obedience training


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## Mcleod15

gamer said:


> Can you explain the difference? Both are pit mixes arnt they?


True both are pit mixes but in the big picture is every breed a mix of some kind, and both breeds are bred differently, to fit two different standards.

American Bullies - were started in the 90's maybe a little earlier by breeding UKC APBT to AKC AmStaffs not mastiffs

Swinford Breeding program was established in the 60's by breeding game APBTs to English mastiffs or Neo Mastiffs, way before the term American Bully was even thought of

American Bandogge is regonized hybrid that mix is composed of the Am Bulldog and the Mastiff

Bandog in its self has been around for a long time, which simple means a mastiff type dog used as watch dog

The key ingredient is the mastiff blood.


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## Black Rabbit

Mcleod15 said:


> True both are pit mixes but in the big picture is every breed a mix of some kind, and both breeds are bred differently, to fit two different standards.
> 
> American Bullies - were started in the 90's maybe a little earlier by breeding UKC APBT to AKC AmStaffs not mastiffs
> 
> Swinford Breeding program was established in the 60's by breeding game APBTs to English mastiffs or Neo Mastiffs, way before the term American Bully was even thought of
> 
> American Bandogge is regonized hybrid that mix is composed of the Am Bulldog and the Mastiff
> 
> Bandog in its self has been around for a long time, which simple means a mastiff type dog used as watch dog
> 
> The key ingredient is the mastiff blood.


:clap::clap::clap: Well said


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## Black Rabbit

Dang it says I gotta spread the love before giving you rep


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## gamer

Mcleod15 said:


> True both are pit mixes but in the big picture is every breed a mix of some kind, and both breeds are bred differently, to fit two different standards.
> 
> American Bullies - were started in the 90's maybe a little earlier by breeding UKC APBT to AKC AmStaffs not mastiffs
> 
> Swinford Breeding program was established in the 60's by breeding game APBTs to English mastiffs or Neo Mastiffs, way before the term American Bully was even thought of
> 
> American Bandogge is regonized hybrid that mix is composed of the Am Bulldog and the Mastiff
> 
> Bandog in its self has been around for a long time, which simple means a mastiff type dog used as watch dog
> 
> The key ingredient is the mastiff blood.


Ok that makes sense but to me Am Bullys have some mastiff in there somewhere, but thanks for explaining that


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## Chinadog

Mcleod15 said:


> True both are pit mixes but in the big picture is every breed a mix of some kind, and both breeds are bred differently, to fit two different standards.
> 
> American Bullies - were started in the 90's maybe a little earlier by breeding UKC APBT to AKC AmStaffs not mastiffs
> 
> Swinford Breeding program was established in the 60's by breeding game APBTs to English mastiffs or Neo Mastiffs, way before the term American Bully was even thought of
> 
> American Bandogge is regonized hybrid that mix is composed of the Am Bulldog and the Mastiff
> 
> Bandog in its self has been around for a long time, which simple means a mastiff type dog used as watch dog
> 
> The key ingredient is the mastiff blood.


Wow very well put, very informative.


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## NinaThePitbull

*IMO*



gamer said:


> Can you explain the difference? Both are pit mixes arnt they?


wel it would be hard to answer the question being that the term bandogges is pretty vague. Yet, from the original description of Bandogge, to produce one for show would be contradictory to it's name.

*Bandog

The term Bandog (also known as Bandogge) originated around 1250-1300 in Middle England, referring to a mastiff type dog that was bound by a chain during the daytime and was released at night to guard against intruders*

.. now being that we don't live in 16 th century England and chain dogs in front of the manor to ward off bandits and such, and the fact that man's coexistence with canine has changed from primarily working dog to mostly pet, I would allow some variation in the term and meaning, yet the term *bandogge* itself is still mostly recognized as such:

*Modern breed description

Many people believe these dogs to be the perfect protection dog and working class guard dogs. Various programs have used American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, and Neapolitan Mastiff crosses. A few programs have also used other bully type breeds as well as other mastiff type breeds. Regardless of which program a breeder selected, breeding dogs for guarding purposes requires selection of dogs suitable for that work. Dogs were bred from strains that have the temperament and phenotype, to do home guardian or personal protection. The Bandog is a rugged dog, heavily boned and muscled, intimidating when seen and is ferocious when provoked. Bandogs of all types are strictly working dogs and should be a result of serious and dedicated planning, starting from careful selection of parent breeds and more importantly, appropriate representatives of those breeds, with the health and temperament testing being on the top of the list of priorities, while the uniformity in appearance is the last of the breeders' concerns. The intention in each case is to combine the courage and tenacity of an American Pit Bull Terrier with the large size and guarding instinct of a Mastiff.

The breed ideal is a broad skull, a strong muzzle that is medium to long muzzle depending on the strain, wide shoulder, a powerful chest, great agility, and overall an intelligent and very well controlled dog.*

If it is produced for show, I would imagine that the term Bandogge itself would not apply to any dog, but like I said, this is an inquiry that can not be 
confirmed, only discussed and debated. But Mcleods comment on the matter was the most informative, *primary Mastiff bred for guard duty.*

Here is a fantastic link I would like to provide once ahain, better than anything you will find on Wikipedia

http://bandogmastiffs.blogspot.com/[/URL


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## NinaThePitbull

Sampsons Dad said:


> have had good results and bad with my neo crosses.
> 
> Good- stable healthy dogs
> imposing look and presence
> stable temperments
> 
> Bad---a couple dogs had no drive
> some pups are slow to mature
> require extra obedience training


experience is the best contribution to this thread, didnt know that. would love to know more about those dogs and see some pics if you have em.


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## CINCINNATIBULLIES

so a ghenghis kahn dog would be a bandogge? it is a apbt/amstaff/presa combo bred for weight pull and pp. imo the bully is a bandogge the classic bully is not. the classic bully is the amstaff/apbt the bully being amstaff/apbt/?(ab,db,presa,cane corso,dogo,boerbel, neo). these formulas are the known formulas for each as such well by the definition of a bandogge the bull would be a bandogge unless it is the amstaff/apbt/ab combo. all these other dogs (db,presa,cane corso,dogo, boerbel, neo) are of the mastiff family.


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## NinaThePitbull

CINCINNATIBULLIES said:


> so a ghenghis kahn dog would be a bandogge? it is a apbt/amstaff/presa combo bred for weight pull and pp. imo the bully is a bandogge the classic bully is not. the classic bully is the amstaff/apbt the bully being amstaff/apbt/?(ab,db,presa,cane corso,dogo,boerbel, neo). these formulas are the known formulas for each as such well by the definition of a bandogge the bull would be a bandogge unless it is the amstaff/apbt/ab combo. all these other dogs (db,presa,cane corso,dogo, boerbel, neo) are of the mastiff family.


i would definitely describe a Genghis Khan as a bandogge,... if there is enough mastiff in there. i have never heard of it though.


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## Mcleod15

CINCINNATIBULLIES said:


> so a ghenghis kahn dog would be a bandogge? it is a apbt/amstaff/presa combo bred for weight pull and pp. imo the bully is a bandogge the classic bully is not. the classic bully is the amstaff/apbt the bully being amstaff/apbt/?(ab,db,presa,cane corso,dogo,boerbel, neo). these formulas are the known formulas for each as such well by the definition of a bandogge the bull would be a bandogge unless it is the amstaff/apbt/ab combo. all these other dogs (db,presa,cane corso,dogo, boerbel, neo) are of the mastiff family.


Bullies are not bandogges

I hear bully owners and breeders try so hard to dispell any rumors regarding crosses with mastiffs, english bulldogs, etc and your going against all that claiming that todays bullies are mastiff family mixes. Which contradicts all the information that responsible bully breeders and owners of today are trying to spread.

In conclusion
Todays bullies are mastiff mixes(which goes against what the ABKC web site states) but the bully established 15 years is a bully? Which means the bandogge is no longer a recognized hybrid but its a recognized breed intitled=>American Bully.


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## redog

Sampsons Dad said:


> have had good results and bad with my neo crosses.
> 
> Good- stable healthy dogs
> imposing look and presence
> stable temperments
> 
> Bad---a couple dogs had no drive
> some pups are slow to mature
> require extra obedience training


Angel, what were your crosses mixed with


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## NinaThePitbull

redog said:


> Angel, what were your crosses mixed with


im guessing Neopolitans with pits


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## Sampsons Dad

Chihuahuas X Neo....lol


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## NinaThePitbull

Sampsons Dad said:


> Chihuahuas X Neo....lol


hope fully the chihuahua is the male.


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## Sampsons Dad

haha imagine that!


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## redog

heres the only pic I have of bob on my laptop.


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## dixieland

redog said:


> heres the only pic I have of bob on my laptop.


Very beautiful!I love his color!


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## NinaThePitbull

*More*



redog said:


> heres the only pic I have of bob on my laptop.


wow, handsome.

i found these the other day

wow, he IS handsome ( oh i already said that , he is though)


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## dixieland

Oh I like the one at the bottom!


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## NinaThePitbull

dixieland said:


> Oh I like the one at the bottom!


i was just about to PM you and say there were more pics.... lol, I knew you had a soft spot for bandogges.

check out this handsome boy:


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## dixieland

NinaThePitbull said:


> i was just about to PM you and say there were more pics.... lol, I knew you had a soft spot for bandogges.
> 
> check out this handsome boy:


He does look good!Is that white I see creeping up on his back?


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## NinaThePitbull

doubt it, probably a shine.
here is a few more and I am done... for now


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## dixieland

NinaThePitbull said:


> doubt it, probably a shine.
> here is a few more and I am done... for now


Ohh doggy!Look at those strips on that first one!I love brindles that have fewer strips like that.
Ok I now know what my next dog will be.I've never looked into it,are these dogs too terribly expensive?


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## Sampsons Dad

dixieland said:


> Ohh doggy!Look at those strips on that first one!I love brindles that have fewer strips like that.
> Ok I now know what my next dog will be.I've never looked into it,are these dogs too terribly expensive?


It depends on the breeder.
I don't ask for much because I am working towards a goal.
Some breeders charge a lot just because they can.
However i cant see charging a butt and an elbow for a mixed breed.


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## Mcleod15

NinaThePitbull said:


>


I like the first 5 dogs, however the bottom two really don't look like bandogges to me.


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## NinaThePitbull

me neither, not enough mastiff too much bull, but i couldnt help it.


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## betty90278

interesting


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## redog

some bully kutta in there too. Man I miss cane!


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## Nizmo

cane was all about them


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## GTR

Very nice dogs. Some of them inherited some of the not-so-attractive mastiff traits, but the good ones are very nice looking. I wonder which crosses produce quality more consistently? Some of the proportions on some of them look like it would severely hinder the dog if it was an active worker, not just a yard candy scary deterrent, LOL. But the ones that inherited the right stuff from each breed are very nice indeed.

Can you get better results by using percentages? Like bandog x apbt? To refine the dog's structure a bit more? But of course, temperament is just as important, so the chances of getting that star pup are kinda slim. (Unless you know what you are doing and have already made all the mistakes enough to know better.)


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## NinaThePitbull

reddog, you never ceize to impress me, i was going to put more photos of Bully Kutas but many of them were photos showing them in bear fights or dog fights. 

GTR i would imagine it to be a very inexact science , for instance the creature with the stripes at the top of one of the other posts in this thread, im guessing you can do another breeding with the same sire and dam and still not get the same results, the best you could hope for is a litter from to healthy great temp'ed parents and your odds are better, aesthetics might differ from pup to pup, litter to litter.

IMO


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## davidfitness83

This is a hypothetical because I am not a breeder or anything like that but I would love to imagine what my brother's bulldog would produce with a good neapolitan specimen.



















Check out this Presa




























They ran a DNA test on it which I know is not accurate but they could only find 30% of its breed make up the rest was unknown it had english bulldog and boxer..


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## Rojas209

those are all real big dogs


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## NinaThePitbull

*Bulldogge Mastiff Bandogge*



davidfitness83 said:


> This is a hypothetical because I am not a breeder or anything like that but I would love to imagine what my brother's bulldog would produce with a good neapolitan specimen.
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you might get lucky and end up with this....










chances are you might get something that looks more like this,lol:
Baby, the big baby. photo - Kelly G. (the 14 yr. old) photos at pbase.com

I know your just thinking out loud, no worries. I have my own mad scientist breed mix ideas in my mind ... I would just imagine a hip and elbow nightmare with whatever comes out from the two unless they both were tested OFA great or more. ( i myself am inexperienced in these matters, so I wouldnt know)

*absolutely handsome dogs, love that BD!!!*


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## davidfitness83

That's the issue with giant breeds, you gotta treat them like babies until 3 or 4 so they develop correctly. These breeds develop very slow so you can't push them until they are done growing. Even dogs with good hips can still produce dogs with bad hips so there is always a chance but you def have a higher success rate than just backyard breeding lol


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## Sampsons Dad

I don't baby my dogs at all. If they cant cut it they aren't breeding quality.
I would NEVER let a bulldog anywhere near my neo bitches.
Bull dogs are worthless when it comes to performance.
They overheat, they are HD nightmares 70 percent of the time and they 
have skin problems (most).


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## davidfitness83

Sampsons Dad said:


> I don't baby my dogs at all. If they cant cut it they aren't breeding quality.
> I would NEVER let a bulldog anywhere near my neo bitches.
> Bull dogs are worthless when it comes to performance.
> They overheat, they are HD nightmares 70 percent of the time and they
> have skin problems (most).


The HD is there due to the breed but not all bulldogs are johnson stock with short muzzles that can't breath. My brothers bulldog is 22 inches tall probably around 80 pounds and the boy can move, he is actually very lean you can see rib and he has a nice waist tuck. He is hyper as hell and he is always on the go. He is not worked because my brother doesn't have the time but I tell you his bulldog is not a sloppy lazzy dog at all. With the right owner this dog could def accomplish some great things, he is only a pup anyway and the possibility of HD is there but as far as energy level and drive he is there. He is obviously not an APBT so I cant compere it to that but for a big boy this dog is full of energy and he has a very good temperament so far.

I would also like to add that ever since he was switched to raw at 6 months old his skin as been in excellent shape. My brother switched him from blue buffalo to kirkland and his dog got some nasty acne all over his face. After he made the switch to raw his dog went back to normal and hasn't had a problem since.


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## Sampsons Dad

This is a personal thing....but
I feed Purina foods and there is a couple 
reasons why I refuse to change to another 
type of special food.
1- is the cost obviously feeding fosters and a kennel of my own dogs can be expensive
2-it weeds out the weaklings
A dog that has food allergies is not going into my breeding program.
I don't feel that a dog with "special" needs can do any good for my breeding.
This goes for ANY breed that is here.
If a dog needs special foods...they get fixed and re-homed.
I am not hating on people with special needs dogs but I am looking for the hardest, most rustic dogs to breed here. I don't believe in making excuses for my dogs. If they aren't healthy they wont be bred here.


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## davidfitness83

Sampsons Dad said:


> This is a personal thing....but
> I feed Purina foods and there is a couple
> reasons why I refuse to change to another
> type of special food.
> 1- is the cost obviously feeding fosters and a kennel of my own dogs can be expensive
> 2-it weeds out the weaklings
> A dog that has food allergies is not going into my breeding program.
> I don't feel that a dog with "special" needs can do any good for my breeding.
> This goes for ANY breed that is here.
> If a dog needs special foods...they get fixed and re-homed.
> I am not hating on people with special needs dogs but I am looking for the hardest, most rustic dogs to breed here. I don't believe in making excuses for my dogs. If they aren't healthy they wont be bred here.


I agree with you on most points, most dogs tolerate cheap nasty purina food some won't. Others will get cancer and other diseases in their later years because of all the poor ingridients and chemicals that cheap food makers use. My brother went raw to save money, at first blue bufallo was extremely expensive and he decided to go with a less quality kibble and well he got what he paid for. If a dog needs medicine or certain specific special needs so it can be healthy is one thing, but if a dog reacts to crappy cheap food that is another thing you know what I mean? When there is a show in the area I'll convince my brother to go and maybe we'll bring Rocco along, the pictures don't do justice for the dog


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## Sampsons Dad

I dont and will never understand why people insist Purina is nasty, bad food.
Anyway, if the dog reacts to food that is a health problem I dont want that in my bloodlines.
If I feed my dogs hamburger and cornmeal they should be able to handle it.
Corn is not a poison. There is nothing wrong with corn. Anyway...that is why I have my breeding program and others have theirs.


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## Notnice

very nice read. 
So let me get this straight my Java is Amstaff/ dogo argentino does that make her Bandogge buy the loose Deff


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## Sampsons Dad

Notnice said:


> very nice read.
> So let me get this straight my Java is Amstaff/ dogo argentino does that make her Bandogge buy the loose Deff


Yes and no...lol
we call them POGO's


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## NinaThePitbull

Sampsons Dad said:


> This is a personal thing....but
> I feed Purina foods and there is a couple
> reasons why I refuse to change to another
> type of special food.
> 1- is the cost obviously feeding fosters and a kennel of my own dogs can be expensive
> 2-it weeds out the weaklings
> A dog that has food allergies is not going into my breeding program.
> I don't feel that a dog with "special" needs can do any good for my breeding.
> This goes for ANY breed that is here.
> If a dog needs special foods...they get fixed and re-homed.
> I am not hating on people with special needs dogs but I am looking for the hardest, most rustic dogs to breed here. I don't believe in making excuses for my dogs. If they aren't healthy they wont be bred here.


good points being made by you as well as fitness


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## MetalGirl30

My next door neighbor has a Bandogge...He is pit bull crossed with English Mastiff. He is huge and a big baby to boot.


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## Notnice

lol, Pogo im not calling her a Pogo


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## redog

Bob from today


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## Black Rabbit

redog said:


> Bob from today


Awwww I love big ol Bob


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## NinaThePitbull

redog said:


> Bob from today


wow... thats a dog. that is canine excellence. I never used to like brindles until i began truly appreciating canines and their variations. now im hooked, and they look so PRIMAL on Bandogs.

can you tell us more about him.
Age?
Possible breeds?
How you two crossed paths?


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## American_Pit13

Mcleod15 said:


> Bandogges and AmBullies are not the same thing. Bullies are not bandogges bred for show.


:goodpost:

Just because a dog is mixed with APBT doesn't make it a Bandogge or a Bully. Both are bred for totally different things, with different mixing in different areas.


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## American_Pit13

redog said:


> Bob from today


You don't post him enough Dave. He has sure grown into a gorgeous dog!


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## redog

NinaThePitbull said:


> wow... thats a dog. that is canine excellence. I never used to like brindles until i began truly appreciating canines and their variations. now im hooked, and they look so PRIMAL on Bandogs.
> 
> can you tell us more about him.
> Age?
> Possible breeds?
> How you two crossed paths?


Bob turned 2 this month. The rest is kind of a long story, but Ill be up for awhile! we are associated with a local shelter and were always baffled about why so many of our dogs come from a nearby town, Zion Illinois. We do a free shot clinic there and the dogs are rediculous. no doubt fought, bred and used as status symbols. My wife saw an ad for Italian bull dog pups.so I searched the phone number and found out he was on our "do not adopt" list. then found out he was under court order to never posess an animal again. So we called and went there. Crack house hell! let me tell you! Big dude brought out a box of half dead pups and I knew I had to do something, so I ended up dropping 800.00 to preserve the evidence. By 5 am the next morning, he was all packed up and moved out when ac and county sherrif showed up. We nursed them up and placed 3 but kept Bob because my daughter wanted him.
He is neo/oeb X american bull dog. I dont have pics of the mom {abd} but heres the dad and the box of pups


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## redog




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## DueceAddicTed

Man O man I just love Bob !!! I agree we need photos of him more often.


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## Mom_of_Kambo

Loyal Guard Kennels - Intro

Johnny has got some good looking dogs on his yard as well as all trained as far as I know. That's where I wanted to get a puppy from but oh well I got my love Kambo haha. Tex was trained by Johnny... ANYWAYS..BANDOGGES.. My Father-In-Law bought his from Johnny.. Lemme find a pic and I'll edit my post to add the picture.

Okay found one..Not a great one but its one. I will take some more when Nick gets home from off.


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## NinaThePitbull

...waiting on them (PICS) Mom_of_Kimbo. He's a beauty.

looked into the site, saw some great things. Vry intrigued by the Barbado Sheep they raise, I am guessing for feed purposes. Thats a great kennel right there, grow their own food... the future of organic RAW kennels, will look into that site a lot more this week, thanks for that, might have a few questions for you in the future.










*http://www.loyalguard.us/*

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## NinaThePitbull

I had to do something, so I ended up dropping 800.00 to preserve the evidence. By 5 am the next morning, he was all packed up and moved out when ac and county sherrif showed up. We nursed them up and placed 3 but kept Bob because my daughter wanted him.
He is neo/oeb X american bull dog. I dont have pics of the mom {abd} but heres the dad and the box of pups

*
....money well spent. Nice work.*


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## NinaThePitbull

I just came across this bandogge kennel and their dogs seemed pretty impressive, i am not able to download pics from the site, but i saw a few pics of their dogs and some of them are the popular photos that come up when you search "Bandogge" in google. Like the following dogs' photos that are on this thread:



















so I'm leaving the link, so you guys can see their dogs... not sure if it is allowed or not, if not , my sincerest apologies, wont happen again.

Vero Mastino di Roma


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## Mom_of_Kambo

Here is the link to his Daddy..I don't recall who Nick's dad said was the momma dog.

Loyal Guard Kennels - Ceasar


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## Mom_of_Kambo

Of all the dogs we have here...He's the only one I can't lift up into the kennel.. Bo' Jangles is his name and lemme tell ya... HE IS A BRUTE... I've been workin with him here and there on basic obedience since Willie Ray (father in law) don't quite have enough hours in the day to do it.


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## Scum Deluxe

hey everyone. I am new to the forum, and very much appreciate you guys allowing me to join this wonderful community.
The other day, my boyfriend and I walked to the "humane society" in search of a bully, and crossed paths with the most sweetest soul, contained in a 5x5 hollow cement block with a fence door. Just laying there quiet, looking at me with eyes that screamed "PLEASE, PLEASE SAVE ME, I'M TO GOOD TO BE HERE" This angel stood atleast 26" at the shoulders, with a big block head, white smooth fur with an extremely unique tiger spot. He had the softest demeanor and the biggest smile, as if he was extremely happy someone finally stuck there hand in his cage to give his body a good scratch. His name is Kapone, which is a gorgeous name for him. But unfortunately he's not available til the 19th. I promised i'd return and asked to shake on it, but his paws did not fit through the space between the gate and wall, so i asked him for a kiss and got one long lick from my chin to my forehead.>>out of space, oops


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## Scum Deluxe

<<<sorry for boring you guys, there is actually a reason i posted on this topic specifically. On "Kapone"s paper it states pitbull, but i don't know. I think he's a mix, do you guys think you could help me figure out if he's a Bandogge. Everything about him is very lengthy, his legs, body, neck. His spot is tiger, which i know is not a pattern of a pure bully. And is common is bull mastiffs. His face is of a bully, but he's very "lippy" like a mastiff also. And he's very slender. Are bull mastiffs, and APBT mixes considered bandogges, or pit bullmastiffs? Does it sound like he is mixed? I will edit post on the 19th when i adopt him. First come first serve, wish us luck guys! I want him to be apart of our family so bad. My boyfriend and i we're both attracted to his cage, when i saw him. It's like the clouds opened and shine down on him. It was beautiful. Oh and something i though was awesome, the only quiet dogs there who stayed laying down until we called them over we're those of the bully variety.


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## redog

I have one that I rescued. His name is bob and is the most amazing animal I've ever owned. Is there a pic on line of him? Im curious! Just because they labeled him as a pit bull doesn't always mean that's what he is. There is technically no way to tell for sure but if he resembles a breed, that's what they call them. You have described a bandog perfectly though.. Brindle markings (tiger like stripes) are common in this cross and the type is always impressive looking. These type are usually a combination of apbt/mastiff/ am bull dog or whatever, classification is bandogge or just a mutt. Fill out the paper work and visit him often to show the shelter your serious. Get your eggs in a row so your ready to give them the answers they want to hear so your not turned down for adoption. We have tons of info on these dogs but you need to search for it. Let one of us know if you need any help doing research. We're happy to help


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## Black Rabbit

When I hear big pit bull looking dog that's white with brindle patches and more lippy I automatically think American Bulldog.


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## Odin`s_BlueDragon

kg420 said:


> When I hear big pit bull looking dog that's white with brindle patches and more lippy I automatically think American Bulldog.


Especially that light "tigerish" brindle. I too thought American Bulldog straight away!

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## KMdogs

Lots of really bad information on this thread.. 

What is the point in crossing already established Bandogs into others? None..

The only reason you would introduce a foundation line of Mastiff to Bulldog is to bring back out whats already there.. Best example is what was done to produce Myles as Dane to Old Boar Hound to English Dogge to War Mastiff straight link one of the oldest strains gone to wash.. Use them proven Game to bring back out what is already genetically there. Only reason to cross back into.

Presas, Boers, Corso, AB,, ALL Bandogs..

Dogo is the perfect example of versatility that many will know of, traditional stock just as superior in protection as they are known for in the field.. Catch weight Bandogs that are very much Bulldog on a Mastiff weight scale.. Seen 'em first hand put any of your Tosas, Boers to shame in a hand basket. 

War Mastiffs, Catch Weight, Guardians, Pullers, Militant.. Yep all been done and all excelled.. Not just Guardians, history shows it proof in the puddin'..

Bulldogs or Bandogs till otherwise proven.

Get that AB x Neo.. Presa x Neo... Etc nonsense out of your minds, genetically not a whole not of sense nor by any other sense.

The ORIGINAL do all animal RIGHT there with the Bulldog going back to the SAME animal. Tracing back often crossing back and forth many times over throughout.


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## redog

In a lot of cases, a good dog is where you find it. This one happens to come from the shelter. It doesn't matter who bred it and why, nor how it ended up there. It's all about finding a good dog....


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