# Yawn



## bradthepit (Jul 30, 2006)

I`ve noticed a lot of "pits" appearing over here now averaging 85/90/over 100lbs.

Believe me, i don`t want to start all that pony debate again about purity and stuff, but i`m a little cheezed off with people breeding these "freak show" dogs and pasing them off as "pure" bred Pits.

A lot of UK amateur folk wouldn`t know a pit from a poodle here. For years Mayfield, Reid and Patrick have been the dominant lines with no "outside" influence. However peoples egos prefer these inferior hybrids.

These dogs are shite in a pit with the real deal. Why do these "breeders" have to play around with a already superb dog?

*Moderators, please note, if this becomes a slanging match, can you please lock this thread.*

I just want to know what`s the motive behind these imo inferior hybrids?


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

For some I think they want these big bad pitbull as a status symbol(sp?). They are bis mean dude with a dog that can kick yours type of attitude. Where those who want the traditional pitbull because for the breed will stick with the orginal lines because ABPT are loyal, determined and steadfast and that is what we want and look for.


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## littleboyblue (Feb 19, 2006)

*here we go agian*

ok i am not trying to start a debate, but I am so tired of the fact that size is the oonly factor in people saying that the dog is not pure I mean I agree that some of the lines are way out of wack but my Chico (in the ic) is Chaos.watchdog and he is 87 pounds... so I dont want to here that he is not pure...I have a game bred red male that is redboy/jeep and he is 76 pounds almost 80 what does that mean?


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

littleboyblue said:


> ok i am not trying to start a debate, but I am so tired of the fact that size is the oonly factor in people saying that the dog is not pure I mean I agree that some of the lines are way out of wack but my Chico (in the ic) is Chaos.watchdog and he is 87 pounds... so I dont want to here that he is not pure...I have a game bred red male that is redboy/jeep and he is 76 pounds almost 80 what does that mean?


I agree with you!!! He is a awesome looking dog... But so what if hes big?? That means that hes not an awesome dog?? (hes got some sexy eyes) But i think the bigger dogs are beautiful!!!! They arnt my perfernce tho, if that is what other people like, so be it.... If jenny, littleboyblueand midwest came to me and asked me if i wanted their dogs, if i could, i would GLADLY take them. i know it wouldnt happen, but as an example... they are great looking dogs, and i wouldnt care if there was chiuhaha in their blood.. i bet they all have great heart and charecter!!!!:cheers:


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## Nation (Sep 27, 2006)

"Brad is a from gamebred stock. he is according to some heavy for his age, however he doesn`t look it, because of his height and length. At 5 months he is 42lb, but now 20" at the withers. His lines all indicate gamebred. he may slow down, i don`t know, but being at 5 months only i guess he`ll keep filling out. his dad is 23" and mum 21" at the withers. Dad weighed 75lb, Mum was 60lb. She looked a little Bully, but dad was much slender, even at 75lb"


From one of your previous post so my question here is if your pit keeps going at that growth rate I guess you will fit into that category of a wannabe tough guy who bought a freakish sized pit.

Or maybe you should just show a little class and let people who enjoy a bigger size pit own one without giving them your stereotypes.

Also what makes your dog so great that others are inferior?


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Ok, i was looking over the ADBA site (the old one) and they have pics of some larger size (at least 75lbs) apbt that i'm sure have to be pure....

*These are game dogs!!*

*Hemphills Geronimo, he has to be at least 80lbs .....*
http://www.adbadog.com/p_gallary.asp?aid=1&pid=65

Tudor's Jeff, another 75-80 pounder......
http://www.adbadog.com/p_gallary.asp?aid=1&pid=162

Tudors Dibo, most would look at his face and say he's crossed, but he's not, and he's a bit on the larger side....
http://www.adbadog.com/p_gallary.asp?aid=1&pid=64

So saying because they are 70-80lbs that they aren't pure is strictly a matter of opinion. There are plenty of pure dogs over the standard (50-60lbs). 
Beside if i'm not mistaken don't the registries look more proportion than the actual weight? There are a large number of Gaff dogs that are in the 70's that are GR CH with UKC and AKC. So its really more about proportion than weight.

Now a 120lb APBT I have my doubts about.


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## bradthepit (Jul 30, 2006)

I certainly agree that some bigger Pits are defo pure bred. Obviously some could be selected from a specific lineage etc for that reason.

My point is, i don`t believe that we have had some recent imports, i believe that people are bulking them with other breeds.

You can also in some see a total y different character in them too.

I would just like to see the heritage kept. Maybe i`m a traditionalist. I don`t see anything wrong with larger Pits, as long as people don`t screw up the heritage in my opinion.

*To Nation*, i can`t ever remember saying my dog is superior. I mentioned the word "hybrid" meaning crossing them with other breeds to get the "macho" looking bulky dog.

As i said nufink against big Pits as long as the heritage/lineage is not sacrificed in doing so.

Like Otis, i ain`t gonna argue over this, as it`s pointless. Forums are for opinions. I save my aggro for the ring.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Nation said:


> "Brad is a from gamebred stock. he is according to some heavy for his age, however he doesn`t look it, because of his height and length. At 5 months he is 42lb, but now 20" at the withers. His lines all indicate gamebred. he may slow down, i don`t know, but being at 5 months only i guess he`ll keep filling out. his dad is 23" and mum 21" at the withers. Dad weighed 75lb, Mum was 60lb. She looked a little Bully, but dad was much slender, even at 75lb"
> 
> From one of your previous post so my question here is if your pit keeps going at that growth rate I guess you will fit into that category of a wannabe tough guy who bought a freakish sized pit.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that Nation!!! All the "types"are awesome!!!:cheers:

I picked this off the site that Midwest posted, Thanks for that too!!!
http://www.adbadog.com/p_gallary.asp?aid=1&pid=89
This guy i guess "made" my dogs lines.. And i have been hearing they are some kicking lines!!!!


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Yeah, Clouse is a very well known and respected dogman.


I understand what your saying Brad, and your absolutely right. If you like the bigger APBTs then selectivly breed within the breed... don't outcross.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

I really have to learn more!!!! You guys know so much!!! Good for you guys!!!


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## bradthepit (Jul 30, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> Yeah, Clouse is a very well known and respected dogman.
> 
> I understand what your saying Brad, and your absolutely right. If you like the bigger APBTs then selectivly breed within the breed... don't outcross.


Thankyou MWB, at least you read my post carefully...:thumbsup:


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Im gonna use a whole hell of alot of restraint here and just say this,of course theres been big dogs through out the apbt history,trussles dumdum was a dibo bred dog back in the 70s and 85p ds plus,a dog line bred for looks is not a pure apbt no matter what his linage since a apbt is a working dog..Dogs bred for looks are am staffs and should be registered as such...In a perfect world the lable of apbt would be something earned not just given out because of heritage..


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Ok let me give you the REAL ANSWER. 

First of all size and breed purity have nothing to do with each other. Why you get critisim on big dogs is simple. GAME dogmen are PROUD of what they have and what it stands for. There is a standard such as whats set by the ADBA guidlines. To a gameman ANYTHING outside this standard is junk and not a "true pit" because it is out of standard. It doesnt mean it is junk its just the way they see it and they are vocal about it. Of course there have been big sucessful dogs but those have been few and far between. Why? Because a gameman culls. Culling is a key to sucess with the game man. Anything that doesnt live up to their expectations gets culled. These big dogs they have no control over, they are out there but they wish they werent because they dont consider them "true pits" but the onwers go around calling them so and it irritates the living piss out of the gamedog owner. The show people dont like the game people and vice versa. Both think they own the shiznit and the others dogs suck. Its just the way it is. Its like the Marines and the Navy. Me being in the Marines believe that the Navy is simply a taxi service for the Marines and if it wasnt for the NAVY the MARINES would have to walk on water ALL THE TIME! 

Does that clear it up any?


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

:goodpost: as always OFK! upruns:


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Great post OFK...


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

Ok before looking at this link please refer to my above post. This is why you have all the ticked off people. Look at this site! IT says breeding the ULTIMATE PITBULL TERRIER. As a game man myself when I see this kinda stuff it erks even me. Call them something else but this IS NOT a pitbull. It may have the name pitbull but its not!

http://www.suarezbullskennels.com/index.htm

They may be great bully dogs or AMERICAN BULLIES but dont call them pits. That is where the issue lies.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

This is a classic case of"if you dont have any thing nice to say,dont say any thing at all"wow..a abomination in the world of working k9s.:snow: :snow: :snap: :hammer:


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Muahahahaha I'll say it!! That is gross!!! They look like monsters!!! I have nO idea what their lines are, but that is not normal!!! I can safely say that everyone on here their dogs look nothing like those freaks of nature!! Did you see the puppy at 15 weeks old!!!! That is not right And OFK, i agree totatally!!! Anyone on here that has a bigger pitbull, your dogs DONOT look like these things.... take a look at them and you will know what i mean... I feel reeeeeaaaalllllllllly sorry for that male, you notice how there is only 1 male for all those females??? i heard that you can overbreed a male to death, and the picks of the dogs locked, i dont like that at all!!!! there was blood on the floor in one of the pics!!!! My god!!!


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## Bullygirl807 (Jan 24, 2006)

I personally am a true gamedog lover. Thats all I own and will ever own. I have nothing against a blue or a show dog as I once wanted one myself until I did my research. Most blues are crossed with amstaff or other show lines and I wanted an all American Pitbull Terrior. The dog in the link that OFK posted it absolutely repulsive. Lets be honest, how healthy can it be for that dog. Conditioned or not, that is alot of weight for a dog to carry and he is not very tall either. I can list all of my personally reasons on why I do or do not prefer a show or why I prefer a gamedog. Bottom line to each its own but in my opinion and only my opinion they definitley should not be classified as a "pitbull", not an APBT anyway.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

I agree!!! I bet those dogs are bad for artiritis!!!(SP) I feel that the are kinda ugly... I dont know, they are too big and too short!!!


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

*American Bullies*

They are good examples of the American Bullies....but not APBTs!

Ewww! I've got to agree with you Pantera. 
Those last two pics of those dogs locked are bit explicit. Not something I'd want my daughter looking at.....lol:hammer:


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## smokey_joe (Oct 14, 2005)

I liked two of their females, Silver and Roxy.


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

I tought it was this type of dog that Brad was talking about from the begining. I don't think they are pitbull and should not be called pitbulls or APBT either. I'm sorry but that dog looks like he was crossed with a pig. I know it isn't nice but sometimes you have to call it like you see it. There are a lot of big pitbulls pictured on this site they are all beautiful dogs I wouldn't say that any of them are not true pitbulls just from different lines.


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## bully (May 27, 2006)

These are the dogs I was about when when I said mutt they are obvisouly crossed with something and if I had to guess I would say english bulldog.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Well, there are big dogs on here, but they are big NOT UGLY!!! Those THINGs are ugly and the way that i see it, they are producing those things for a status!!! They are massivly breeding that 1 male dog.. Im sure its not good for the dog to breed like that, i dont know, but still i would not do it!! 
For everyone one here that has the bigger awesome pittys, like Chico, Zeus, Midwest and i know of a few others, Its too bad that these idiots have DESROYED the blood lines!!! If thats what the dogs blood lines are, but they have made amockery outta the Pitbull And now great looking dogs, are being mocked because of these people that think these dogs are nice!!!EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW:stupid:


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## APBTenthusiast (Oct 31, 2006)

littleboyblue said:


> ok i am not trying to start a debate, but I am so tired of the fact that size is the oonly factor in people saying that the dog is not pure I mean I agree that some of the lines are way out of wack but my Chico (in the ic) is Chaos.watchdog and he is 87 pounds... so I dont want to here that he is not pure...I have a game bred red male that is redboy/jeep and he is 76 pounds almost 80 what does that mean?


I think the problem occurs when people PURPOSLEY breed Pit Bulls to be large and over muscular. It is one thing to get a puppy and it grow into a larger "then most" APBT, but it's another thing to purposely breed them that way. A lot of people these days are breeding for the biggest most muscular look because they think they look badass that way. It's about people being over egotistic...those same people are the ones ruining our breed.


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## OldFortKennels (Mar 10, 2006)

very well put. Good points made.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Theres no problen,imho,in breeding for a well muscled dog or a thick dog,but the dog must be in proportion,those super short dogs are not extreamly well muscled,they are more fat than any thing,and they stand about 15 inches of the ground,it actually looks like a english bulldog could run circles around those sloths....
And ya wanna see a hilarious ped,check this out,roflmao..................
http://muglestonspitbullfarm.com/males/boogie.html#Pedigree
All the pedigrees look like this.


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## APBTenthusiast (Oct 31, 2006)

cane76 said:


> Theres no problen,imho,in breeding for a well muscled dog or a thick dog,but the dog must be in proportion,those super short dogs are not extreamly well muscled,they are more fat than any thing,and they stand about 15 inches of the ground,it actually looks like a english bulldog could run circles around those sloths....
> And ya wanna see a hilarious ped,check this out,roflmao..................
> http://muglestonspitbullfarm.com/males/boogie.html#Pedigree
> All the pedigrees look like this.


Man I'd like to personally go kick those guys asses! Makes me mad to see them looking like that. Disgusting!


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

cane76 said:


> And ya wanna see a hilarious ped,check this out,roflmao..................
> http://muglestonspitbullfarm.com/males/boogie.html#Pedigree
> All the pedigrees look like this.


What are you talking about! Thats an IMPRESSIVE pedigree!! A blank name means the dog is great to be mentioned.....J/K....lmao


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

hehe....that pedigree is a baron waste land,i see tumble weeds rolling through it when i view it,hear coyotes howling,eagles soring and skreaching,i believe i saw some buzzards pecking away at the skeliton of that pedigree....:stupid:


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## bradthepit (Jul 30, 2006)

These are exactly the type of messed up breeding i`m on about!

Instead, *Nation* didn`t read my original post carefully enough. They look like a staff cross english bulldog cross pug cross a f*****g pig!

These `things` are becoming more common over here and i hate it. Just my opinion mind you...


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## Shadyw (Feb 21, 2006)

*Poor things*

I wonder how long those dog's live before they have to put them down for being crippled. They look like Cane Toads


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

I am very understandable when people say there are bigger dogs that are full blooded APBT but _this_....... *IS NOT ONE OF THEM!!*


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## bradthepit (Jul 30, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> I am very understandable when people say there are bigger dogs that are full blooded APBT but _this_....... *IS NOT ONE OF THEM!!*


What the hell is that??????

A sealion cross PIT????? lol!

Feel so sorry for the dog mind you, it didn`t have a choice!


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## wheezie (Aug 4, 2006)

after all this talk im wondering what people really think of rico hes 7 months and 80 some odd lbs, not a typical APBT


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

bradthepit said:


> These are exactly the type of messed up breeding i`m on about!
> 
> Instead, *Nation* didn`t read my original post carefully enough. They look like a staff cross english bulldog cross pug cross a f*****g pig!
> 
> These `things` are becoming more common over here and i hate it. Just my opinion mind you...


when i first saw that suarez kennel i honestly was thinking,"i see some kind of toy breed in there"they looked very soft in the face,really like some pug was through in there,i think your right geezer,theres some pug in those dogs,if not possably some french bulldog or boston terrier,or some barchycephilic toy breed with short hair,those dogs are smaller than english bulldogs,very strange..


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> I am very understandable when people say there are bigger dogs that are full blooded APBT but _this_....... *IS NOT ONE OF THEM!!*


o.k,
lobo,i got a soft spot for that dog  hes a real cool american bully 
By the way you see the adds on there,it says you want your dogs to look like these,by these super k9 supplements,lol...ya right..


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

cane76 said:


> o.k,
> lobo,i got a soft spot for that dog  hes a real cool american bully
> By the way you see the adds on there,it says you want your dogs to look like these,by these super k9 supplements,lol...ya right..


YES!! Lobo is an awsome looking _American Bully_....lol


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Hahahahaah Sea lion!!! hahahaha
Ok so now i need to know what a American bully is and what lines does the breed include?? Or is it EVEN a breed?? I have NEVER heard of it before, HELP??:hammer:


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

The RE bloodline is basicly the American Bullies. The creator of this line founded the breed. Its all kina new to me, but i'm learning more everyday.

I'm a member of the EE (Elite Edge) board that Dave Wilson, the creator of RE made, and I have been told that the base of the breed is APBT, but with more Staffie and OEB thrown in to get the big bone, body and head and more of a bully face. He first started 15 years ago and finally got it established as a breed.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Awwwwwwww Ok i see!!! Cool!!!


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Yeah I joined that board too. Havent been on there yet though! lol


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## Shadyw (Feb 21, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> The RE bloodline is basicly the American Bullies. The creator of this line founded the breed. Its all kina new to me, but i'm learning more everyday.
> 
> I'm a member of the EE (Elite Edge) board that Dave Wilson, the creator of RE made, and I have been told that the base of the breed is APBT, but with more Staffie and OEB thrown in to get the big bone, body and head and more of a bully face. He first started 15 years ago and finally got it established as a breed.


I don't mind him starting up his own breed, but did he register & sell those OEB/APBT mixes as purebred RE APBT during his creating? That is the question of some concerned RE dog owners and other APBT owners.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Shadyw said:


> I don't mind him starting up his own breed, but did he register & sell those OEB/APBT mixes as purebred RE APBT during his creating? That is the question of some concerned RE dog owners and other APBT owners.


Of course he sold the dogs as pure blooded,thats were all the controversy lies,the thing is razors edge isnt the only guilty party here,this cross breeding has went across the board with in the last 10 to 15 years,and alot of these strains are crossed together.David wilson should not be comended for registering cross breed apbt/bulldogs for 10 years plus and registering them as pure imho..The thing is,are only razors edge dogs gonna be registered as american bullys,or will other similar bloodlines also be labled as american bullys,im not sure they will...


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Here yah go Cane, this is from the ABKC site. I'll post the link too. Check out the standard.... sounds kinda like a similar breed standard to me...lol

What other dogs can be registered with The ABKC?
We currently accept the following breeds:
Olde Bulldogs
English Bulldogs
Alapaha Bulldogs
American Bulldogs
Hermes Bulldogs
American Bandogs
American Bully

Heres the link to the site.... http://www.theabkc.com/

They sre still getting everything together so there isn't a whole lot to it yet.


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

American bandogs?
Oh boy,i hope they dont start registering them,i think itll be bad for the bandog..
Have you got your registration papers yet?and are you gonna show hemi?
thanx...


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

I have sent in the registration form and recieved the conformation letter of acceptance so i'm just waiting on the papers. 
I'll try out the show light with him and see how he does, he always wants to play so much it hard to get him to be serious about anything think he would show well as an American Bully, it would be something fun to do with him, but I plan on doing more weight with him tho.


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## APBTenthusiast (Oct 31, 2006)

They all look pretty much the same 

How do they differ from our American Pit Bull Terrier? I mean, obviously if an average Joe were to see one of these dogs, it would be an automatic accusation of them being a "Pit Bull". Does the breeding of these dogs consist of pretty much the same breeds in the beginning?


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

What the hell is a banddog??? Thats a new one!!!! :O


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> I have sent in the registration form and recieved the conformation letter of acceptance so i'm just waiting on the papers.
> Showing would be something fun to do with him, but I plan on doing more weight with him tho.


Why do you have to do that tho midwest?? Is your dog a American bully....


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

roflmao!>>>


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

He is 'PR' UKC reg as APBT, since he is RE I'm also going to reg him as an American Bully.

Here is a site about Bandogges....
http://molosserdogs.com/modules.php?name=Encyclopedia&op=content&tid=935


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

yep,i moderated the bandogge forum on molosserdogs,as well as boxer,bullybreeds,alapaha blue blood bulldogs,hmmm,what else,i think thats it.
but i quit the site last week,i moderated there for a year and theres alot of info there but to many people with duel accounts and alter egos,to many internet dogmen and to many arguements for me so i deactivated my account.The fool who wrote alot of those molosser profiles is throwing alot of his personal opinion in there along with actual fact..


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> He is 'PR' UKC reg as APBT, since he is RE I'm also going to reg him as an American Bully.
> 
> Here is a site about Bandogges....
> http://molosserdogs.com/modules.php?name=Encyclopedia&op=content&tid=935


its my belief that if the abkc starts registerying bandogs,it will be this type,and itll ruin there reputation as working dogs,then theyll just be known as dogs bred to be the biggest widest dogs around that show the most muscle.http://www.buffdogs.com/wst_page16.html


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## Midwest Bully (May 10, 2006)

Redbull is a f***'n BEAST


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## cane76 (Aug 16, 2006)

yeah,
hes big, but a bandoog is a functional dog,he is terrably muscle bound,these folks dont work there dogs either,a serious nono in the bandogge world.


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## pantera2006 (Feb 25, 2006)

Hmmmmm ok i see now, kindaoke:


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## Shadyw (Feb 21, 2006)

Holy crap, those American Bandoggs are humongous beasts. Wow!!!


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## MY MIKADO (Apr 7, 2006)

Wheezie Rico is a good looking pitbull. He is very perpotionate unlike some of those dogs. I think Rico is a wonderful example of a pitbull.


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## TashasLegend (Jun 7, 2006)

Midwest Bully said:


> Redbull is a f***'n BEAST


Thats what I said!!!! I like Matty too!


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## ericschevy (Nov 10, 2006)

how do you attatch those web site links????


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