# Springpole DANGERS



## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

I just had an engineer design the perfect spring pole for my conditioning program. Over the weekend I spoke with several reliable APBT sources who have years in the game and I was told that the spring pole can cause nerve damage to teeth and it can actually cause dogs to lose teeth. They did not recommend it over time and I even spoke to a guy who had a dog who had lost teeth working the pole over time. I am going to speak to a few vets this week for confirmation. However, it does not look good for my new toy. I want my dog to look good and have some fun but it isn't worth his bite or his conformation. I was also told that acl problems can occur from prolonged use of the pole. I would like to hear from people who have used this tools for years day in and day out and maybe from some who have older dogs with teeth that are still in tact.
Thanks
Clay


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

My 2 year olds from my last litter have used their spring pole from 8 weeks old and we have yet to have an issue.


To add they play hard


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## MISSAPBT (May 10, 2009)

Key to the SP is to make sure the dogs back feet can touch the ground. I've had no problems or teeth move, put if a dog was to hang on the SP for a long period of time raised off the ground I can see how some problems can arise. Also having that dog off ground level brings the risk of that dog falling and breaking its neck, just like Honeybunch


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

Yes I guess that would make a big difference. Aww is that how Honeybunch went down 
Mine is low as stated above and my dogs do not hang they play "tug o' war".


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## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

Even if the feet are on the ground, the dog is just using them to steady himself and the majority of the weight is still being held up by their necks/mouths so the teeth have a lot of pressure put on them. Thanks for the feedback. I will keep up my reading.


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## tribulliez91 (Oct 6, 2010)

Can anyone post a link to the honeybunch story or type it up plz wud like to knoe more bout the dog and owner


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## American_Pit13 (Apr 23, 2007)

tribulliez91 said:


> Can anyone post a link to the honeybunch story or type it up plz wud like to knoe more bout the dog and owner


If you would like to know about HoneyBunch make a thread for it this thread is about springpoles.


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

Committed2excellence said:


> Even if the feet are on the ground, the dog is just using them to steady himself and the majority of the weight is still being held up by their necks/mouths so the teeth have a lot of pressure put on them. Thanks for the feedback. I will keep up my reading.


This is why I do not use a spring pole! Good thread! Teeth can die from nerve damage and we see it a lot in dog sports like Schutzhund. Hitting the sleeve over time can damage teeth, I had two of my dogs kill canine teeth like that. Kaos killed both his canines but they never had to come out before he passed away, Trinity killed one of hers and it may have to come out later on. When a tooth dies it turns black but can still remain in place but most the time it causes problems and has to come out. That is why you see some Sch dogs and police dogs with titanium teeth, they have to be replaced. I can see how a spring pole can cause worse or more damage over time.

A flirt pole is a great to work a dog out but again you have to have brains to use it. Do not let your dog fly through the air because they can hurt themselves when they land, also do not turn really sharp or you could tear a ligament over time. Tread mills are also a great work out.


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## Eric (Oct 21, 2010)

performanceknls said:


> This is why I do not use a spring pole! Good thread! Teeth can die from nerve damage and we see it a lot in dog sports like Schutzhund. Hitting the sleeve over time can damage teeth, I had two of my dogs kill canine teeth like that. Kaos killed both his canines but they never had to come out before he passed away, Trinity killed one of hers and it may have to come out later on. When a tooth dies it turns black but can still remain in place but most the time it causes problems and has to come out. That is why you see some Sch dogs and police dogs with titanium teeth, they have to be replaced. I can see how a spring pole can cause worse or more damage over time.
> 
> A flirt pole is a great to work a dog out but again you have to have brains to use it. Do not let your dog fly through the air because they can hurt themselves when they land, also do not turn really sharp or you could tear a ligament over time. Tread mills are also a great work out.


:goodpost:

I have never heard about teeth being damaged from springpole work, so thanks for the thread as well. I really limit the amount I have my boy play on it myself, maybe once or twice a week.

Also PK, would the material used as bait be a factor as well? For the longest time I used a couple types of rope, but the swallowed threads were either coughed up in the night or passed through in stringy poop lol. Now I'm actually using the pant legs from my old Dickies work pants. Would the softer material help a bit? I know you got knowledge upon knowledge 

Edit - I don't know if anyone got a visual of some hyped up Sch and K9 dogs with titanium teeth, but I would have a panic attack if one them chased at me like a 4 legged James Bond villain lol


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## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

@Eric, I have caught some dogs with the titanium teeth. No difference really. I have also seen handlers down on their knees looking for the teeth on the training field. Only military dogs sharpen up the teeth to my knowledge. The nerve damage aspect is scary and what I heard about this weekend. By the way, I like that signature. I know a little something about knees and elbows myself


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## Eric (Oct 21, 2010)

I think its just the thought of it then I guess haha.

You do? Awesome!! You've trained muay thai a bit? I've been doing it since 06 and have been fighting since 08, 14-2 record right now :thumbsup:


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## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

Yeah. I have been at it for a while. If you look at my pics in the general section you will see that I have a brace on. Originally a torn acl that I suffered in a match. Was in Thailand training last summer. Great time


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## Eric (Oct 21, 2010)

Ouch! Good luck with the healing and rehab! Hope you comeback 100%! Whereabouts in Thailand were you training?

I was there in 09 and 10 for the IFMA World Championships. Its the biggest amateur muay thai competition in the world, usually 120 countries and 1,900 fighters. I was the 3rd american ever to win gold in 09 and I lost in the quarter finals in 10 to the silver medalist.

Trained at Fairtex in Bang Phli outside of Bangkok both times


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## performanceknls (Apr 4, 2009)

I think a softer item like leather or canvas/denim is a better choice. JMO I till think they can hurt themselves I would keep it lower where the front feet can touch or almost touch but again JMO.

Here is a picture of a patrol dog that had to have his teeth fixed. He was an import from Germany.


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## Eric (Oct 21, 2010)

Wow, thats crazy! Thanks for sharing the pic 

And yes, I believe the legs from my old pairs of work pants and old jeans will work better than the ropes. I still have a couple old pairs left, so I should be good for a while 

Thanks for the advice!


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

I personally like them to keep all four feet on the ground... I use a bungie with a hide, I can attach it to a solid stable object and then let them tug it... I have a video somewhere that I'll posted... I am also very careful with how much work the do because of teeth issues... I don't let pups do it until they are much older, they get flirt pole fun instead.


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## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

Ok. A video would be appreciated. The use of the bungee sounds similar to what I use to train the grip during my bitework.


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

YouTube - Jewels


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

Another one... These videos were from about 2 years ago... This was just before the Cleburne, TX show where Jewels made GR CH, taking the CH of CH cup in a split class going up against GR CH 4 Bronson..lol Yes, I cried when I was handed that cup.


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## Committed2excellence (May 3, 2011)

Can't see it. Can you repost please


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

I didn't embed the video, I just posted a link... let me try it again..lol


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## LadyRampage (Apr 11, 2009)

Nope, I'm not smart enough to figure out how to do it..lmao


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